Civil Bear said:

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Dduster said:

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The Bears do not have enough talent to be competitive in the Pac 12. Phil Jackson could be the coach and 10th thru 12th will be the end result. You cannot tell the difference between 'walk-ons' and wasted scholarships.

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If Phil Jackson was the coach we wouldn't have the current talent deficit.

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Jackson realized that NBA success was way more about talent than coaching and I recall him saying he'd never take on a team that needed a complete rebuild.

Dduster said:

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The Bears do not have enough talent to be competitive in the Pac 12. Phil Jackson could be the coach and 10th thru 12th will be the end result. You cannot tell the difference between 'walk-ons' and wasted scholarships.

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You're this close...

We only lost to the #86 team in the country in a must win game by seven points. What is not to like? We were also the underdog in this game, but our coach was shocked we lost!

HearstMining said:

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I was disappointed in Fox's terse comments in the post-game. Even if he had no specifics, he could have said something about improvement next year. I don't buy that he was in shock over the loss, they were behind the whole game. As a fan or a player, I don't want to hear, "We didn't play well, so we're going home." without some general statement about how we're going to improve. Cal basketball is in a deep hole and he should use every opportunity to show a ray of hope.

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I would rather that he not lie to me. Remember how this freshmen class was going to turn things around? Other than a surprising influx of talent in the spring next season will be worse than this season.

sluggo said:

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HearstMining said:

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I was disappointed in Fox's terse comments in the post-game. Even if he had no specifics, he could have said something about improvement next year. I don't buy that he was in shock over the loss, they were behind the whole game. As a fan or a player, I don't want to hear, "We didn't play well, so we're going home." without some general statement about how we're going to improve. Cal basketball is in a deep hole and he should use every opportunity to show a ray of hope.

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I would rather that he not lie to me. Remember how this freshmen class was going to turn things around? Other than a surprising influx of talent in the spring next season will be worse than this season.

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Knowing that we lose Shepard and Grant, and assuming Andre leaves as well, even a surprising influx of talent may not be enough to make us better than we were this year. It would really take a Jaylen Brown/Ivan Rabb level of talent infusion to not only fill the talent drain but actually improve it over this year .

I'd settle for Charlie Moore and Justin Cobbs.

CalLifer said:

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sluggo said:

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HearstMining said:

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I was disappointed in Fox's terse comments in the post-game. Even if he had no specifics, he could have said something about improvement next year. I don't buy that he was in shock over the loss, they were behind the whole game. As a fan or a player, I don't want to hear, "We didn't play well, so we're going home." without some general statement about how we're going to improve. Cal basketball is in a deep hole and he should use every opportunity to show a ray of hope.

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I would rather that he not lie to me. Remember how this freshmen class was going to turn things around? Other than a surprising influx of talent in the spring next season will be worse than this season.

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Knowing that we lose Shepard and Grant, and assuming Andre leaves as well, even a surprising influx of talent may not be enough to make us better than we were this year. It would really take a Jaylen Brown/Ivan Rabb level of talent infusion to not only fill the talent drain but actually improve it over this year .

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Cal needs a number 1 and number 2 scorer so that the returnees can take their lesser roles. One of those players has to be able handle the ball, and one has to be a deadeye shooter. While that seems unlikely, with unlimited transferring it is not zero. Veteran transfers could be as good as those two were as freshmen.

CalLifer said:

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sluggo said:

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CalLifer said:

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sluggo said:

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HearstMining said:

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I was disappointed in Fox's terse comments in the post-game. Even if he had no specifics, he could have said something about improvement next year. I don't buy that he was in shock over the loss, they were behind the whole game. As a fan or a player, I don't want to hear, "We didn't play well, so we're going home." without some general statement about how we're going to improve. Cal basketball is in a deep hole and he should use every opportunity to show a ray of hope.

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I would rather that he not lie to me. Remember how this freshmen class was going to turn things around? Other than a surprising influx of talent in the spring next season will be worse than this season.

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Knowing that we lose Shepard and Grant, and assuming Andre leaves as well, even a surprising influx of talent may not be enough to make us better than we were this year. It would really take a Jaylen Brown/Ivan Rabb level of talent infusion to not only fill the talent drain but actually improve it over this year .

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Cal needs a number 1 and number 2 scorer so that the returnees can take their lesser roles. One of those players has to be able handle the ball, and one has to be a deadeye shooter. While that seems unlikely, with unlimited transferring it is not zero. Veteran transfers could be as good as those two were as freshmen.

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I guess to me, based on Fox's history and the utter dumpster fire that the program is, bringing in the two players you describe (both from a scholarship availability perspective as well as from a recruiting perspective) would be so unlikely it would rival Cal signing two 5 star recruits. It is possible, but with Mark Fox at the helm, i'd give myself better odds of winning the lottery.

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While I agree it is very unlikely, to transfers like Shepherd he can offer all you can eat. And Cal is a very attractive place.

HearstMining said:

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Civil Bear said:

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Dduster said:

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The Bears do not have enough talent to be competitive in the Pac 12. Phil Jackson could be the coach and 10th thru 12th will be the end result. You cannot tell the difference between 'walk-ons' and wasted scholarships.

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If Phil Jackson was the coach we wouldn't have the current talent deficit.

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Jackson realized that NBA success was way more about talent than coaching and I recall him saying he'd never take on a team that needed a complete rebuild.

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Kyle Smith took that on.

Before our last 3 games a few posters were offering some support for Fox but I haven't noticed any of that recently. If anyone is willing to keep Fox another year or two please state your case.

PtownBear1 said:

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If someone kicks off the online petition I bet we could garner enough signatures to where local media picks up on it. Worth a try…

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An on-line petition is good. I will sign and share. I also think taking the time to write a personal letter on real stationary, hand addressed and stamped might get a look. I must search for his actual address.
I labor under the illusion that I have some power.

bipolarbear said:

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PtownBear1 said:

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If someone kicks off the online petition I bet we could garner enough signatures to where local media picks up on it. Worth a try…

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An on-line petition is good. I will sign and share. I also think taking the time to write a personal letter on real stationary, hand addressed and stamped might get a look. I must search for his actual address.
I labor under the illusion that I have some power.

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I don't think we have enough fans left willing to spend the one second to sign a piece of paper for this dumpster fire of a program. We'd get maybe 10 signatures from the very small group of people who bothered to post anything in the game thread.

Our discussions should put Fox aside - we know he isn't the right fit And nothing will change. How do we get Knowlton and Christ onto this petition?

stu said:

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Before our last 3 games a few posters were offering some support for Fox but I haven't noticed any of that recently. If anyone is willing to keep Fox another year or two please state your case.

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Well stu, I was more or less one of those posters. I have expressed how I have G'town along with Cal as my teams----both horribly unsuccessful; definitely losers this year. The Hoyas much worse than Cal with better players in my opinion.

So because of that I see players and schemes coached up during the year at Cal with less talent. Not so at Georgetown. Ewing has done a horrible job and should be fired or somehow let go immediately. He is held together by his playing days at G'town and the Thompson culture in DC.

Now that by comparison, does not mean I would be for keeping Fox. Definitely not. He cannot and does not recruit. The roster situation is a mess with little on the plate to give hope for years to come. I would love any of the three top mentions at Cal, maybe Dennis Gates #1. But that does not mean Fox cannot and did not coach up a marginally talented team by comparison to the Pac12? No, he did a good job with what he had, but he does not and cannot recruit by his history.

I guess the best way to say it, if Fox is again the coach next year, I do not see that team doing as well as this years team. I see that as a good reason why not to keep Fox. We lose most of our scoring talent and have not come close to replacing it. Simple answer; look for help in coaching/recruiting

sluggo said:

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HearstMining said:

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I was disappointed in Fox's terse comments in the post-game. Even if he had no specifics, he could have said something about improvement next year. I don't buy that he was in shock over the loss, they were behind the whole game. As a fan or a player, I don't want to hear, "We didn't play well, so we're going home." without some general statement about how we're going to improve. Cal basketball is in a deep hole and he should use every opportunity to show a ray of hope.

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I would rather that he not lie to me. Remember how this freshmen class was going to turn things around? Other than a surprising influx of talent in the spring next season will be worse than this season.

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I agree - I don't want to hear a bunch of pie-in-the-sky BS. What I want to hear is that he sees some changes make this team better because if that's not true, then he's just taking a paycheck. Saying, "We suck" is not leadership. Saying "We suck and here's a path forward" is leadership and saying just a sentence or two about that at the post-game would have been constructive. My fear is that he's not going to change anything. His players will go through the same offseason training as last year. They'll run the same defense and offense (did this team even have an inbounds play?). He'll just coach "harder" and expect players to play "harder" and as you say, the result will be the same or worse.