Will Cal ever be good at basketball again? I went to Berkeley to find the answer. Here’s my report for ⁦@TheAthleticCBB⁩ https://t.co/FNFQhILTZF

— Seth Davis (@SethDavisHoops) November 1, 2022

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Portal madness has overtaken the sport, but Fox believes his best strategy is to recruit high school players and develop them year by year. He has proven in his previous stops to be an effective developer of talent, but that method takes time, and he does not have much of that. Fortunately for him, Christ understands that it's unfair for a school to give a coach subpar facilities and make it harder for him to bring in transfers, and then send him packing for not winning enough. "I often feel that coaches get fired too quickly," she says. "There are lots of things that go into being a coach in addition to winning and losing."

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philbert said:

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Is this right? I thought it was one year? Ugh.

There is not much reason to believe things will be substantially better this winter. Fox lost his top three scorers, and his three-man recruiting class (two freshmen and an undergraduate transfer) is ranked 11th in the league by 247Sports. His original five-year, $8.25 million contract was extended by two years in March 2021, but Fox, 53, understands full well the public impression as to where he stands. "I don't feel like this is a make-or-break season," he says. "But I'm fine if other people feel that way. It comes with the territory."

Maybe someone can do a public records request for Fox's contract....

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eastcoastcal said:

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Portal madness has overtaken the sport, but Fox believes his best strategy is to recruit high school players and develop them year by year. He has proven in his previous stops to be an effective developer of talent, but that method takes time, and he does not have much of that. Fortunately for him, Christ understands that it's unfair for a school to give a coach subpar facilities and make it harder for him to bring in transfers, and then send him packing for not winning enough. "I often feel that coaches get fired too quickly," she says. "There are lots of things that go into being a coach in addition to winning and losing."

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eastcoastcal said:

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Portal madness has overtaken the sport, but Fox believes his best strategy is to recruit high school players and develop them year by year. He has proven in his previous stops to be an effective developer of talent, but that method takes time, and he does not have much of that. Fortunately for him, Christ understands that it's unfair for a school to give a coach subpar facilities and make it harder for him to bring in transfers, and then send him packing for not winning enough. "I often feel that coaches get fired too quickly," she says. "There are lots of things that go into being a coach in addition to winning and losing."

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socaltownie said:

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Reading between the lines they believe they will do just fine with the capital campaign regardless of revenue sports performance.

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BearSD said:

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socaltownie said:

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Reading between the lines they believe they will do just fine with the capital campaign regardless of revenue sports performance.

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It's likely they will do just fine in that regard.

What is "missing" here is boosters who open their wallets wide for football and basketball. That's what the basketball bluebloods and the football kings have. Teams that pay their head coaches $10 million/year, or change head coaches as often as they change socks and pay eight-figure buyouts to every coach they fire? That money is booster money and not university funds.

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BearSD said:

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socaltownie said:

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Reading between the lines they believe they will do just fine with the capital campaign regardless of revenue sports performance.

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It's likely they will do just fine in that regard.

What is "missing" here is boosters who open their wallets wide for football and basketball. That's what the basketball bluebloods and the football kings have. Teams that pay their head coaches $10 million/year, or change head coaches as often as they change socks and pay eight-figure buyouts to every coach they fire? That money is booster money and not university funds.

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socaltownie said:

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BearSD said:

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socaltownie said:

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Reading between the lines they believe they will do just fine with the capital campaign regardless of revenue sports performance.

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It's likely they will do just fine in that regard.

What is "missing" here is boosters who open their wallets wide for football and basketball. That's what the basketball bluebloods and the football kings have. Teams that pay their head coaches $10 million/year, or change head coaches as often as they change socks and pay eight-figure buyouts to every coach they fire? That money is booster money and not university funds.

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I would LOVE to better understand the University's development profile. I am not at all convinced that students who attended during a time of ****ty football/basketball become great donors - at least in the modern age (aka after 1990)

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BearSD said:

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socaltownie said:

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BearSD said:

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socaltownie said:

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Reading between the lines they believe they will do just fine with the capital campaign regardless of revenue sports performance.

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It's likely they will do just fine in that regard.

What is "missing" here is boosters who open their wallets wide for football and basketball. That's what the basketball bluebloods and the football kings have. Teams that pay their head coaches $10 million/year, or change head coaches as often as they change socks and pay eight-figure buyouts to every coach they fire? That money is booster money and not university funds.

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I would LOVE to better understand the University's development profile. I am not at all convinced that students who attended during a time of ****ty football/basketball become great donors - at least in the modern age (aka after 1990)

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My guess is that you would not like the answer, that the big donors to UC Berkeley campus-wide or department-specific campaigns are looking at things like being a top 10 university worldwide and having well over 100 Nobel laureates associated with the university. In other words, a big donor profile that is more like that of Harvard or Yale and not like that of Auburn or USC.

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CalLifer said:

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First:

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Tasked with hiring the school's fourth basketball coach in seven years, Knowlton was encouraged by some alumni to consider then-Gonzaga assistant Tommy Lloyd, who was the nation's foremost international recruiter. Having just fired a coach who had no previous head coaching experience, Knowlton opted to go with Fox instead.

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Are you kidding me?

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BeachedBear said:

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CalLifer said:

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First:

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Tasked with hiring the school's fourth basketball coach in seven years, Knowlton was encouraged by some alumni to consider then-Gonzaga assistant Tommy Lloyd, who was the nation's foremost international recruiter. Having just fired a coach who had no previous head coaching experience, Knowlton opted to go with Fox instead.

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Are you kidding me?

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There has got to be LOTS of context left out of that Tommy Lloyd comment. I provided a list of over 60 possible candidates last year and intentionally left Lloyd off that list. His name has come up often over the last few years, and was common knowledge (except to Knowlton and his advisor) that Lloyd was near unattainable. He had a contractual clause stating he was Mark Few's successor at Gonzaga. He was only going to leave for VERY VERY FEW opportunities. I believe his Arizona clause includes an out for him to take over Gonzaga, when Few retires.

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CalLifer said:

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philbert said:

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I'm sure Knowlton just listened to the search firm pushing their preferred candidate/client.

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I agree. But the whole insertion of Tommy Lloyd into the discussion is just such an awful look. Either Knowlton is implying he preferred Fox over Lloyd, or he is so clueless as to not realize that Lloyd was ungettable and not push back. I'm 100% sure that at the time of the hire he had absolutely no clue who Lloyd was and even if donors suggested him, did absolutely no due diligence to learn more.

It seems like every single thing we learn about Knowlton just makes him look more and more incompetent and out of his depth. I wish there was some one who would go on the record and in-depth about what they like about Knowlton so much that they are happy to sacrifice even bare minimum levels of competence at some of the most important functions of his job.

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CalLifer said:

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It seems like every single thing we learn about Knowlton just makes him look more and more incompetent and out of his depth. I wish there was some one who would go on the record and in-depth about what they like about Knowlton so much that they are happy to sacrifice even bare minimum levels of competence at some of the most important functions of his job.

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PaulCali said:

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CalLifer said:

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It seems like every single thing we learn about Knowlton just makes him look more and more incompetent and out of his depth. I wish there was some one who would go on the record and in-depth about what they like about Knowlton so much that they are happy to sacrifice even bare minimum levels of competence at some of the most important functions of his job.

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Ask Chancellor Christ.

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Asked whether she believes that big-time sports should serve as a "front porch" to the university, Christ throws a sharp elbow, literary-style.

"So I'm going to change your metaphor," she says. "We really have a wraparound porch. We have 30 sports, and it's extraordinarily important to me that our athletes, and there are over 900 of them, have opportunities to compete at the highest level. Last year we had three national championships, in men's water polo, men's swimming and diving, and men's crew. I understand that football and basketball are revenue sports, but I don't see them as the sole measure of athletic success."

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For fans and alums who want to see the football and basketball teams win again, it is refreshing to see a chancellor working so diligently with her athletic director to produce better outcomes. But let's not get anything twisted. People from the outside love to knock Cal for letting the academic folks make all the big decisions, but around these parts, that is a point of golden pride. "Yes, the faculty run the place," Christ says. "That's why Berkeley is Berkeley."

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Fortunately for him, Christ understands that it's unfair for a school to give a coach subpar facilities and make it harder for him to bring in transfers, and then send him packing for not winning enough. "I often feel that coaches get fired too quickly," she says. "There are lots of things that go into being a coach in addition to winning and losing."

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concernedparent said:

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BeachedBear said:

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CalLifer said:

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philbert said:

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I'm sure Knowlton just listened to the search firm pushing their preferred candidate/client.

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I agree. But the whole insertion of Tommy Lloyd into the discussion is just such an awful look. Either Knowlton is implying he preferred Fox over Lloyd, or he is so clueless as to not realize that Lloyd was ungettable and not push back. I'm 100% sure that at the time of the hire he had absolutely no clue who Lloyd was and even if donors suggested him, did absolutely no due diligence to learn more.

It seems like every single thing we learn about Knowlton just makes him look more and more incompetent and out of his depth. I wish there was some one who would go on the record and in-depth about what they like about Knowlton so much that they are happy to sacrifice even bare minimum levels of competence at some of the most important functions of his job.

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Agreed, Having met JK, I feel he is competent in many administrative ways that suit his role, but on the other hand is incompetent (I like 'out of his depth') when it comes to some of the big items around revenue sports in the P5. I think he would be much more successful at a school in a smaller conference.

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Okay, but he pretty much couldn't have handled the McKeever situation worse, and bungled the hiring of the WBB coach. So he can't identify good revenue or non-revenue sports coach candidates, fails to support the coaches we do have ("who's fighting for us"), is wholly incompetent at crisis management, and is presiding over the freefall of a debt-saddled athletic department about to be left behind in the age of NIL. We can't even compete across the board in sports no one cares about; remember when we used finish top 10 in the Director's Cup every year? Again, what is he good for?

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concernedparent said:

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Okay, but he pretty much couldn't have handled the McKeever situation worse, and bungled the hiring of the WBB coach.

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stu said:

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concernedparent said:

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Okay, but he pretty much couldn't have handled the McKeever situation worse, and bungled the hiring of the WBB coach.

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I'm no fan of Knowlton but I don't know who would have been a better hire for WBB HC. The previous coach left one very good senior, three backup seniors, one backup junior, no sophs, and two walk-ons. Not a situation to attract a big-name coach. Three years on Charmin Smith has built from scratch a team with respectable talent, experience, depth, and cohesion. IMHO the MBB coach started with more, achieved less, and is heading in the opposite direction.

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