calumnus said:

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I am against running off any players. They are Cal Bears. No issue with them being recruited over, however, which is what should happen. They also do not have to be given a 5th year and should be encouraged to grad transfer.

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eastcoastcal said:

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Genuine question. Applies to both staff as well as players.

Now I understand this isn't an NBA roster and we've offered scholarships to the players and they are by no means obligated to leave. I mean this more from the standpoint of which players are worth actively trying to retain versus encouraging them to graduate/portal due to a likely lack of playing time available for them when the next coach arrives. Let's be honest, many of our players aren't Pac-caliber, and the best thing for the program will be to open up as many scholly spots as possible. This means encouraging those who've completed their degrees or are interested in maintaining substantial playing time to transfer or graduate. Who on the team right now is a pac-12 caliber player worth retaining for the next coach?

Secondly, who on the staff is worth retaining (if any)? I assume the next coach will largely clean house but any insights or thoughts?

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calumnus said:

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I am against running off any players. They are Cal Bears. No issue with them being recruited over, however, which is what should happen. They also do not have to be given a 5th year and should be encouraged to grad transfer.

Andrew Francis appears to be a good coach. He should be made interim ASAP.

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parentswerebears said:

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Who is the third incoming freshman? Brown, Curtis and…. Did I miss someone?

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BC Calfan said:

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Grant Newell and Rodney Brown.

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eastcoastcal said:

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Genuine question. Applies to both staff as well as players.

Now I understand this isn't an NBA roster and we've offered scholarships to the players and they are by no means obligated to leave. I mean this more from the standpoint of which players are worth actively trying to retain versus encouraging them to graduate/portal due to a likely lack of playing time available for them when the next coach arrives. Let's be honest, many of our players aren't Pac-caliber, and the best thing for the program will be to open up as many scholly spots as possible. This means encouraging those who've completed their degrees or are interested in maintaining substantial playing time to transfer or graduate. Who on the team right now is a pac-12 caliber player worth retaining for the next coach?

Secondly, who on the staff is worth retaining (if any)? I assume the next coach will largely clean house but any insights or thoughts?

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HearstMining said:

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eastcoastcal said:

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Genuine question. Applies to both staff as well as players.

Now I understand this isn't an NBA roster and we've offered scholarships to the players and they are by no means obligated to leave. I mean this more from the standpoint of which players are worth actively trying to retain versus encouraging them to graduate/portal due to a likely lack of playing time available for them when the next coach arrives. Let's be honest, many of our players aren't Pac-caliber, and the best thing for the program will be to open up as many scholly spots as possible. This means encouraging those who've completed their degrees or are interested in maintaining substantial playing time to transfer or graduate. Who on the team right now is a pac-12 caliber player worth retaining for the next coach?

Secondly, who on the staff is worth retaining (if any)? I assume the next coach will largely clean house but any insights or thoughts?

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First of all, looking at USF, I see they have four coaches and a four-person support staff. Why does Cal need four coaches and a six-person support staff? And aside from that, how can you make a case for keeping any of them? Screw "continuity", there is nothing about this team that I want to see continued!

As far as players, Newell is intriguing, and maybe you could teach Okafor to rebound and defend but as for the others, I would sit down with each one and discuss the advantages of the other UC campuses (except UCLA where none of them has a snowball's chance of playing).

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HearstMining said:

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My concern with Celestine is that he only attempted 7 shots per game last season (sports-reference.com), fourth on the team and aside from Jordan Shepherd, there was nobody on that team he should have been deferring to for an outside shot. He did have a good percentage although his 3pt was 34%. I think my outlook is also colored by 4thGen stating that Celestine was less than happy at Cal. I do think his development has been impeded by injuries during his stint at Cal and that's not his fault.

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Rashad1010 said:

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Anybody who is judging these players off what they see on the court this year knows nothing about basketball. All these kids have skill sets that can be used with good coaching. Mark Fox is the worst coach I have ever seen. Coach Francis has no head coaching experience and will have no idea what to do. Marty Wilson is the guy to take over. All the players need is a coach who knows how to put them in position to be successful. Mark Fox is a liar and created fake narrative. He belittles the kids and has no relationship with them. He runs the same offense from 20 years ago and won't make any adjustments. Fire home asap!!

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Rashad1010 said:

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Anybody who is judging these players off what they see on the court this year knows nothing about basketball. All these kids have skill sets that can be used with good coaching. Mark Fox is the worst coach I have ever seen. Coach Francis has no head coaching experience and will have no idea what to do. Marty Wilson is the guy to take over. All the players need is a coach who knows how to put them in position to be successful. Mark Fox is a liar and created fake narrative. He belittles the kids and has no relationship with them. He runs the same offense from 20 years ago and won't make any adjustments. Fire home asap!!

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Rashad1010 said:

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Anybody who is judging these players off what they see on the court this year knows nothing about basketball. All these kids have skill sets that can be used with good coaching. Mark Fox is the worst coach I have ever seen. Coach Francis has no head coaching experience and will have no idea what to do. Marty Wilson is the guy to take over. All the players need is a coach who knows how to put them in position to be successful. Mark Fox is a liar and created fake narrative. He belittles the kids and has no relationship with them. He runs the same offense from 20 years ago and won't make any adjustments. Fire home asap!!

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4thGenCal said:

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HearstMining said:

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Rashad1010 said:

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Anybody who is judging these players off what they see on the court this year knows nothing about basketball. All these kids have skill sets that can be used with good coaching. Mark Fox is the worst coach I have ever seen. Coach Francis has no head coaching experience and will have no idea what to do. Marty Wilson is the guy to take over. All the players need is a coach who knows how to put them in position to be successful. Mark Fox is a liar and created fake narrative. He belittles the kids and has no relationship with them. He runs the same offense from 20 years ago and won't make any adjustments. Fire home asap!!

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If we don't judge the players based on what we see on the court, what are we supposed to judge them on?

I don't disagree with your assessment of Fox - the guy is an awful coach and if these players had different coaching when they arrived at Cal (a Montgomery type, maybe), they would be better but given where they are now, a different coach is not going to turn this team around in a year with this group of players. Firing Fox is a necessary BUT NOT SUFFICIENT CONDITION for this team to improve.

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Agreed - The entire staff needs to be replaced. Coach Wilson has little to no respect from the players, Francis is liked but players are mixed on his knowledge and skill development ability. Herriman has intensity they relate too, but also does not ease the throttle enough. Fox does have good game prep they believe is fairly sound, but the team has not implemented it well (on staff to make in game changes). They have had player only meetings, and the team remains tight, playing with effort - they are embarrassed, frustrated and upset - but as of now, its not directed toward Fox. My thoughts are that only 4 players are roster worthy (Newell, Askew, Sam, Celestine) for next season. Moot issue though as pointed out, no players will be run off. Amazing how poor a shooting team they are (and its been a pattern of past Fox team's at Cal) Frankly without Paris Austin being turned loose his senior season, that season would have been much worse. Celestine has a sweet/smooth shot but now with multiple injuries legit concerns about being able to consistently play at required Pac12 level, though He will be good if healthy. What is shocking to me/many fans, is the limited # of 1/2 position players on the roster. Really just 4 (askew, brown,hyder, Clayton) and with the history of Hyder injuries, Brown shooting limitations how on earth was the decision made to not take 6 players for those 2 positions? ( couple with 5 wings, and 2 low post). Paris Austin deserves credit for introducing the decent walk on Wrenn R to the staff - He is a literal walk on who has good skills/handles and good form. This team has few good ball handlers, can't create own shot, poor shooters and thus struggle with transition and half court offense. Coaches and x players I have brought to games shake their head and say "I can't figure out what they are trying to do on offense most of the time" Worst team I have seen in past 48 years of going to games. Wyking Teams nearly as bad, but were younger and had some talent.

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Bear8995 said:

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Do we need to run players off?

Kuany, Lars, Clayton, Joel and Hyder should all be gone at the end of this season. That gives us 5 open spots. Rodney Brown and Devin Curtis take up 2 of those spots so we should have space available for a new coach to recruit 3 more players.

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Bear8995 said:

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Do we need to run players off?

Kuany, Lars, Clayton, Joel and Hyder should all be gone at the end of this season. That gives us 5 open spots. Rodney Brown and Devin Curtis take up 2 of those spots so we should have space available for a new coach to recruit 3 more players.

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