Just based on my general impression from watching the games on TV and in person, it seems like are giving up WAY too many offensive rebounds. (Quite an insight, eh?)

Is this impression supported by statistics?

Has it been going on mostly all season? (In my mind, it's a February-March thing.)

Have we been playing enough zone that that would be a contributing factor?

Aren't there players that are supposed to be preventing their men from crashing the boards?

Have you ever seen a game like Colorado where we had TWO players with 12 boards each, but we still lost the "total rebounds battle" so decisively?

Don't you wish we still had Harper Kamp, or SOMEBODY 6-7/6-8 with a strong body that could do the dirty work of helping the team rebound?

Go Bears!

I think part of it is that we play some pretty good transition game teams. If you happen to miss the OB then they are off to the races with numbers.

The other issue may be in our offensive scheme. Seems like we always have a lot of our bigs up top setting screens and players set on the weak side for a three point shot.

We all seem to try to tap the ball into the basket on offensive rebounds, rather than catching the ball.
Go Bears!

We finished 7th in the Pac 12 in Defensive Rebounding % (what % of opponents missed shots did we grab).

We're not a particularly rugged team and we don't have a strong rebounding SF to replace what Crabbe did for us last year. Kravish, Behrens and Kreklow are not good at sealing their men and we have done a poor job containing dribble penetration which leads to our bigs coming off their men to defend at the rim leading to an unmarked man being able to grab the o board.

This issue may be our single biggest concern heading into 2014-5

These 2 posts are answering the wrong question. OP was asking about giving up OFFENSIVE rebounds (i.e., when we are on defense).

No, we are not playing a lot of zone. I agree w/ CHF that switching off post players is a part; so is the lack of good sealing (especially Kravish). Ironically, we're better at offensive rebounds ourselves because Solo and David are reasonably athletic.

UrsaMajor;842291435 said:

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These 2 posts are answering the wrong question. OP was asking about giving up OFFENSIVE rebounds (i.e., when we are on defense).

No, we are not playing a lot of zone. I agree w/ CHF that switching off post players is a part; so is the lack of good sealing (especially Kravish). Ironically, we're better at offensive rebounds ourselves because Solo and David are reasonably athletic.

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Good point. The title of the OP is a little confusing in that regard.

Big C_Cal;842291306 said:

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Just based on my general impression from watching the games on TV and in person, it seems like are giving up WAY too many offensive rebounds. (Quite an insight, eh?)

Is this impression supported by statistics?

Has it been going on mostly all season? (In my mind, it's a February-March thing.)

Have we been playing enough zone that that would be a contributing factor?

Aren't there players that are supposed to be preventing their men from crashing the boards?

Have you ever seen a game like Colorado where we had TWO players with 12 boards each, but we still lost the "total rebounds battle" so decisively?

Don't you wish we still had Harper Kamp, or SOMEBODY 6-7/6-8 with a strong body that could do the dirty work of helping the team rebound?

Go Bears!

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As you guessed, we are 7th in defensive rebounds and and 8th in defensive rebound percentage.

However (as you also noted), Solomon is 1st in the league in rebounding and is 3rd in defensive rebounding. Kravish is 9th in rebounding and 10th in defensive rebounding. No team in the Pac-12 has a better top 2.

I think our lack of another quality big behind them really hurts us. Wallace is a good rebounder (3rd on the team, or the only other player with more than 100) as is Cobbs (4th on the team) for a PG, but Rooks, Kreklow, Bird and Powers all together do not have as many rebounds (defensive or total) as Wallace does by himself. Playing Kreklow, Bird or Powers at the 4 is a disaster from the perspective of rebounding (unfortunately so has been playing Rooks at center).

We have not been playing much zone (I wish we would). I think our switching in man hurts our defensive rebounding as all too often it creates mismatches the other team can exploit (including having our bigs away from the basket and their bigs matched up against one of our smaller players down low).

Notably, we are third in opponent shot attempts (behind USC and ASU) and third in opponent misses, so that is a lot of defensive rebounds to get or offensive rebounds to give up.

Not sure why you bring up Kamp. Kamp was a very poor rebounder for a big. He was not tall and was not a great leaper [U]before[/U] all his injuries. His senior year he only averaged 5.2 rpg, which was 5th on [U]the Cal team[/U] behind Solomon, Crabbe, Kravish and even Guttierez. He was even worse in rebounds per minute.

The guys we miss are Thurman (as a third big off the bench), and Crabbe who gave us good rebounding from the wing (what we don't have now, other than Wallace).

I am really hoping Diallo is a great rebounder because next year could be painful in that department otherwise. We are really going to miss Solomon (and Cobbs). I fear Kravish may have a tougher time if he plays center and is matched up against the other teams' biggest player.

calumnus;842291443 said:

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As you guessed, we are 7th in defensive rebounds and and 8th in defensive rebound percentage.

However (as you also noted), Solomon is 1st in the league in rebounding and is 3rd in defensive rebounding. Kravish is 9th in rebounding and 10th in defensive rebounding. No team in the Pac-12 has a better top 2.

I think our lack of another quality big behind them really hurts us. Wallace is a good rebounder (3rd on the team, or the only other player with more than 100) as is Cobbs (4th on the team) for a PG, but Rooks, Kreklow, Bird and Powers all together do not have as many rebounds (defensive or total) as Wallace does by himself. Playing Kreklow, Bird or Powers at the 4 is a disaster from the perspective of rebounding (unfortunately so has been playing Rooks at center).

We have not been playing much zone (I wish we would). I think our switching in man hurts our defensive rebounding as all too often it creates mismatches the other team can exploit (including having our bigs away from the basket and their bigs matched up against one of our smaller players down low).

Notably, we are third in opponent shot attempts (behind USC and ASU) and third in opponent misses, so that is a lot of defensive rebounds to get or offensive rebounds to give up.

Not sure why you bring up Kamp. Kamp was a very poor rebounder for a big. He was not tall and was not a great leaper [U]before[/U] all his injuries. His senior year he only averaged 5.2 rpg, which was 5th on [U]the Cal team[/U] behind Solomon, Crabbe, Kravish and even Guttierez. He was even worse in rebounds per minute.

The guys we miss are Thurman (as a third big off the bench), and Crabbe who gave us good rebounding from the wing (what we don't have now, other than Wallace).

I am really hoping Diallo is a great rebounder because next year could be painful in that department otherwise. We are really going to miss Solomon (and Cobbs). I fear Kravish may have a tougher time if he plays center and is matched up against the other teams' biggest player.

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My take on Kamp -- one of the ultimate team guys -- was that he sealed his man out of the paint, allowing other Cal players to snare the rebound. I'd kill (no, not literally) to have a guy like him in our rotation this year.

CALiforniALUM;842291439 said:

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Good point. The title of the OP is a little confusing in that regard.

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Sorry. I titled it "Defensive rebounding problems...", probably should have been ""Our defensive rebounding problems", or "Our problem giving up offensive rebounds".

One thing that irks me about offensive rebounds...TV announcers always say..."oh wow XXX is just outworking the other team for rebounds"...but when you watch on TV..many times rebounds go off the front rim directly to some big dude just standing there. Not exactly working. Sometimes I wish the TV guys would say..'the other team is getting a lot of bounces going there way'.

Big C_Cal;842291478 said:

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My take on Kamp -- one of the ultimate team guys -- was that he sealed his man out of the paint, allowing other Cal players to snare the rebound. I'd kill (no, not literally) to have a guy like him in our rotation this year.

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I agree with that assessment but that team was an even worse defensive rebounding team than this one. Crabbe was actually our leading defensive rebounder in 2010-11 and 11-12.

CalHoopFan;842291486 said:

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I agree with that assessment but that team was an even worse defensive rebounding team than this one. Crabbe was actually our leading defensive rebounder in 2010-11 and 11-12.

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Exactly, Kamp was one of the main reasons that was a poor rebounding team. While it may have helped some that Kamp blocked out so that other Cal players might get the rebound, that is really an overblown contribution--it helps a LOT more if your bigs can block out AND [U]get rebounds[/U]. It wasn't his "selflessness," it is not like he didn't want to get the rebound, it was he couldn't (largely due to his injuries). However, we have had other height/leaping challenged bigs like MSF and Boykin that were more effective at blocking out AND securing rebounds. I do miss Kamp, but definitely not for his rebounding and this team would be FAR better with him (or any one of our past starting, or even reserve, bigs) on it.

This team has two bigs that rebound very well and two guards (Wallace and Cobbs) that rebound well. The problem is the other guys, especially our wings, especially when one of Solomon or Kravish is on the bench.

Rooks does look to block out, and he definitely has the height, if not the leaping ability, so let's hope he eventually becomes a better rebounder (more experience/better anticipation and improved quickness will help).

calumnus;842291545 said:

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This team has two bigs that rebound very well and two guards (Wallace and Cobbs) that rebound well. The problem is the other guys, especially our wings...
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Jorge, senior year, .16 rebounds per minute

Wallace, .14

Kreklow, .11

Mathews, .11

Bird, .10

Cobbs, 08

Go Bears!

south bender;842291552 said:

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Jorge, senior year, .16 rebounds per minute

Wallace, .14

Kreklow, .11

Mathews, .11

Bird, .10

Cobbs, 08

Go Bears!

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Can't compare Jorge to those guys save when the margin is wide. He played without a Solomon sucking up all the D boards. That said, he was a good rebounder, especially for a PG

Big C_Cal;842291481 said:

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Sorry. I titled it "Defensive rebounding problems...", probably should have been ""Our defensive rebounding problems", or "Our problem giving up offensive rebounds".

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No need to apologize. Totally my fault not reading carefully enough. Sometimes on a cell phone while trying to stay upright on the subway you can read and respond differently than intended. On a second review I don't know what I was reading.

CalHoopFan;842291563 said:

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Can't compare Jorge to those guys save when the margin is wide. He played without a Solomon sucking up all the D boards. That said, he was a good rebounder, especially for a PG

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I don't know why not. He had Crabbe rebounding, where the current team does not. Further, the margin is wide compared to any of the current team members

I would guess, his knowing the need for rebounding support behind Richard and David, he would have concentrated even more on helping out on the boards.

In any event, I posted these stats, largely to question whether Justin was much of a rebounder, as Calumnus had suggested.

Go Bears!

We try to block nearly every shot. When you are attempting to block a shot, you are taking yourself out of rebounding position unless you actually block the shot. Blocking shots is great, but when both of your primary rebounders try to block the shot, we are opening ourselves up to offensive rebounds.

A headier approach is for one guy to attempt to block the shot while the other tries seal off his guy, but we are so in love with blocks that they both go after it and we miss out on some boards we should get.

south bender;842291552 said:

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Jorge, senior year, .16 rebounds per minute

Wallace, .14

Kreklow, .11

Mathews, .11

Bird, .10

Cobbs, 08

Go Bears!

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I still maintain that Cobbs is a good rebounder [U]for a PG[/U]. Guttierez was a very good rebounder (like Wallace) but his senior year Cobbs played more of the point. In prior years, even though Smith played a lot of the point, Guttierez's rebounding per minute was still good but not as impressive.

I still think the lack of rebounding from the guys (Kreklow, Bird, Mathews, Powers) who play a lot of minutes at the "bigger positions" is the main reason we are not a good rebounding team despite the fact that no team has a pair of bigs who have more rebounds than Solomon and Kravish. However, based on the I will throw Cobbs (and Singer) in there too.