I have been abroad throughout PAC 12 season, so have not seen our Bears since mid December.

Early on I thought Kelly the most gifted scorer on the team, but that there was no recognition by the staff to see he got touches.

Now Kelly rides the pine?

What gives?

Why would Kelly want to return if Wyking returns next year?

It appears something is going on but I floated the theory when he was still getting minutes that the quality of his play was falling off the ledge and that it could possibly be due to the fact that the college season is grinding him down because 260 pounds at 6'8 is a bit heavy (how's that for a run on sentence?)

bearister said:

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It appears something is going on but I floated the theory when he was still getting minutes that the quality of his play was falling off the ledge and that it could possibly be due to the fact that the college season is grinding him down because 260 pounds at 6'8 is a bit heavy (how's that for a run on sentence?)

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Could be true. Who knows.he should be starting in place of of Dyson. But it really doesn't matter.

oskidunker said:

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bearister said:

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It appears something is going on but I floated the theory when he was still getting minutes that the quality of his play was falling off the ledge and that it could possibly be due to the fact that the college season is grinding him down because 260 pounds at 6'8 is a bit heavy (how's that for a run on sentence?)

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Could be true. Who knows.he should be starting in place of of Dyson. But it really doesn't matter.

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I assume the only thing JHD does better than him is D. On a side note, Sueing and Bradley each had 6 boards. High boards for the game was Wildcats' Jeter with 7.

south bender said:

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I have been abroad throughout PAC 12 season, so have not seen our Bears since mid December.

Early on I thought Kelly the most gifted scorer on the team, but that there was no recognition by the staff to see he got touches.

Now Kelly rides the pine?



Simple explanation: Vanover more minutes= Kelly less minutes

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I really like Kelly. He was really strong vs our OOC opponents

But before the season I was concerned about him going up against Pac-12 players.

I think his drop in results is related to the increase in the level of competition

He also is just a freshman and makes mistakes on defense. Taller players have been scoring too easily on him and he's not a rim protector

With all that said, I think he is a core player for us for four years, as he's going to get better defensively, and I also expect him to stretch his shooting out to the arc. He already is a good shooter (form)

RedlessWardrobe said:

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south bender said:

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I have been abroad throughout PAC 12 season, so have not seen our Bears since mid December.

Early on I thought Kelly the most gifted scorer on the team, but that there was no recognition by the staff to see he got touches.

Now Kelly rides the pine?



Simple explanation: Vanover more minutes= Kelly less minutes

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Many of us might like to see some minutes with Kelly and Vanover on the floor together. Seems to have potential for some high/low offense.

All good points but you could say the same thing about Vanover who is getting Kelly's minutes. Everyone scores on him, large and small.

Definitely some merit to put them both on the floor at the same time. What have we got to lose?

superbear99 said:

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All good points but you could say the same thing about Vanover who is getting Kelly's minutes. Everyone scores on him, large and small.

Definitely some merit to put them both on the floor at the same time. What have we got to lose?

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agree. try a 'big' line up
one issue is we have so little depth
if they are both on the floor at once, then who will sub for them?
I guess Grant is our only other big

really good front court tandems develop chemstry

they screen for each other, pass to each other, rotate and help for each other, and get offensive rebounds because they know where the ball is coming off

and of course, to have that chemistry, they need to play together over time

Someone the Rivals board thinks Kelly will leave. Probably just speculation.

oskidunker said:

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Someone the Rivals board thinks Kelly will leave. Probably just speculation.

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He'd be my "most likely." Just speculation.

oskidunker said:

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Someone the Rivals board thinks Kelly will leave. Probably just speculation.

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Kelly looks like he has "hit the wall", but he also doesn't look to happy on the court. There might well be some within-the-team stuff going on.

Could be just my imagination, but Kelly often seems frustrated on offense, like nobody is ever looking to get him the ball. That might be because NOBODY IS EVER LOOKING TO GET HIM THE BALL. He has some offensive talent, including a solid-looking jump shot. I'd rather see the ball in his hands than a few other guys who are currently in the rotation.

Long-term, Kelly needs to work on his explosive strength and his interior defense (specifically, he needs to "body up" an opponent trying to post up, farther out from the basket). He should try and model his game after Draymond Green's.

Right now, Kelly is too slow and too undersized and also needs to shed some flab. He should be a better player next year as he sheds some flab and adds some muscle. He does have a pretty shooting stroke. but, you need to get into position to receive the ball and you need willing teammates to get you the ball. Asa long as Cal lacks a traditional PG, Kelly, as others, will only have minimum touches.

helltopay1 said:

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Right now, Kelly is too slow and too undersized and also needs to shed some flab. He should be a better player next year as he sheds some flab and adds some muscle. He does have a pretty shooting stroke. but, you need to get into position to receive the ball and you need willing teammates to get you the ball. Asa long as Cal lacks a traditional PG, Kelly, as others, will only have minimum touches.

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He can be a good player for Cal. He has to keep transitioning his game from center to PF. 6'8 may be a Big Man in high school but it isn't in college.

I hope he stays. Lots of Potential.

Big C said:

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oskidunker said:

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Someone the Rivals board thinks Kelly will leave. Probably just speculation.

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Kelly looks like he has "hit the wall", but he also doesn't look to happy on the court. There might well be some within-the-team stuff going on.

Could be just my imagination, but Kelly often seems frustrated on offense, like nobody is ever looking to get him the ball. That might be because NOBODY IS EVER LOOKING TO GET HIM THE BALL. He has some offensive talent, including a solid-looking jump shot. I'd rather see the ball in his hands than a few other guys who are currently in the rotation.

Long-term, Kelly needs to work on his explosive strength and his interior defense (specifically, he needs to "body up" an opponent trying to post up, farther out from the basket). He should try and model his game after Draymond Green's..

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I agree with a lot of this. Not many have Draymond Green-type potential, but I would suggest that Kelly learn how to defend and contain one man first, and then think about guarding the other four men on the court as well, like Draymond Green can do. Kelly has been placed in an awful position, playing center against much taller and more athletic big men, with no help except from players smaller than he is. Ridiculous. I lobbied for playing both Vanover and Kelly together from the beginning. Cal is incredibly undermanned, and the coach had few options. Okoroh and Lee were just an average big man tandem at best, and replacing two experienced seniors like that was an almost impossible task for the coach. There are so few decent grad transfer bigs available, that any coach would have to look primarily to recruits for his starting bigs for this season. Jones did his best, and landed two who I expect will one day become good players, maybe very good players. The Ivan Rabbs only come to Cal once every 10 or 20 years, and even Ivan had his problems as a freshman, well documented on this forum. Early on he got in foul trouble, had trouble with man defense on older, bigger or stronger or quicker big men. He got better, and by his second year he was a better player. Offensively, I expected more, but he never had a point guard at Cal even as good as his high school buddy Austin to get him the ball. Now we have a little better point guard, but no Ivan, no KO, and no Lee to pass the ball to. To me it is a no-brainer not to play Vanover and Kelly together. Dyson needs to sit. We need perimeter defense, but we need paint defense and post scoring more. Playing the two together might give our rebounding a small uptick. Neither one is a good rebounder, but together, maybe they can help each other to rebound better. And for goodness sakes, stop playing that freakin' zone. Kelly and Vanover will never learn rebounding until they learn to box out. And get stronger.

bearister said:

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helltopay1 said:

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Right now, Kelly is too slow and too undersized and also needs to shed some flab. He should be a better player next year as he sheds some flab and adds some muscle. He does have a pretty shooting stroke. but, you need to get into position to receive the ball and you need willing teammates to get you the ball. Asa long as Cal lacks a traditional PG, Kelly, as others, will only have minimum touches.

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He can be a good player for Cal. He has to keep transitioning his game from center to PF. 6'8 may be a Big Man in high school but it isn't in college.

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That's the other thing: If you don't count the shoes and the hair, I think we're looking at 6-6 or 6-6 1/2 at the most. Just like Bradley is 6-2 or 6-2 1/2.

He kind of looks like Zeke Elliot. He definitely appears unhappy on court. Could just be his war face.

Wouldn't surprise me to see him transfer along with every other player.

Having seen no Cal basketball since quite early on and now looking at box scores since I returned, I am still mystified by Andre Kelly's sparse minutes on the court.

I would appreciate being enlightened about this, why he has become a bench player with few minutes on the court.

Great to see Cal win 3 straight, obviously playing better at this stage of the season.

Also wondering if a good part of our team's recent success is due to the overconfidence by the Washington teams and Stanford??

Thoughts, anyone?

south bender said:

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Having seen no Cal basketball since quite early on and now looking at box scores since I returned, I am still mystified by Andre Kelly's sparse minutes on the court.

I would appreciate being enlightened about this, why he has become a bench player with few minutes on the court.

Great to see Cal win 3 straight, obviously playing better at this stage of the season.

Also wondering if a good part of our team's recent success is due to the overconfidence by the Washington teams and Stanford??

Thoughts, anyone?

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1. The improvement in Vanover has cut into his minutes.
2. The improvement in Anticevich has cut into his minutes.
3. He struggles some against taller post players (more of them in the P12 than OOC)
4. He's a foul machine and often is in foul trouble.