Inexplicable decision on so many levels. Is Knowlton intentionally trying to drive Cal fans away from Cal sports?

stivo said:

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If Fox is the hire, I'm done. I will not follow the team. I will not watch the games. I will not come to this forum. Cal basketball will be dead to me.

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There's always men's swimming. NCAA championships in Austin, right now.

Is there an NCAA rule that says you have to have a head coach? Maybe we just hire somebody for 100k to be the coordinator and make sure the players get to the games, and then another guy to recruit some guys who want to coach themselves and see how they do.

Having a good AD is important since they make the hires. My did Cal choose Knowlton, who came from Air Force? This guy has no experience running things at a high major institution.

How hard is it to hire the right guy? Mark Fox is a retread, and not even a good one.

I'm not done, like others, I'll just take a rest like under Jones. Didn't even bother to look under his tenure. Yup, I've given up full fandom freak outs and got a season ticket on the bandwagon deluxe. Frankly I have other stuff to worry about and when the distraction becomes a distraction...well then chill pill and look away. I'll be back and hey if Fox fires the team up and Cal wins...I'll watch with pride.

bearsandgiants said:

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Is there an NCAA rule that says you have to have a head coach? Maybe we just hire somebody for 100k to be the coordinator and make sure the players get to the games, and then another guy to recruit some guys who want to coach themselves and see how they do.

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It would seem to be a good idea. Modern college basketball, the way the rules are, and the way the game is structured favoring individual play more than a lot of teamwork, is dominated by team with star players. Often they can coach themselves, until they start losing confidence in their teammates and begin to try and put the team on their individual set of shoulders. Get a team playing like that, and it is easy to defeat them, with even minimal coaching. On the other hand we have tried hiring a supposed recruiter as head coach, and he brought the stars to Cal, but the results were not good (Padgett, Martin, maybe Kuchen) unless the coach got caught passing money under the table (Bozeman), and then we had some success, until he got caught. I think the best mix would be a recruiter who can play by the rules (like a Braun), but be a good enough coach to get his stars to play together (hopefully, our next coach). Unfortunately, our situation and starved-for-wins fans demand results right now, so the situation might not call for a coach K, but maybe for a coach who has successfully built a program from scratch before. an interim guy maybe, like Braun was, because he started the job with a ton of seniors on the roster, and no scholarships to give. After his first year, the seniors were all gone, and all he had left was the oft-injured Sean Marks. Ben built up the roster and had some good seasons.

KoreAmBear said:

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Inexplicable decision on so many levels. Is Knowlton intentionally trying to drive Cal fans away from Cal sports?

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Yes, you've uncovered the secret plot! Knowlton & Christ are secretly working for the FBI, who never got over what Berkeley students did in the Free Speech Movement days. How did you know?

stivo said:

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If Fox is the hire, I'm done. I will not follow the team. I will not watch the games. I will not come to this forum. Cal basketball will be dead to me.

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Adios, amigo.

stivo said:

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Adios. We certainly don't need any negativity at this point

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

89Bear said:

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If you guys ran your lives like you do your Bear fandom you would be on the streets, living in the gutter, screaming up into the sky. Deal with it, you wussies....

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That's just silly and stupid to say. Seriously.

socaltownie said:

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

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That's where we are, and we do need someone to come in and at least get the program back on solid footing, which to me means at least developing some sort of culture and continuity, class balance. We've had way too much turnover lately, coaches and players. If Fox can build this program into one that at least makes the tournament in the next few years and has some talent, and if we get a practice facility built or at least under way, then maybe a more dynamic coach will see the potential and want to take things higher. And maybe we'd have the money to get that coach.

I'm not in love here, would rather roll the dice on a younger low to mid-major type, but there wasn't going to be a quick fix.

socaltownie said:

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

stu said:

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SFCityBear said:

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI.

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I was thrilled by the Montgomery hire and pleasantly surprised by the Cuonzo Mattin hire. I'm probably not the only one.

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Good points. I guess I was too influenced by recent events. A lot of hires we made over the years looked good on paper (for different reasons) when hired: Herrerias, Padgett, Edwards, Kuchen, Bozeman, Montgomery, Martin, and all had some fan support. So I misspoke.

For the record, I liked the Montgomery hire when it happened, but I remarked to a friend at the time that Montgomery might only be able to get us to the Final Four, because that was the best he had done.previously. I came to like him more and more as time went by. I was very skeptical of Martin, with so many Tennessee fans wanting him replaced. I was excited about getting Rabb (my kind of player), not so excited about Brown, and I came to like Martin's style less and less over time.

SFCityBear said:

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I came to like Martin's style less and less over time.

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I think you speak for all of us on that point.

SFCityBear said:

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socaltownie said:

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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i liked Monty and was over the moon about Martin.

socaltownie said:

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SFCityBear said:

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socaltownie said:

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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i liked Monty and was over the moon about Martin.

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When it comes to basketball coaches, one good one out of two ain't bad. I nominate you for the next AD after the Cal fans get the current AD fired.

socaltownie said:

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SFCityBear said:

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socaltownie said:

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"I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox."


NEWS F"""" flash.

Because Eric M was unlikely to take the job. He is/will have better offers on the table.

I know it PAINS you to admit, this is NOT a good job. It is one that can be attractive for certain reasons (guy likes the Bay Area - Monty; Guy needs an escape hatch - Martin; Guy hits the loto - Jones) but we have been down this road about 4 times in the last 10 years. We are NOT getting a guy like Eric M.

It pains me to type that. But until we get a practice facility, the admission standards are reexamined or the landscape shifts as a bunch of coaches go to the big house for lying to the FBI this is NOT a good job.

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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i liked Monty and was over the moon about Martin.

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I met Martin at a function in San Diego when the football team played SDSU. He seemed very uncomfortable with donors and not very interested. I concluded right then he was like Dykes and was there for himself. Not so much trying to build a program....

I'm thinking this is all going to work out great....

expectations are low and

Fox is already winning over some that are willing to listen instead of

shouting how much smarter they are than the professionals in the room

Yes, thank god the professionals in the room prevailed. They never miss.

Let's all hold our collective breath until Cal isn't Cal!

tsubamoto2001 said:

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Sunshine pump all you want. Have as much blind faith as you want. It's your right. But it's also our right to feel differently.

On a common sense level, this hire, especially this early, not even a week after letting Wyking go, for guy that isn't currently employed by another NCAA program is indeed inexplicable. Widen your pool, if didn't like the obvious options (perhaps not obvious to Knowlton) you had. Lengthen the process. Don't make a rash decision. A Mark Fox would have been available a month from now. It's not likely that another high-major program was after his services.

It's clear, from this hire, that Knowlton has very little actual knowledge about college basketball and instead relied on the suggestions of a search firm looking out for the interests of its coaching clients. He also has very little regard for the optics of his decisions (did a 180 on his decision on Wyking) and the timing of them.

I mean, if you were going to hire a Nevada coach, why not Eric Musselman? Musselman's tenure so far actually compares favorably with Fox, especially considering Nevada is now in the MWC, whereas they were in the WAC under Fox.

Every Cal fan wants success, regardless of who the coach is, but false hope doesn't help anyone.

calfanz said:

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KoreAmBear said:

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Inexplicable decision on so many levels. Is Knowlton intentionally trying to drive Cal fans away from Cal sports?

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You guys are stupid silly. Read and reread your posts before you send em

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We could have hired him at any point in the season. If we thought he was so great, why wait?

SFCityBear said:

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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I was giddy for Monty and satisfied with Tedford given that I knew nothing about him other than that he was Oregon's OC. I was pretty happy about Cuonzo, but it turned out the Tennessee fans were right.

Yogi Bear said:

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SFCityBear said:

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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I was giddy for Monty and satisfied with Tedford given that I knew nothing about him other than that he was Oregon's OC. I was pretty happy about Cuonzo, but it turned out the Tennessee fans were right.

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Agreed. And I was happy when Braun was hired as it seemed like a good move: a highly successful mid-major coach who ran a clean program and whose teams had beaten some major teams with higher ranked players. And it was a good choice for a few years until it became evident he had plateaued.

southseasbear said:

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Yogi Bear said:

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SFCityBear said:

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Has any Cal fan ever been happy with a coaching hire? That is just not what we do. At least here on the BI. In 1954, as a little kid at the family dinner table, I remember my Cal Alum father talking about newspapers expressing doubt about the hiring of Pete Newell, after his not very good record at Michigan State.

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I was giddy for Monty and satisfied with Tedford given that I knew nothing about him other than that he was Oregon's OC. I was pretty happy about Cuonzo, but it turned out the Tennessee fans were right.

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Agreed. And I was happy when Braun was hired as it seemed like a good move: a highly successful mid-major coach who ran a clean program and whose teams had beaten some major teams with higher ranked players. And it was a good choice for a few years until it became evident he had plateaued.

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I've generally been happy with all of the Football and Basketball hires in the last 35 years. Some have turned out well, others have not. Jones was the only hire in recent memory that I disliked (but not surprised by Williams, my former neighbor).

My bigger issue is how we've handled revenue coaches AFTER the hire.

• Tedford and Braun. Got stale, should have been replaced or revitalized sooner.
• Letting Snyder & Mooch go (although doubt anything could have been done about Mooch.
• Holmoe, Gilbertson, Dykes, Campanelli, Kuchen were kept around too long, when it was obvious they had hit their ceiling or were not a good fit.
• Monty & Martin - no succession/transition plan or was botched, if there was one.

Bozeman (obvious) and Jones (obvious) were actually the only ones handled properly.

I'm not thrilled by the Fox hire - If he turns out mediocre, I worry we keep him for 5-9 years. We need to see IN THE NEXT TWO SEASONS, that he is not that same as he was at Georgia and fits better in the P12. I call POPPYCOCK on all of those that claim a coach needs 3-5 years. The evidence is there in the first two seasons. Or it is not and should move on.