Schroeder71;842439253 said:
http://www.calbears.com//ViewContent.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=30100&CONTENT_ID=1092262
I've stopped posting because nobody says anything critical of Gottlieb as a headcoach. Cal had a single steal against Washington. They were outcoached bigtime by the Husky headman. He junked his three guard lineup for Cal and placed reserve Chantel Osahor (6-2) in the center of their three post frontline. Osahor had a +19 for the game.
http://stats.statbroadcast.com/statmonitr/?DB_OEM_ID=30200&id=66019
In the first half, UDub outrebounded Cal by 9 boards. For the game the rebounding battle was dead even! Washington had always been dominated on the boards by Cal in the past...Gottlieb allowed Washington to dictate a half-court game and Cal never tried to full-court press until 52 seconds remained in the game. The Bears lost by two points!!! How none of you see any of these "shortcomings" is beyond me...Lindsey certainly is not a great strategist. She maybe every girl's best friend but I'm disappointed with the Bear's overall performance since the final four appearance three years ago. Wasn't Cal nationally ranked once upon a time?
GO BEARS!
What are your points here, exactly?
Do you mean to say that you've stopped posting here because nobody can say anything critical of Gottlieb without then being criticized themselves? It would seem a bit ironic if people speaking out for the right to criticize were to complain when they get criticized....
I would agree that Neighbors' going big was a good move, especially because Oshahor was playing well (though citing her plus/minus rating for the game is not necessarily great support of that, because it's such an unreliable stat in basketball). But you go on to bemoan Washington's rebounding "advantage" when Oshahor's 7 boards actually only matched her season average -- in 9 more minutes of playing time than she usually averages. But are you suggesting that Gottlieb should have countered by pressing UW? With Boyd, Gray and Cowling all in foul trouble throughout, and Gabby also ending up with 4? Really?? Did you want to use Waters, Shine and Hartman to come in to put on the press? In fact, when Cal pressed with 52 seconds left, Jefflo got called for a foul on Plum (which I'm pretty sure was not intentional). Plum and Davis are excellent FT shooters, and as we saw, putting them on the line is pretty much giving UW free points. Risking more foul trouble in a tightly reffed game, against a quality Div I team with good ballhandling, great FT shooting guards doesn't seem like a sound strategy to me.
I'm sure there are plenty of tweaks Gottlieb could've tried, especially with the benefit of hindsight, but having your 2 best players sitting with foul trouble and having to play less aggressively ties a coaches hands quite a bit. I imagine if Plum got 2 fouls in the first 2 minutes and Davis followed, the results would've made it appear like Gottlieb easily outcoached Neighbors .
And are the rebounding stats you cite supposed to support your argument about Cal being outcoached? If Cal got out-rebounded by 9 in the first half, that means they were plus 9 in the second... wouldn't that be attributed to Gottlieb's coaching adjustments (or at least one heck of a halftime speech) under your reasoning? To me, in addition to only matching her season avg in rebounds, Oshahor's key contributions in the 2d half were a very timely 3 ptr and impressively nimble drive and scoop shot that would have made even Plum proud -- neither of which typically follow from a going-big strategy.
And why would the past Cal and UW teams have any bearing on this game's rebounding stats, especially regarding game strategy? The facts are that UW rebounds evenly with their opponents this year, and Cal is +4. This should indicate that the rebounds in this game being dead even should not come as a big surprise. It is also a fact that Cal's rebounding margin has gotten progressively worse since the glory days, and UW's better. I understand that you are so disappointed with the Bears' performance (personally, I think Oski, unlike Gottlieb, is above criticism!) that it seems like you have been suffering for three years -- when the final four was less than two seasons ago. ;-) Cal's rebounding margin with the trio of Talia, Genn and Gray in the post was truly elite, was hard for any team to match then or today, and certainly isn't easy to replace through recruiting. BTW, once upon a time was also just earlier this season, and Cal is still receiving votes in both polls... hopefully Range coming back will improve on that as well as the rebound #s.
Given the original thread, it should be noted that UW is only shooting .024 better than Cal in 3pt%, even with Plum... that doesn't make a whole lot of difference in points per game. And while I agree that Plum is a great shooter (and even better scorer), she's only at 38% from 3pt range for her career -- very good for wbb but a good reminder of the context we're working in. Meanwhile, Cal's 3pt% has progressed from .300 at the start of the Gottlieb era to .322 so far this year... hopefully a sign that the recruiting of capable outside shooters is moving in the right direction, if slower than some might like. In the be-careful-what-you-wish-for (or maybe it's the grass-is-always-greener) department, the final four team only shot .302 from the arc, which underscores what I've often felt was an underappreciation of the importance and direct relation of Cal's rebounding to winning games.
FWIW I think coaches generally, and even more so coaching staffs with excellent records, deserve significant benefit of the doubt. It is highly unlikely that anyone on this board has more basketball experience than the combined Cal staff, at least specifically from a women's Div-I coaching perspective. To the extent anyone has enough experience to hang in such company, they still wouldn't have full access to the inner workings of this Cal team. Critics should keep in mind that these coaches do this for a living, 365 days a year, unlike most of us who watch as fans in our spare time.... Even if it's not apparent from the play on the floor, or they make some wrong choices, chances are the coaches have considered every angle you would like them to and more. Now coaching is not rocket science (but, really, how did it take over 11 years to find that Mars probe??!) and I like post-game analysis and Monday-morning quarterbacking as much as the next person; and speculation is fun... seems to me message boards are mostly just another form of entertainment -- and procrastination/distraction/time-sink, as the case may be :-)
But when posters seem to lose sight of this perspective and the broader context of a season or the Cal program as a whole, and draw conclusions that are not well supported by fact or reasoned argument, I think it's fair to criticize them just as much and probably more than the coaches. No one should take it personally or defensively in either direction (And please feel free to criticize me all you want -- like these overly long posts just have to stop).
