HoopDreams said:

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We can't have AT shooting 2-15

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Thomas 2-15, 1-10 3s
Anigwe 4-15, 0-1 3s
Smith 2-10, 1-6 3s.

Just how it goes in basketball. Sometimes you're hot. Sometimes you're not.

The refs let Stanford push KA around in the paint, keeping her far from the basket and preventing us from running our offense the way we're used to running it.

We still could have won (against one of the 5 elite teams in the country) if we shot better... but we didn't.

Aside from the shooting, our defense and effort continue to improve, and we're peaking just in time for the NCAA tournament.

When the double team comes, you have to make the other team pay with outside shooting, which in turn forces them to loosen up inside. That shooting just wasn't there tonight. Really sad since we had 14 more shots.

This run/runlet reminds me of the 2013 tournament, in which Cal knocked off USC easily before losing a rather awful game to UCLA. Everyone played tired (which they undoubtedly were), then came bouncing back at the NCAA:

https://calbears.com/schedule.aspx?path=wbball&schedule=397

R90 said:

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Aside from the shooting, our defense and effort continue to improve, and we're peaking just in time for the NCAA tournament.

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Agree. And we didn't have another PG go crazy on us again

blungld said:

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I am sure she is plenty motivated and driven to do better without my stupid post, but as amazing as KA's season has been, AT's has been almost as disappointing. This is not how I imagined her senior season going down. She is a leader and a great teammate and person, but we need so much more from her on the court, and she is capable of it.

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Asha Thomas:
As a Freshman... 8.3 ppg., 141/92, 1.53 A/TO, 48-134 3pt. 35.8%
As a Sophomore. 8.9 ppg., 113/62, 1.82 A/TO, 63/165 3pt. 38.2%
As a Junior.........12.8 ppg., 107/58, 1.84 A/TO, 62/177 3pt. 35.0%
As a Senior.........10.9 ppg., 98/52, 1.88 A/TO, 51/135 3pt. 37.8%

Except for her freshman year, Thomas has been more a scorer than an assist maker. Our bigger guards have done more passing into to the post the last 3 years.
Anigwe scored 6.1 ppg. more this year on 4 more shots per game. That meant less shots for Thomas.
Her efficiency has been good, though.

Like all shooters (Klay Thompson for example) she has some good games and some bad ones.

Just realized that the game ended on a 17-2 Stanford run. Hard to believe.

Played a good Furd team tough until the end. Thoughts on NCASA seeding?

R90 said:

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blungld said:

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I am sure she is plenty motivated and driven to do better without my stupid post, but as amazing as KA's season has been, AT's has been almost as disappointing. This is not how I imagined her senior season going down. She is a leader and a great teammate and person, but we need so much more from her on the court, and she is capable of it.

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Asha Thomas:
As a Freshman... 8.3 ppg., 141/92, 1.53 A/TO, 48-134 3pt. 35.8%
As a Sophomore. 8.9 ppg., 113/62, 1.82 A/TO, 63/165 3pt. 38.2%
As a Junior.........12.8 ppg., 107/58, 1.84 A/TO, 62/177 3pt. 35.0%
As a Senior.........10.9 ppg., 98/52, 1.88 A/TO, 51/135 3pt. 37.8%

Except for her freshman year, Thomas has been more a scorer than an assist maker. Our bigger guards have done more passing into to the post the last 3 years.
Anigwe scored 6.1 ppg. more this year on 4 more shots per game. That meant less shots for Thomas.
Her efficiency has been good, though.

Like all shooters (Klay Thompson for example) she has some good games and some bad ones.

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Agreed. But KA also added to her rebounds per game which has given the offense more possessions too.

I thought AT's 12.9 pts a game would bump up a little, but more than anything we would feel her presence on the court more. I know that is not a statistic, but when I watch the games I don't feel like KA and AT are the floor generals pushing this team like a combo who has played together for 4 years. That may be true in practice or behind the scenes, but that is not the vibe during games.

On the court it looks like KA busting her butt without mercy, and then a bunch of role players who are hot or cold on any given night. AT has not been a consistent 2nd threat. In fact, if I didn't know better I would have thought RC was the 4th year player in the program.

blungld said:

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R90 said:

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Like all shooters (Klay Thompson for example) she has some good games and some bad ones.

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Agreed. But KA also added to her rebounds per game which has given the offense more possessions too.

I thought AT's 12.9 pts a game would bump up a little, but more than anything we would feel her presence on the court more. I know that is not a statistic, but when I watch the games I don't feel like KA and AT are the floor generals pushing this team like a combo who has played together for 4 years. That may be true in practice or behind the scenes, but that is not the vibe during games.

On the court it looks like KA busting her butt without mercy, and then a bunch of role players who are hot or cold on any given night. AT has not been a consistent 2nd threat. In fact, if I didn't know better I would have thought RC was the 4th year player in the program.

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KA is really battling. I don't think I've ever seen a center battle like that before. In the second half of the season our second most important player has been Caldwell

Caldwell makes things happen as the best pure scorer on this team. She can shoot, drive and pass. Ever wonder how she is getting to the rack all the time? She is not lighting quick with the ball, but her ball handling allows her to probe the defense to get a shot or a layup. Specifically, her use of change of speed, reverses, combo moves and step backs. There are flashier ball handlers but I love watching her with the ball.

She is also a better perimeter passer than we've had for awhile. Past years we mostly lobbed passes to KA. Get when it worked but often resulted in turnovers. Of course we still lob pass but Cee is very good at hard passes from 23 feet out on a direct wire to KA. Those are level 10 difficulty passes.

Earlier in the season I think Caldwell was reluctant to exert her leadership skills because she was the "new kid in town" and didn't want to disrespect KA and AT.

Now, she's gotten the green light and is leading this team by example. She's never been to the NCAA Tournament as a player. She wants it badly and is determined to take her teammates with her on this journey.

I wish there was a way she could stay another year to offer guidance to the young guards joining this team.

I don't want to belabor this point, but we ran out of gas. To win the PAC-12 tournament, we had to win 4 games in 4 days. I remember Mike Montgomery saying that he always substituted a lot on Thursday night's game so his players would be fresh for Saturday's game. If that was a good strategy for 2 games in 3 days, it's even more important for a team possibility playing 4 games in 4 days.

On Thursday, we played four players for at least 34 minutes, and three others another for 27, 19 and 6 minutes. Thus the bulk of the time we only played 6 players. Even when we got a comfortable lead near the end of the game, we didn't take out our starters until the final few minutes. Last night, was more of the same. We played four players for at least 36 minutes, and three others another for 21, 17 and 10 minutes. Thus the bulk of the time, 4 of our players remained on the court. Styles and Mosley played 1 minute each at the very end of the game. Both are better defenders than several of our players that ate up a lot of minutes.

I think Stanford took advantage of this situation. Several times they just beat us down the court to score. In addition, when you are tired (especially your legs), you don't shoot as well (Asha and Kianna?). And Forbes, a shooter, only took 3 shots the entire game. If our team is riddled with unreported injuries, then I understand Lindsay's reluctance to substitute, but if we were healthy, there is no excuse.

HoopDreams said:

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Caldwell ...is not lighting quick with the ball, but her ball handling allows her to probe the defense to get a shot or a layup. Specifically, her use of change of speed, reverses, combo moves and step backs.

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I agree. Change of speed is how she makes up for her lack of quickness. KS has a little bit of the same arsenal, just not quite as assertive. A couple times in games she will drive into the paint under control, sometimes she will pull up or shoot a floater, but too often she still forces a dish to KA (she had a wide open layup last night she didn't take) or will shoot the floater when the glass is available (and rim out).

AT has not been as aggressive driving or using the same tools, and I know she has them. Maybe the early injury has lingered (though she doesn't look injured), but I don't understand how many games she will just sort of disappear...and then I'm like oh, yeah At is on the team. KS, JB, RC, and of course KA all have more court presence this year.

One funny aside. Have you noticed how RC initiates her drives with a hop step. It's a quirk. Looks like a pick-up basketball habit. Leaving the floor loses some control and slows her down, and doesn't seem to deceive the defender, but she does it to gain speed and assert her drive. I laugh every time she does it. And now AT and KS do it sometimes too. She actually is influencing her teammates perhaps subconsciously (or consciously) to imitate her mannerisms.

Another year with her would be amazing.

IssyBear said:

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I don't want to belabor this point, but we ran out of gas. To win the PAC-12 tournament, we had to win 4 games in 4 days. I remember Mike Montgomery saying that he always substituted a lot on Thursday night's game so his players would be fresh for Saturday's game. If that was a good strategy for 2 games in 3 days, it's even more important for a team possibility playing 4 games in 4 days.

On Thursday, we played four players for at least 34 minutes, and three others another for 27, 19 and 6 minutes. Thus the bulk of the time we only played 6 players. Even when we got a comfortable lead near the end of the game, we didn't take out our starters until the final few minutes. Last night, was more of the same. We played four players for at least 36 minutes, and three others another for 21, 17 and 10 minutes. Thus the bulk of the time, 4 of our players remained on the court. Styles and Mosley played 1 minute each at the very end of the game. Both are better defenders than several of our players that ate up a lot of minutes.

I think Stanford took advantage of this situation. Several times they just beat us down the court to score. In addition, when you are tired (especially your legs), you don't shoot as well (Asha and Kianna?). And Forbes, a shooter, only took 3 shots the entire game. If our team is riddled with unreported injuries, then I understand Lindsay's reluctance to substitute, but if we were healthy, there is no excuse.

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I couldn't believe she didn't pull starters out earlier. It's like she didn't think we would make it to the second game using the bench with a double digit lead. She certainly decreased the odds of making it to a third game.

Someone said Stanford ended the game on a 17-2 run. I remember when we were only down by 2 and I was hoping that we could run some nice plays to get open 3's or Caldwell create her own shots, but Stanford took that away so it was hopeless. They had so many easy shots it was unbelievable.

The short bench strategy goes way back. In our Final Four run, LG only played seven, dropping Lyles from the rotation in the NCAA's. In a year when you need to win some back-to-back games in the PAC12 tournament, as was the case this year, you are simply not prepared for that kind of a grind. Especially when you decide that you actually want to pick up the tempo, as they tried to do in this game.

annarborbear said:

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The short bench strategy goes way back.

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Back to Joanne Boyle, who frequently went with just five.

blungld said:

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HoopDreams said:

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Caldwell ...is not lighting quick with the ball, but her ball handling allows her to probe the defense to get a shot or a layup. Specifically, her use of change of speed, reverses, combo moves and step backs.

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I agree. Change of speed is how she makes up for her lack of quickness. KS has a little bit of the same arsenal, just not quite as assertive. A couple times in games she will drive into the paint under control, sometimes she will pull up or shoot a floater, but too often she still forces a dish to KA (she had a wide open layup last night she didn't take) or will shoot the floater when the glass is available

One funny aside. Have you noticed how RC initiates caldwell's drives with a hop step. It's a quirk. Looks like a pick-up basketball habit. Leaving the floor loses some control and slows her down, and doesn't seem to deceive the defender, but she does it to gain speed and assert her drive. I laugh every time she does it. And now AT and KS do it sometimes too. She actually is influencing her teammates perhaps subconsciously (or consciously) to imitate her mannerisms.

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Agree about kianna. High hoops IQ, great shooter with perfect form but not aggressive enough. She will have to change that next year as she will have to be one our primary scorers, even when she is playing pg.

Not sure what you're referring to regarding a hop step to initiate her drives. If you are referring to something that she does in the middle of her dribble then that's called a scissor step. A scissor step is one type of hesitation move. Some players 'hop' more than others when they use that move.

It's funny, because I noticed the young Stanford pg using the scissor step while running full speed (hard to do). I noticed because she was 'hopping' so high when she did it. At the time I didn't think of it as a hop...in thought it looked like a skip.

Anyway, the scissor step fools the defender into thinking the ball handler is stopping to shoot, or stopping to pass, so they stop their backward defensive momentum for a micro second, but just enough for the ball handler to drive pass them to the point of no recovery

Does that make sense? (Sorry, easier to show then describe)

HoopDreams said:

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blungld said:

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HoopDreams said:

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Caldwell ...is not lighting quick with the ball, but her ball handling allows her to probe the defense to get a shot or a layup. Specifically, her use of change of speed, reverses, combo moves and step backs.

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I agree. Change of speed is how she makes up for her lack of quickness. KS has a little bit of the same arsenal, just not quite as assertive. A couple times in games she will drive into the paint under control, sometimes she will pull up or shoot a floater, but too often she still forces a dish to KA (she had a wide open layup last night she didn't take) or will shoot the floater when the glass is available

One funny aside. Have you noticed how RC initiates caldwell's drives with a hop step. It's a quirk. Looks like a pick-up basketball habit. Leaving the floor loses some control and slows her down, and doesn't seem to deceive the defender, but she does it to gain speed and assert her drive. I laugh every time she does it. And now AT and KS do it sometimes too. She actually is influencing her teammates perhaps subconsciously (or consciously) to imitate her mannerisms.

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Agree about kianna. High hoops IQ, great shooter with perfect form but not aggressive enough. She will have to change that next year as she will have to be one our primary scorers, even when she is playing pg.

Not sure what you're referring to regarding a hop step to initiate her drives. If you are referring to something that she does in the middle of her dribble then that's called a scissor step. A scissor step is one type of hesitation move. Some players 'hop' more than others when they use that move.

It's funny, because I noticed the young Stanford pg using the scissor step while running full speed (hard to do). I noticed because she was 'hopping' so high when she did it. At the time I didn't think of it as a hop...in thought it looked like a skip.

Anyway, the scissor step fools the defender into thinking the ball handler is stopping to shoot, or stopping to pass, so they stop their backward defensive momentum for a micro second, but just enough for the ball handler to drive pass them to the point of no recovery

Does that make sense? (Sorry, easier to show then describe)

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The Kianna Smith we saw last season in the NCAA Tournament vs. Virginia was deliberate and assertive in the absence of Kristine. She scored 20, had 4 rebounds and 8 assists. That's the Kianna Smith I expect to see next season. CJ West was also more aggressive offensively in that game with 14 points.

HoopDreams said:

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Anyway, the scissor step fools the defender into thinking the ball handler is stopping to shoot, or stopping to pass, so they stop their backward defensive momentum for a micro second, but just enough for the ball handler to drive pass them to the point of no recovery

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It could be, but I don't think so. Take a look next game and tell me what you see. She definitely doesn't do it to change direction. I think she does it when she is driving around a screen--it looks like a hop trying to get momentum. It was something I hadn't seen AT or KS do until the last few games (maybe I just hadn't noticed). It seems like they are copying her.

You can never fault a player for not stepping up. The stars are not usually the ones who shine right now. It's the role players. But you can't fault them either. Just have to tip your hat to the Victor.

SFCALBear72 said:

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Earlier in the season I think Caldwell was reluctant to exert her leadership skills because she was the "new kid in town" and didn't want to disrespect KA and AT.

Now, she's gotten the green light and is leading this team by example. She's never been to the NCAA Tournament as a player. She wants it badly and is determined to take her teammates with her on this journey.

I wish there was a way she could stay another year to offer guidance to the young guards joining this team.

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Recee is the adult on the team. Not that anyone else is immature (as far as I know), but I truly enjoy and respect the way R.C. has handled herself this year, and I so wish we could have her for another season, or two, or three.

Kookiebean said:

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You can never fault a player for not stepping up. The stars are not usually the ones who shine right now. It's the role players. But you can't fault them either. Just have to tip your hat to the Victor.

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Agreed, but this has been season long. Stanfurd a very good team who beat us (might have been a little clsoer if KA got some calls though).

blungld said:

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HoopDreams said:

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the scissor step fools the defender into thinking the ball handler is stopping to shoot, or stopping to pass, so they stop their backward defensive momentum for a micro second, but just enough for the ball handler to drive pass them to the point of no recovery

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It could be, but I don't think so. Take a look next game and tell me what you see. She definitely doesn't do it to change direction. I think she does it when she is driving around a screen--it looks like a hop trying to get momentum. It was something I hadn't seen AT or KS do until the last few games (maybe I just hadn't noticed). It seems like they are copying her.

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If you look at my description, I didn't say a scissor is to change direction, although your video shows how you can use it for that too. The scissor is primarily a hesitation/change of speed move. Most commonly used during a dribble, but you can also use it to start a dribble (not very effective unless you are a big threat to just elevate and shoot). Watch this video which I think explains it better, although he doesn't talk about why it is effective until halfway through video



I will watch for Caldwell doing a 'hop' but if you look at my earlier posts about her, I talk about her hesitation moves. I didn't say 'scissor' moves because there are different types of scissor moves

blungld said:

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Kookiebean said:

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You can never fault a player for not stepping up. The stars are not usually the ones who shine right now. It's the role players. But you can't fault them either. Just have to tip your hat to the Victor.

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Agreed, but this has been season long. Stanfurd a very good team who beat us (might have been a little clsoer if KA got some calls though).

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You can't expect the role players to step up and score when their role all season is to pass it into the post. We basically underutilized the other players all year. If we did half of what others teams do, the role players would score a lot more.

BearBint said:

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Recee is the adult on the team. Not that anyone else is immature (as far as I know), but I truly enjoy and respect the way R.C. has handled herself this year, and I so wish we could have her for another season, or two, or three.

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She's a grad student. Maybe she can become a graduate assistant.