sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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If the Israeli government does not want people to assume they have genocidal intent, then they should stop saying that they do.

⚡️🇮🇱Israel’s Minister of Finance Bezalel Smotrich:

"We conquer, cleanse, and stay... On the way, we annihilate everything that still remains.….We're breaking Gaza apart, leaving it as a pile of rubble, total unprecedented destruction."pic.twitter.com/5bDj27gcyQ

— Suppressed News. (@SuppressedNws) August 18, 2025

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Picking an extremist viewpoint/person and suggesting that person speaks for the Israeli government is more bad faith. He represents an extreme (and abhorrent) viewpoint that is not the government's position and not widely held in Israel. Israel has agreed to a cease fire - Hamas has not.

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Seems like he has a pretty high position in the government, though. Him still being there despite saying stuff like this suggests that his views are not actually extreme.

I actually think it's weird that you keep dismissing these guys as not relevant to Israel's positions when it seems pretty obvious that they are.

---

You (and Eastern Oregon Bear below) obviously have no idea how coalition governments work in parliamentarian system such as the one Israel has. That is the unfortunate reality of Israeli government where no party has a majority - small parties (often with extreme views) are given positions in the coalition cabinet. It doesn't mean their views are widespread or have influence on government policy.

And in the case of decisions regarding Gaza, Israel is operating under an emergency war cabinet which includes the minority parties. As a result, extremist parties have lost their ability to influence war power. So in that context, this guy is literally irrelevant to Israel's position on Gaza which is being established by the larger cabinet.

In terms of your final sentence, there is nothing "obvious" about this wacko having actual influence. What is your evidence that he does?

sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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Israel can do what it wants. We don't have total control over their decisions. I think that:

1. "Removing Hamas from Gaza forever" is not an achievable military goal and is akin to the US trying to defeat all terrorism post-9/11. That's just not how it works.

2. If Israel wants to pursue this (IMO) impossible goal, the US does not need to keep giving them any help. Let them do it on their own.

---

This is now the third strawman you've constructed on this issue and it seems pretty clear it is not an accident. Removing Hamas from power is not the same thing as removing Hamas from Gaza forever.

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How do you prevent Hamas from returning to power? They're not an organization led by one guy. Continued occupation?

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How did the US/allies prevent the fascists from returning to power in Germany, Italy and Japan? They established governance systems and eventually governments where the fascists were not allowed. Germany still had Nazis in its society - but they were deprived of power.

Israel, the US, Egypt and particularly Qatar can defund and sideline Hamas if they want to, particularly now that Iran and Hezbollah have been sidelined. And if, over time, the Palestinians absolutely insist on having Hamas represent them, then they won't get a state and will suffer the consequences. They have agency.

sycasey said:

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I'm sure at one time Smotrich and Ben-Gvir were fringe figures in Israeli politics. That no longer seems to be the case.

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You keep making these overly broad conclusory statements while providing no explanation or evidence. I get it - thinking and explaining is hard.

Since your concerned about the radicalization of the Israeli government, I can't help but wonder. Which members of Hamas/Gaza government are in favor of peace with Israel and a two state solution? Can you name one?

Because you have a real obsession with extremist Israeli politicians, but a real blind spot for criticizing anyone in Hamas (or for that matter in the PA).

sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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I'm sure at one time Smotrich and Ben-Gvir were fringe figures in Israeli politics. That no longer seems to be the case.

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You keep making these overly broad conclusory statements while providing no explanation or evidence. I get it - thinking and explaining is hard.

Since your concerned about the radicalization of the Israeli government, I can't help but wonder. Which members of Hamas/Gaza government are in favor of peace with Israel and a two state solution? Can you name one?

Because you have a real obsession with extremist Israeli politicians, but a real blind spot for criticizing anyone in Hamas (or for that matter in the PA).

---

I have called Hamas a violent terrorist organization multiple times on this board. Obviously they are not going to be part of the solution either. Happy now?

I talk about Israel more often because they clearly have more power in this conflict and because we (the US) still support them despite what I see as unacceptable actions and policies. How many times must I explain this?

If Israel is going to enact some kind of Marshall Plan to reconstruct government in Gaza, then that will be great. That's not what their ministers are talking about, though, so I don't believe that is the plan. Seems like the plan is to remove the Palestinians (starve them out) and take over the territory. My evidence for that is ministers in the Israeli government saying that is the plan. If you have evidence that they have another plan, please present it.

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For one, Israel is not starving out the Gazans. Hamas is starving the Gazans. You don't see any starving Hamas operatives or, for that matter, many starving adults.

GHF is backed by the Israeli and US governments and has surged food into Gaza. That is one of the things Bibi and his ministers are "talking about."

Today, our Saudi Neighborhood site received:

➡️ 399,168 meals,
➡️ One truckload of potatoes,
➡️ One truckload of onions, and
➡️ 6,250 RUSF packs to treat severe acute malnutrition.

In total: Over 1.4 million meals across three sites delivered efficiently, directly, and freely. pic.twitter.com/X2OiK0XZXC

— Gaza Humanitarian Foundation (@GHFUpdates) August 18, 2025

If Israel wanted Gaza, it would not have left 20 years ago. It could have removed the Palestinians in the past 20 months but has not done so. The current plan - after Hamas rejected the most recent cease fire proposal - was to retake Gaza temporarily. That was viewed as a last resort after Hamas rejected the plan supported by Qatar, US, and Egypt among others. Netanyahu specifically said they did not want to permanently occupy Gaza but would invade to remove Hamas from power. Clearly the intention was to increase pressure on Hamas.

Notably, as of this evening, it appears Hamas may have blinked as there are reports they have accepted the cease fire. I'm doubtful as we've seen this before, but hopefully that is the case.

In terms of the bolded, your brain has been polluted by amoral notions of intersectionality and victimhood (probably with "anti-colonialism" thrown in). The fact that Israeli's have power doesn't make Hamas the victims.

It is wrong to hold the Israelis to a higher standard based on your view of "power" for many reasons, not the least of which it expresses the bigotry of low expectations. Do you truly find the Israeli "actions and polices" worse than Hamas'? If so, then you should say so. If not, then you're really just arguing that Israel should surrender because Hamas is vile and you excuse it. You wouldn't impost that obligation on the US (or probably any other country) - only Israel.

I note that you still have not suggested how Hamas can be removed and/or a lasting peace can be reached. You just want Israel to surrender and go back to 10/6 where Gaza eventually becomes a threat again.

BearGoggles said:

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In terms of the bolded, your brain has been polluted by amoral notions of intersectionality and victimhood (probably with "anti-colonialism" thrown in). The fact that Israeli's have power doesn't make Hamas the victims.

It is wrong to hold the Israelis to a higher standard based on your view of "power" for many reasons, not the least of which it expresses the bigotry of low expectations. Do you truly find the Israeli "actions and polices" worse than Hamas'? If so, then you should say so. If not, then you're really just arguing that Israel should surrender because Hamas is vile and you excuse it. You wouldn't impost that obligation on the US (or probably any other country) - only Israel.

I note that you still have not suggested how Hamas can be removed and/or a lasting peace can be reached. You just want Israel to surrender and go back to 10/6 where Gaza eventually becomes a threat again.

---

This last part is insane and in no way resembles anything I have argued thus far. You are simply putting words in my mouth at this point and I see no reason to continue the discussion.

BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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Israel can do what it wants. We don't have total control over their decisions. I think that:

1. "Removing Hamas from Gaza forever" is not an achievable military goal and is akin to the US trying to defeat all terrorism post-9/11. That's just not how it works.

2. If Israel wants to pursue this (IMO) impossible goal, the US does not need to keep giving them any help. Let them do it on their own.

---

This is now the third strawman you've constructed on this issue and it seems pretty clear it is not an accident. Removing Hamas from power is not the same thing as removing Hamas from Gaza forever.

---

How do you prevent Hamas from returning to power? They're not an organization led by one guy. Continued occupation?

---

How did the US/allies prevent the fascists from returning to power in Germany, Italy and Japan? They established governance systems and eventually governments where the fascists were not allowed. Germany still had Nazis in its society - but they were deprived of power.

Israel, the US, Egypt and particularly Qatar can defund and sideline Hamas if they want to, particularly now that Iran and Hezbollah have been sidelined. And if, over time, the Palestinians absolutely insist on having Hamas represent them, then they won't get a state and will suffer the consequences. They have agency.

---

This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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In terms of the bolded, your brain has been polluted by amoral notions of intersectionality and victimhood (probably with "anti-colonialism" thrown in). The fact that Israeli's have power doesn't make Hamas the victims.

It is wrong to hold the Israelis to a higher standard based on your view of "power" for many reasons, not the least of which it expresses the bigotry of low expectations. Do you truly find the Israeli "actions and polices" worse than Hamas'? If so, then you should say so. If not, then you're really just arguing that Israel should surrender because Hamas is vile and you excuse it. You wouldn't impost that obligation on the US (or probably any other country) - only Israel.

I note that you still have not suggested how Hamas can be removed and/or a lasting peace can be reached. You just want Israel to surrender and go back to 10/6 where Gaza eventually becomes a threat again.

---

This last part is insane and in no way resembles anything I have argued thus far. You are simply putting words in my mouth at this point and I see no reason to continue the discussion.

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Quite funny from the guy who has been constructing strawman arguments for the past several days. And to be clear, I'm not putting words in your mouth. What I wrote is the logical extension (and consequence) of the criticisms you offer. You can't explain how Hamas is removed with the policies you advance.

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Hamas is a nebulous organization based around an idea and can only be "removed" by demonstrating to the Palestinian population that there is a better way than violence and terrorism. If the oppression continues more people will just keep signing up. Still waiting for the rebuilding plan in Gaza.

Or, I guess, you could just remove the population entirely, but I don't think that's feasible or that it actually solves anything in the long term.

What you see as the "logical extension" is nothing of the sort. Just more of the usual emotional ranting that Israel's supporters go into when you start criticizing their favorite country's actions. Conflating the Palestinian civilian population with "Hamas," accusations of antisemitism, that kind of thing. I've seen it before.

tequila4kapp said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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BearGoggles said:

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sycasey said:

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Israel can do what it wants. We don't have total control over their decisions. I think that:

1. "Removing Hamas from Gaza forever" is not an achievable military goal and is akin to the US trying to defeat all terrorism post-9/11. That's just not how it works.

2. If Israel wants to pursue this (IMO) impossible goal, the US does not need to keep giving them any help. Let them do it on their own.

---

This is now the third strawman you've constructed on this issue and it seems pretty clear it is not an accident. Removing Hamas from power is not the same thing as removing Hamas from Gaza forever.

---

How do you prevent Hamas from returning to power? They're not an organization led by one guy. Continued occupation?

---

How did the US/allies prevent the fascists from returning to power in Germany, Italy and Japan? They established governance systems and eventually governments where the fascists were not allowed. Germany still had Nazis in its society - but they were deprived of power.

Israel, the US, Egypt and particularly Qatar can defund and sideline Hamas if they want to, particularly now that Iran and Hezbollah have been sidelined. And if, over time, the Palestinians absolutely insist on having Hamas represent them, then they won't get a state and will suffer the consequences. They have agency.

---

This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

Anarchistbear said:

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tequila4kapp said:

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This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

---

IRA to Hamas is not a valid comparison. The IRA's terrorists acts stopped when they got power because them getting power was itself a goal of their organization (self determination). Hamas has had power for 20 years. The terror attacks have never stopped because their goal isn't self determination alone, it is to retake all land, kill all Jews and eliminate the state of Israel. I think the PA has still officially recognized the state of Israel but it does things that are anti-ethical to that recognition, such as paying pensions to terrorists. As Gold Meier said (potentially paraphrasing) - we will never have peace until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Jews.

I prefer a 2 state solution but there can be never be one as long as Palestinians are allowed to have those underlying goals. It is that simple. If they insist on having those goals then the best (?) scenario for them will be to live under Israeli authority. I do think there is an opportunity for a Japan-like transition period of occupation but again, the key component it is Palestinians changing these core beliefs.

We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

tequila4kapp said:

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Anarchistbear said:

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tequila4kapp said:

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This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

---

IRA to Hamas is not a valid comparison. The IRA's terrorists acts stopped when they got power because them getting power was itself a goal of their organization (self determination). Hamas has had power for 20 years. The terror attacks have never stopped because their goal isn't self determination alone, it is to retake all land, kill all Jews and eliminate the state of Israel. I think the PA has still officially recognized the state of Israel but it does things that are anti-ethical to that recognition, such as paying pensions to terrorists. As Gold Meier said (potentially paraphrasing) - we will never have peace until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Jews.

I prefer a 2 state solution but there can be never be one as long as Palestinians are allowed to have those underlying goals. It is that simple. If they insist on having those goals then the best (?) scenario for them will be to live under Israeli authority. I do think there is an opportunity for a Japan-like transition period of occupation but again, the key component it is Palestinians changing these core beliefs.

We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

---

If Israel wants to be a continual occupying power then like the Nazis did in their conquests they can put whoever they want in charge. What you note for the Palestinians ( without irony) is more true for the Israelis- they are systematically starving and murdering Palestinians while creating a greater Jewish state.

But that is their business; it's not in our interests to support a bunch of genocidal religious zealots in their apocalyptic visions. We shouldn't be arming or supporting them

There is no two state solution- neither side wants it.

tequila4kapp said:

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We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

---

Serious question: what is our interest? What do we get out of the alliance with Israel?

Cal88 said:

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That boy molester pedo is not just an Israeli tourist, he's the head of an Israeli intelligence agency. As well his release on bail was permitted due to the intervention of the chief federal law enforcement officer in the District of Nevada, who is an Israeli citizen.

---

First of all, Alexandrovich should never have been let go.

That being said: (i) he was let go by a state court judge; (ii) the Trump admin has specifically said they did not intervene; and (iii) he was not the head of an Israeli intelligence agency.

As usual, you have no citation for the disinformation you post. What he did is gross and wrong - he belongs in jail pending a resolution. But the fact that you can't simply say that and feel the need to layer on unproven allegations (really falsities) is bizarre. You can't help but dissemble. It is a mental illness.

The Department of State is aware that Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, an Israeli citizen, was arrested in Las Vegas and given a court date for charges related to soliciting sex electronically from a minor. He did not claim diplomatic immunity and was released by a state judge pending a…

— U.S. State Dept - Near Eastern Affairs (@StateDept_NEA) August 18, 2025

Anarchistbear said:

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tequila4kapp said:

---

Anarchistbear said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

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This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

---

IRA to Hamas is not a valid comparison. The IRA's terrorists acts stopped when they got power because them getting power was itself a goal of their organization (self determination). Hamas has had power for 20 years. The terror attacks have never stopped because their goal isn't self determination alone, it is to retake all land, kill all Jews and eliminate the state of Israel. I think the PA has still officially recognized the state of Israel but it does things that are anti-ethical to that recognition, such as paying pensions to terrorists. As Gold Meier said (potentially paraphrasing) - we will never have peace until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Jews.

I prefer a 2 state solution but there can be never be one as long as Palestinians are allowed to have those underlying goals. It is that simple. If they insist on having those goals then the best (?) scenario for them will be to live under Israeli authority. I do think there is an opportunity for a Japan-like transition period of occupation but again, the key component it is Palestinians changing these core beliefs.

We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

---

If Israel wants to be a continual occupying power then like the Nazis did in their conquests they can put whoever they want in charge. What you note for the Palestinians ( without irony) is more true for the Israelis- they are systematically starving and murdering Palestinians while creating a greater Jewish state.

But that is their business; it's not in our interests to support a bunch of genocidal religious zealots in their apocalyptic visions. We shouldn't be arming or supporting them

There is no two state solution- neither side wants it.

---

As usual, you have things backwards. Hamas - by their own admission - are the genocidal fascists. Israel - like the allied powers in WWII - isthe country that responded after being attacked and is now occupying Gaza to prevent a further attack.

If Hamas surrendered, there would be no more hunger or killing in Gaza (other than perhaps more violence from the Palestinians). Full stop.

BearGoggles said:

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Anarchistbear said:

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tequila4kapp said:

---

Anarchistbear said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

---

IRA to Hamas is not a valid comparison. The IRA's terrorists acts stopped when they got power because them getting power was itself a goal of their organization (self determination). Hamas has had power for 20 years. The terror attacks have never stopped because their goal isn't self determination alone, it is to retake all land, kill all Jews and eliminate the state of Israel. I think the PA has still officially recognized the state of Israel but it does things that are anti-ethical to that recognition, such as paying pensions to terrorists. As Gold Meier said (potentially paraphrasing) - we will never have peace until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Jews.

I prefer a 2 state solution but there can be never be one as long as Palestinians are allowed to have those underlying goals. It is that simple. If they insist on having those goals then the best (?) scenario for them will be to live under Israeli authority. I do think there is an opportunity for a Japan-like transition period of occupation but again, the key component it is Palestinians changing these core beliefs.

We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

---

If Israel wants to be a continual occupying power then like the Nazis did in their conquests they can put whoever they want in charge. What you note for the Palestinians ( without irony) is more true for the Israelis- they are systematically starving and murdering Palestinians while creating a greater Jewish state.

But that is their business; it's not in our interests to support a bunch of genocidal religious zealots in their apocalyptic visions. We shouldn't be arming or supporting them

There is no two state solution- neither side wants it.

---

As usual, you have things backwards. Hamas - by their own admission - are the genocidal fascists. Israel - like the allied powers in WWII - isthe country that responded after being attacked and is now occupying Gaza to prevent a further attack.

If Hamas surrendered, there would be no more hunger or killing in Gaza (other than perhaps more violence from the Palestinians). Full stop.

---

Oh I don't think I have things backwards at all. You are blinded by loyalty to tribe not country

Anarchistbear said:

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BearGoggles said:

---

Anarchistbear said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

Anarchistbear said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

This is exactly what is needed. No party can exist that calls for the elimination of Israel, killing of Jews, paying pensions to terrorists, etc. Those beliefs have to be illegal. Bad news for every political party in existence today but it's the only way if the Palestinians are to remain in greater Israel.

---

These things are fluid. The IRA was a terrorist organization until they got political power. The US deals with "terrorist " governments repeatedly- the Taliban, Syria. It's not our business- it's the Palestinians . If Israel wants to impose rules about what countries can exist let them do so without our money and arms.

---

IRA to Hamas is not a valid comparison. The IRA's terrorists acts stopped when they got power because them getting power was itself a goal of their organization (self determination). Hamas has had power for 20 years. The terror attacks have never stopped because their goal isn't self determination alone, it is to retake all land, kill all Jews and eliminate the state of Israel. I think the PA has still officially recognized the state of Israel but it does things that are anti-ethical to that recognition, such as paying pensions to terrorists. As Gold Meier said (potentially paraphrasing) - we will never have peace until the Palestinians love their children more than they hate Jews.

I prefer a 2 state solution but there can be never be one as long as Palestinians are allowed to have those underlying goals. It is that simple. If they insist on having those goals then the best (?) scenario for them will be to live under Israeli authority. I do think there is an opportunity for a Japan-like transition period of occupation but again, the key component it is Palestinians changing these core beliefs.

We absolutely do have an interest in Israel's fate. We should arm and support them.

---

If Israel wants to be a continual occupying power then like the Nazis did in their conquests they can put whoever they want in charge. What you note for the Palestinians ( without irony) is more true for the Israelis- they are systematically starving and murdering Palestinians while creating a greater Jewish state.

But that is their business; it's not in our interests to support a bunch of genocidal religious zealots in their apocalyptic visions. We shouldn't be arming or supporting them

There is no two state solution- neither side wants it.

---

As usual, you have things backwards. Hamas - by their own admission - are the genocidal fascists. Israel - like the allied powers in WWII - isthe country that responded after being attacked and is now occupying Gaza to prevent a further attack.

If Hamas surrendered, there would be no more hunger or killing in Gaza (other than perhaps more violence from the Palestinians). Full stop.

---

Oh I don't think I have things backwards at all. You are blinded by loyalty to tribe not country

---

Also, let's not forget that Netanyahu originally encouraged support for Hamas, because he wanted to stall hopes of a two-state solution and mistakenly thought he could contain Hamas there. Yes, Hamas sucks but Israel also bears some responsibility for them being in charge.

BearGoggles said:

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Cal88 said:

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That boy molester pedo is not just an Israeli tourist, he's the head of an Israeli intelligence agency. As well his release on bail was permitted due to the intervention of the chief federal law enforcement officer in the District of Nevada, who is an Israeli citizen.

---

First of all, Alexandrovich should never have been let go.

That being said: (i) he was let go by a state court judge; (ii) the Trump admin has specifically said they did not intervene; and (iii) he was not the head of an Israeli intelligence agency.

As usual, you have no citation for the disinformation you post. What he did is gross and wrong - he belongs in jail pending a resolution. But the fact that you can't simply say that and feel the need to layer on unproven allegations (really falsities) is bizarre. You can't help but dissemble. It is a mental illness.

The Department of State is aware that Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, an Israeli citizen, was arrested in Las Vegas and given a court date for charges related to soliciting sex electronically from a minor. He did not claim diplomatic immunity and was released by a state judge pending a…

— U.S. State Dept - Near Eastern Affairs (@StateDept_NEA) August 18, 2025

---

The Israeli pedo perv in question, Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, is the Executive Director of the Defense Division at the Israel National Cyber Directorate. Somehow, he was the only one of 8 other men apprehended in that sting operation that got away.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Cyber_Security_Authority_(Israel)#2025_Nevada_Arrest_of_Tom_Alexandrovich

Your over the top personal attacks are what is bizarre here.


"How was an alleged Israeli 'child sex predator' allowed to leave the US?
Release of senior Israeli official facing serious child sex charges in Nevada stirs controversy and raises questions.

A senior Israeli official was arrested in the United States earlier this month and charged with seeking sexual conduct with a minor, only to be released on bail with no conditions or monitoring, allowing him to flee to Israel.

The case involving Tom Artiom Alexandrovich in Nevada is now stirring controversy, with politicians and social media commentators accusing the government of interfering in the judicial process to allow the cybersecurity official to return home without facing justice.

On Monday, the US Department of State was prompted to weigh in, posting on X that any "claims that the US government intervened are false".

Court records from Nevada's Clark County show that Alexandrovich was charged with luring or attempting to lure a child online to engage in sexual conduct a felony that carries up to 10 years in jail in the case of a conviction. He was released on a $10,000 bond, but no monitoring appeared to take place.

Richard Davies, a criminal defence lawyer in Nevada, told Al Jazeera that the apparent lack of conditions on Alexandrovich's release despite the seriousness of the charges was "fishy".

"Average Joe gets arrested, he would appear in front of the justice of the peace within 24 hours. The justice of the peace in that county would issue bail conditions, which very typically would include a GPS device, restrictions on movement, not being allowed to leave the state," Davies said.

"So the fact that this individual was not only allowed to leave without an ankle bracelet or a GPS device, not only to leave the state, but also leave the country, is highly unusual and suspect."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/8/19/how-was-an-alleged-israeli-child-sex-predator-allowed-to-leave-the-us

Cal88 said:

---

BearGoggles said:

---

Cal88 said:

---

That boy molester pedo is not just an Israeli tourist, he's the head of an Israeli intelligence agency. As well his release on bail was permitted due to the intervention of the chief federal law enforcement officer in the District of Nevada, who is an Israeli citizen.

---

First of all, Alexandrovich should never have been let go.

That being said: (i) he was let go by a state court judge; (ii) the Trump admin has specifically said they did not intervene; and (iii) he was not the head of an Israeli intelligence agency.

As usual, you have no citation for the disinformation you post. What he did is gross and wrong - he belongs in jail pending a resolution. But the fact that you can't simply say that and feel the need to layer on unproven allegations (really falsities) is bizarre. You can't help but dissemble. It is a mental illness.

The Department of State is aware that Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, an Israeli citizen, was arrested in Las Vegas and given a court date for charges related to soliciting sex electronically from a minor. He did not claim diplomatic immunity and was released by a state judge pending a…

— U.S. State Dept - Near Eastern Affairs (@StateDept_NEA) August 18, 2025

---

The Israeli pedo perv in question, Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, is the Executive Director of the Defense Division at the Israel National Cyber Directorate. Somehow, he was the only one of 8 other men apprehended in that sting operation that got away.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Cyber_Security_Authority_(Israel)#2025_Nevada_Arrest_of_Tom_Alexandrovich

Your over the top personal attacks are what is bizarre here.


"How was an alleged Israeli 'child sex predator' allowed to leave the US?
Release of senior Israeli official facing serious child sex charges in Nevada stirs controversy and raises questions.

A senior Israeli official was arrested in the United States earlier this month and charged with seeking sexual conduct with a minor, only to be released on bail with no conditions or monitoring, allowing him to flee to Israel.

The case involving Tom Artiom Alexandrovich in Nevada is now stirring controversy, with politicians and social media commentators accusing the government of interfering in the judicial process to allow the cybersecurity official to return home without facing justice.

On Monday, the US Department of State was prompted to weigh in, posting on X that any "claims that the US government intervened are false".

Court records from Nevada's Clark County show that Alexandrovich was charged with luring or attempting to lure a child online to engage in sexual conduct a felony that carries up to 10 years in jail in the case of a conviction. He was released on a $10,000 bond, but no monitoring appeared to take place.

Richard Davies, a criminal defence lawyer in Nevada, told Al Jazeera that the apparent lack of conditions on Alexandrovich's release despite the seriousness of the charges was "fishy".

"Average Joe gets arrested, he would appear in front of the justice of the peace within 24 hours. The justice of the peace in that county would issue bail conditions, which very typically would include a GPS device, restrictions on movement, not being allowed to leave the state," Davies said.

"So the fact that this individual was not only allowed to leave without an ankle bracelet or a GPS device, not only to leave the state, but also leave the country, is highly unusual and suspect."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/8/19/how-was-an-alleged-israeli-child-sex-predator-allowed-to-leave-the-us

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So you agree he wasn't the " head of an Israeli intelligence agency" as you originally claimed, but instead a division head. Big difference there.

Per your own link: "The U.S. State Department said they were aware of the arrest and added "[Alexandrovich] did not claim diplomatic immunity and was released by a state judge pending a court date. Any claims that the U.S. government intervened are false "

Your citing a random attorney, quoted by highly biased Al Jezzerra, is not proof that this defendant was treated differently. You also fail to mention that others were arrested with Alexandrovich and received exactly the same treatment.

Here is an actual news story, quotes below::

https://www.8newsnow.com/investigators/las-vegas-israeli-official-posted-standard-bail-never-saw-judge-before-release-da-confirms/

Criminal cases in Nevada begin in justice court, which townships administer. The courts, including Henderson Justice Court, offer a standard bail schedule where defendants can pay to bail out of jail for most charges, including felonies. While the FBI and federal officials were involved in Alexandrovich's arrest, the Clark County District Attorney's Office is prosecuting the case. Most sex-crime cases in Southern Nevada are handled by task forces comprised of federal, state and local partners.

Alexandrovich posted $10,000 bail shortly after his arrest, court records showed. The process allows defendants to pay the fee and waive their right to a probable cause hearing, which the justice court oversees.

"There was no court involvement," Clark County District Attorney Steve Wolfson said Tuesday. "There was no prosecution involvement. This is the normal practice. It is very standard in this community and many communities across the country."

A 2020 Nevada Supreme Court decision changed the state's bail system, making the payment "necessary to reasonably ensure the defendant's appearance."

"He was booked into jail. He posted the $10,000 bail very quickly and was released before his case even needed to go before a judge," Wolfson said, "And it's not only this, individual defendant. There were three or four others that, like him, posted the bail right away, so there was no court appearance."

Alexandrovich did not appear before a judge and posted bond before his state-entitled probable cause hearing and before prosecutors filed a criminal complaint against him, the 8 News Now Investigators reported Monday. Thus, no judge could put any added restrictions on his release. While a judge later reviewed the bail, there was no physical hearing and the judge had no mechanism to add further restrictions.

In addition to Alexandrovich, seven other defendants face similar charges connected to the sting.
Interim U.S. Attorney for Nevada Sigal Chattah blamed Wolfson and a "state court judge" for failing to require Alexandrovich to surrender his passport after posting bail, however, neither had anything to do with the process. The justice court sets the standard bail schedule, and the process to bail out at that point post-arrest does not involve the district attorney's office nor any judge.

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More details in these threads, including how bad actors are spreading misinformation that you willing adopt and broadcast.

I just looked at the Tom Artiom Alexandrovich case, since it keeps showing up in my newsfeed. Here are some takeaways:

- This was a standard sting operation. Cops used a 15 year old girl decoy and nabbed 8 grown men trying to come meet her for you know what -- including an…

— Marina Medvin 🇺🇸 (@MarinaMedvin) August 19, 2025

The lies about this case were of course spread by communists and Islamists. https://t.co/1DddmncXk4

— Marina Medvin 🇺🇸 (@MarinaMedvin) August 19, 2025

Personally, I don't like the system described above. I think he should be in jail and/or at a minimum have his passport confiscated. But all the evidence shows Alexandrovich did not receive special treatment and there is literally no reliable evidence to the contrary.

Also, per the tweets above, it appears Alexandrovich will/should be extradited if charged. I certainly hope that is the case.

Cal88 said:

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BearGoggles said:

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Cal88 said:

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BearGoggles said:

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Cal88 said:

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That boy molester pedo is not just an Israeli tourist, he's the head of an Israeli intelligence agency. As well his release on bail was permitted due to the intervention of the chief federal law enforcement officer in the District of Nevada, who is an Israeli citizen.

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First of all, Alexandrovich should never have been let go.

That being said: (i) he was let go by a state court judge; (ii) the Trump admin has specifically said they did not intervene; and (iii) he was not the head of an Israeli intelligence agency.

As usual, you have no citation for the disinformation you post. What he did is gross and wrong - he belongs in jail pending a resolution. But the fact that you can't simply say that and feel the need to layer on unproven allegations (really falsities) is bizarre. You can't help but dissemble. It is a mental illness.

The Department of State is aware that Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, an Israeli citizen, was arrested in Las Vegas and given a court date for charges related to soliciting sex electronically from a minor. He did not claim diplomatic immunity and was released by a state judge pending a…

— U.S. State Dept - Near Eastern Affairs (@StateDept_NEA) August 18, 2025

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The Israeli pedo perv in question, Tom Artiom Alexandrovich, is the Executive Director of the Defense Division at the Israel National Cyber Directorate. Somehow, he was the only one of 8 other men apprehended in that sting operation that got away.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Cyber_Security_Authority_(Israel)#2025_Nevada_Arrest_of_Tom_Alexandrovich

Your over the top personal attacks are what is bizarre here.


"How was an alleged Israeli 'child sex predator' allowed to leave the US?
Release of senior Israeli official facing serious child sex charges in Nevada stirs controversy and raises questions.

A senior Israeli official was arrested in the United States earlier this month and charged with seeking sexual conduct with a minor, only to be released on bail with no conditions or monitoring, allowing him to flee to Israel.

The case involving Tom Artiom Alexandrovich in Nevada is now stirring controversy, with politicians and social media commentators accusing the government of interfering in the judicial process to allow the cybersecurity official to return home without facing justice.

On Monday, the US Department of State was prompted to weigh in, posting on X that any "claims that the US government intervened are false".

Court records from Nevada's Clark County show that Alexandrovich was charged with luring or attempting to lure a child online to engage in sexual conduct a felony that carries up to 10 years in jail in the case of a conviction. He was released on a $10,000 bond, but no monitoring appeared to take place.

Richard Davies, a criminal defence lawyer in Nevada, told Al Jazeera that the apparent lack of conditions on Alexandrovich's release despite the seriousness of the charges was "fishy".

"Average Joe gets arrested, he would appear in front of the justice of the peace within 24 hours. The justice of the peace in that county would issue bail conditions, which very typically would include a GPS device, restrictions on movement, not being allowed to leave the state," Davies said.

"So the fact that this individual was not only allowed to leave without an ankle bracelet or a GPS device, not only to leave the state, but also leave the country, is highly unusual and suspect."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/8/19/how-was-an-alleged-israeli-child-sex-predator-allowed-to-leave-the-us

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So you agree he wasn't the " head of an Israeli intelligence agency" as you originally claimed, but instead a division head. Big difference there.

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This kind of dishonest pedantry is why the legal profession has a bad reputation.

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Also, per the tweets above, it appears Alexandrovich will/should be extradited if charged. I certainly hope that is the case.

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There are dozens of American sex offenders/child molesters who have fled to Israel, where they find refuge and are not prosecuted, including at one time Jeffrey Epstein.

'Tip of the Iceberg': How Foreign Sex Offenders Find Refuge in Israel
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2022-07-25/ty-article/.premium/tip-of-the-iceberg-how-foreign-sex-offenders-find-refuge-in-israel/00000182-3532-d7e9-af96-3d73c52c0000

Tens of thousands of pedophiles operate in Israel every year
https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/tens-of-thousands-of-pedophiles-operate-in-israel-every-year-637393

As to your long-winded defense of the non-prosecution of the pedo Israeli intel head, I will just notice that, in an elaborate sting operation targeting 8 men, he was the only one that was able to flee the country, and that all of this happened under the watch of an Israeli dual citizen US Attorney who campaigned on putting pedos behind bars.

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Personally, I don't like the system described above. I think he should be in jail and/or at a minimum have his passport confiscated.

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Blame "the system" or "liberal judges" for the pedo Israeli intel head fleeing the country, but if a foreign student happens to write an editorial in the campus newspaper critical of Israel, then he's off to a black hole in Louisiana, no ifs ands or buts...

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It is rich for you to use the words " dishonest pedantry" after I demonstrated you were objectively wrong about your claims, not to mention your longstanding penchant for making unsupported claims based on random unverified sources. The projection is pretty obvious and funny. And then you repeat the provably false claim that this occurred under the "watch" of the US attorney who had no jurisdiction over any of the 8 defendants - read the article.

I note that, rather than acknowledging you were objectively wrong, you've tried to change the subject to other alleged Israeli sex offenders. Who is making dishonest arguments? No one is defending or excusing that. And if you're a supporter of Hamas, perhaps you should sit out discussions of rape/pedophilia which occurred on 10/7 and is accepted in some Muslim/Arab cultures (Bacha Bazi being just one example https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi).

And, of course, I did not (and do not) defend any pedophile including Alexandrovich. I did not defend his "non-prosecution". I specifically said he should have remained in jail, should have had his passport confiscated to prevent fleeing, and should now be extradited to face charges. You ignore that to lodge another specious allegations. You should be embarrassed by your dishonesty and poor arguments - but of course you're not.