The Five Big Questions facing Cal Football in 2025

BearSD said:

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6956bear said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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JeffMcd said:

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Hope is not a strategy. Why has it taken nine seasons for Wilcox to get a competent Offensive coaching staff? (With the exception of the one Spavital season). Thankfully we now have a Chancellor who abhors incompetence and will make sure ADs demand results. There's no excuse for the past 16 years of losing conference records. Lyons will do all he can to create a successful football program. He actually likes the sport.

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Lyons has already put himself on the record: 6 and 7 win seasons are NOT ACCEPTABLE anymore

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Yeah, except multiple chancellors have come in making big noise that we are striving for championships, something I have very much noted has been dropped from the messaging in recent years. And no actions were taken. No offense, but it is easy to say things. It is not easy to achieve things. Early comments on Christ were that she gets it and was going to turn things around and the program is possibly at its least healthy point in my lifetime.

Hiring Rivera was good. His botched messaging and massive delay in fixing the botched messaging, the protest that ensued, and the national coverage that ensued was like chopping off an arm and watching the person bleed out and putting on the tourniquet at the last possible second.

And if 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable, we have a coach who has failed to meet even that standard 4 times out of 8, and has only passed not acceptable 1 time in eight years, barely, winning 8 games once. Lyons had the opportunity to end that unacceptable situation and he didn't. And I know some of you are going to say he wasn't here long enough, he had other things to do, he didn't want Knowlton hiring the next guy or a bunch of other excuses for not taking decisive action, but the bottom line is he chose not to take decisive action, but instead chose to buy a truckload of lipstick to slap on the same old pig. If 6 and 7 win seasons were truly not acceptable Wilcox would be gone. Or is this like the tv show Barry where we are going to stop murdering the football program now...okay, now...okay, now...okay, now.

In any case, genuine good intentions or not, words and effort stopped meaning anything a long time ago. We'll know 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable when they actually stop.

Yes Christ did talk a big game.
But Lyons has not just talked a big game, he has provided Wilcox with the resources to make his talk a reality. That is the reason why Lyons says that 6 and 7 win seasons are no longer acceptable.

If Wilcox continues with his typical 5-7 win seasons, this will be his FINAL year as Cal's HC.

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I think he is likely gone even if he gets to 8.

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We don't live in a universe in which Cal will fire a coach after an 8-win season. Alabama might do that. Not Cal.

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

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BearSD said:

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6956bear said:

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I think he is likely gone even if he gets to 8.

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We don't live in a universe in which Cal will fire a coach after an 8-win season. Alabama might do that. Not Cal.

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calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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6956bear said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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JeffMcd said:

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Hope is not a strategy. Why has it taken nine seasons for Wilcox to get a competent Offensive coaching staff? (With the exception of the one Spavital season). Thankfully we now have a Chancellor who abhors incompetence and will make sure ADs demand results. There's no excuse for the past 16 years of losing conference records. Lyons will do all he can to create a successful football program. He actually likes the sport.

---

Lyons has already put himself on the record: 6 and 7 win seasons are NOT ACCEPTABLE anymore

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Yeah, except multiple chancellors have come in making big noise that we are striving for championships, something I have very much noted has been dropped from the messaging in recent years. And no actions were taken. No offense, but it is easy to say things. It is not easy to achieve things. Early comments on Christ were that she gets it and was going to turn things around and the program is possibly at its least healthy point in my lifetime.

Hiring Rivera was good. His botched messaging and massive delay in fixing the botched messaging, the protest that ensued, and the national coverage that ensued was like chopping off an arm and watching the person bleed out and putting on the tourniquet at the last possible second.

And if 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable, we have a coach who has failed to meet even that standard 4 times out of 8, and has only passed not acceptable 1 time in eight years, barely, winning 8 games once. Lyons had the opportunity to end that unacceptable situation and he didn't. And I know some of you are going to say he wasn't here long enough, he had other things to do, he didn't want Knowlton hiring the next guy or a bunch of other excuses for not taking decisive action, but the bottom line is he chose not to take decisive action, but instead chose to buy a truckload of lipstick to slap on the same old pig. If 6 and 7 win seasons were truly not acceptable Wilcox would be gone. Or is this like the tv show Barry where we are going to stop murdering the football program now...okay, now...okay, now...okay, now.

In any case, genuine good intentions or not, words and effort stopped meaning anything a long time ago. We'll know 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable when they actually stop.

Yes Christ did talk a big game.
But Lyons has not just talked a big game, he has provided Wilcox with the resources to make his talk a reality. That is the reason why Lyons says that 6 and 7 win seasons are no longer acceptable.

If Wilcox continues with his typical 5-7 win seasons, this will be his FINAL year as Cal's HC.

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I think he is likely gone even if he gets to 8.

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We don't live in a universe in which Cal will fire a coach after an 8-win season. Alabama might do that. Not Cal.

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Who is "Cal"? Not disagreeing with you necessarily. But are you saying Rivera/Lyons or just "the consensus"? That big donors would be satisfied and not be willing to put up money that Lyons would want put up before Wilcox gets fired? Or that big donors might push for yet another contract extension so that Wilcox doesn't go into year 10 with only 1 year left on his contract?

Also, is "8 wins" 7-5 (4-4) plus a win in a minor bowl?

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

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In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

The year before Colorado had the #79 Portal class, well behind #55 Jackson State, where Deion was then HC. Utah was #56, Purdue #63, Vanderbilt #65, Ohio State #73, Notre Dame #75.

Colorado alums are not the wealthiest in the country, and did not suddenly get richer going from #79 to #1 in a single year. Jackson State does not have a ton of NIL but they landed a better portal class than Ohio State or Notre Dame? Cmon, you have to admit the difference was Deion.

Last year, In his second year, Colorado pulled in the #8 transfer class.

So it isn't just NIL. Kids still want to play for a coach they want to play for. The best players want a shot at the NFL and a coach that has NFL cred, or a record of winning and sending players to the NFL. There is a reason Cal's best recruiting has been at DB given the same NIL funding source.

It isn't just up to the players to form chemistry. The coaches get paid $millions to be leaders and create that chemistry.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but Brennan Marion in his first year at Sac State just pulled in the #64 Portal Class (including Jaden Rashada) by far the highest for any FCS program and ahead of Pitt, BC, Tennessee, Northwestern, Florida, Clemson, BYU… Basically recruiting to an FCS like Deion did at Jackson State. It will be really interesting to see how he does in this his first year and how he uses Rashada. He also just got a commit from 4 Star WR Xavier McDonald out of Mississippi (beating out Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Florida State, Miami, Nebraska, Penn State, Tennessee….) with Sac State's 2026 HS recruiting currently ranked #53. Marion's personality, not Sac State's boosters, was far and away the difference.

Oh, and Marion's salary as Head Coach at Sac State is $350,000. Probably less than we are paying Rolovich as an "offensive assistant." People said we couldn't afford to fire Wilcox after he went 2-6 in the ACC last year, but Wilcox's contract is a sunk cost, like Knowlton's, the true incremental cost is his replacement and we had affordable options like Ron Rivera who came anyway, or an up and coming coach like Marion.

It will be interesting to see how Marion's offense looks this year and how flexible it can be. As OC at UNLV last year he had the #15 scoring offense. Someone to keep an eye on.

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6956bear said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

---

In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

The year before Colorado had the #79 Portal class, well behind #55 Jackson State, where Deion was then HC. Utah was #56, Purdue #63, Vanderbilt #65, Ohio State #73, Notre Dame #75.

Colorado alums are not the wealthiest in the country, and did not suddenly get richer going from #79 to #1 in a single year. Jackson State does not have a ton of NIL but they landed a better portal class than Ohio State or Notre Dame? Cmon, you have to admit the difference was Deion.

Last year, In his second year, Colorado pulled in the #8 transfer class.

So it isn't just NIL. Kids still want to play for a coach they want to play for. The best players want a shot at the NFL and a coach that has NFL cred, or a record of winning and sending players to the NFL. There is a reason Cal's best recruiting has been at DB given the same NIL funding source.

It isn't just up to the players to form chemistry. The coaches get paid $millions to be leaders and create that chemistry.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but Brennan Marion in his first year at Sac State just pulled in the #64 Portal Class (including Jaden Rashada) by far the highest for any FCS program and ahead of Pitt, BC, Tennessee, Northwestern, Florida, Clemson, BYU… Basically recruiting to an FCS like Deion did at Jackson State. It will be really interesting to see how he does in this his first year and how he uses Rashada. He also just got a commit from 4 Star WR Xavier McDonald out of Mississippi (beating out Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Florida State, Miami, Nebraska, Penn State, Tennessee….) with Sac State's 2026 HS recruiting currently ranked #53. Marion's personality, not Sac State's boosters, was far and away the difference.

Oh, and Marion's salary as Head Coach at Sac State is $350,000. Probably less than we are paying Rolovich as an "offensive assistant." People said we couldn't afford to fire Wilcox after he went 2-6 in the ACC last year, but Wilcox's contract is a sunk cost, like Knowlton's, the true incremental cost is his replacement and we had affordable options like Ron Rivera who came anyway, or an up and coming coach like Marion.

It will be interesting to see how Marion's offense looks this year and how flexible it can be. As OC at UNLV last year he had the #15 scoring offense. Someone to keep an eye on.

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I don't know what I have to do to debunk this. Colorado had the supposed #1 portal class Sanders' first year because they brought in 50 players. Their average player rating was very low. The transfer portal ranking that keeps getting cited is hot garbage. As was, by the way the Colorado team that played the season with the #1 transfer portal class. I'm pretty sure the actual top transfer portal class would have managed to finish somewhere in the top 11 of the PAC-12.

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Lots of good stuff has happened to Colorado football due to Deion. Yes that first season underwhelmed but the previous season they won but 1 game. Of course that 1 win came against our Bears. So they go 4-8 in year 1 then last season 9-4 and 7-2 in the Big 12. They had the Heisman trophy winner (Travis Hunter) and Shadeur Sanders was a very prolific college QB.

Many do not like how Colorado turned their program around. But they did do that. They are now a threat on the recruiting trail, and still a top draw on TV and they now fill their stadium and donations are up. Heck Deion does not even leave Boulder to recruit.

Cal should be so lucky. Cal has had a very high number of transfers these past 3 seasons. And they are still mediocre overall and a lower division team in the ACC. They are picked near the bottom this season, have an over/under win total of 5.5 and are a underdog to a team they beat 44-7 last season.

I do believe the best use of the portal is to supplement your roster to fill holes. But Cal has been a transfer portal user these past 3 cycles and the roster is still below average. And their HS recruiting is among the very worst in all the P4.

I am not advocating for how Deion did it, but the results are up. Colorado was way down. Some considered them the worst P4 program in the country when Deion took over. The game has become a professional endeavor. The players are paid. They can transfer every season without penalty. The players have agents. Realignment hovers over nearly every program in the Big 12 and ACC.

Cal if they want to stay P4 needs to navigate this new world much better than they have. Ron Rivera is here because what this program and athletic department was doing was not working. The transfer portal is a tool. But you still need dynamic personalities and coaches that attract talent. Justin Wilcox is the polar opposite of that. That is fine if you are winning. But when you lose and recruit as poorly as this program has you need to look at any and all options to improve the product.

And the collective is likely the only thing that has kept this program from completely bottoming out. The rankings for the portal are flawed. Colorado did not even have a competitive G5 roster in 2022. Cal still did not beat them. They improved in 2023 and last season they won 9 games. When was the last time Cal won 9 games? Deion rebuilt Colorado. Can they stay there? TBD but his method worked. Their trendline is up. Where is Cals trendline?

I hate the portal. But it is here and not going away. Same with NIL or Revenue share or whatever they call it. And realignment looms. It could be that every P4 team gets a seat. But few believe that is likely. So Cal better find a coach that can win games. And utilize all the tools available to produce a winning product, or get the F*** out of college football.

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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6956bear said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

---

In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

The year before Colorado had the #79 Portal class, well behind #55 Jackson State, where Deion was then HC. Utah was #56, Purdue #63, Vanderbilt #65, Ohio State #73, Notre Dame #75.

Colorado alums are not the wealthiest in the country, and did not suddenly get richer going from #79 to #1 in a single year. Jackson State does not have a ton of NIL but they landed a better portal class than Ohio State or Notre Dame? Cmon, you have to admit the difference was Deion.

Last year, In his second year, Colorado pulled in the #8 transfer class.

So it isn't just NIL. Kids still want to play for a coach they want to play for. The best players want a shot at the NFL and a coach that has NFL cred, or a record of winning and sending players to the NFL. There is a reason Cal's best recruiting has been at DB given the same NIL funding source.

It isn't just up to the players to form chemistry. The coaches get paid $millions to be leaders and create that chemistry.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but Brennan Marion in his first year at Sac State just pulled in the #64 Portal Class (including Jaden Rashada) by far the highest for any FCS program and ahead of Pitt, BC, Tennessee, Northwestern, Florida, Clemson, BYU… Basically recruiting to an FCS like Deion did at Jackson State. It will be really interesting to see how he does in this his first year and how he uses Rashada. He also just got a commit from 4 Star WR Xavier McDonald out of Mississippi (beating out Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Florida State, Miami, Nebraska, Penn State, Tennessee….) with Sac State's 2026 HS recruiting currently ranked #53. Marion's personality, not Sac State's boosters, was far and away the difference.

Oh, and Marion's salary as Head Coach at Sac State is $350,000. Probably less than we are paying Rolovich as an "offensive assistant." People said we couldn't afford to fire Wilcox after he went 2-6 in the ACC last year, but Wilcox's contract is a sunk cost, like Knowlton's, the true incremental cost is his replacement and we had affordable options like Ron Rivera who came anyway, or an up and coming coach like Marion.

It will be interesting to see how Marion's offense looks this year and how flexible it can be. As OC at UNLV last year he had the #15 scoring offense. Someone to keep an eye on.

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I don't know what I have to do to debunk this. Colorado had the supposed #1 portal class Sanders' first year because they brought in 50 players. Their average player rating was very low. The transfer portal ranking that keeps getting cited is hot garbage. As was, by the way the Colorado team that played the season with the #1 transfer portal class. I'm pretty sure the actual top transfer portal class would have managed to finish somewhere in the top 11 of the PAC-12.

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Lots of good stuff has happened to Colorado football due to Deion. Yes that first season underwhelmed but the previous season they won but 1 game. Of course that 1 win came against our Bears. So they go 4-8 in year 1 then last season 9-4 and 7-2 in the Big 12. They had the Heisman trophy winner (Travis Hunter) and Shadeur Sanders was a very prolific college QB.

Many do not like how Colorado turned their program around. But they did do that. They are now a threat on the recruiting trail, and still a top draw on TV and they now fill their stadium and donations are up. Heck Deion does not even leave Boulder to recruit.

Cal should be so lucky. Cal has had a very high number of transfers these past 3 seasons. And they are still mediocre overall and a lower division team in the ACC. They are picked near the bottom this season, have an over/under win total of 5.5 and are a underdog to a team they beat 44-7 last season.

I do believe the best use of the portal is to supplement your roster to fill holes. But Cal has been a transfer portal user these past 3 cycles and the roster is still below average. And their HS recruiting is among the very worst in all the P4.

I am not advocating for how Deion did it, but the results are up. Colorado was way down. Some considered them the worst P4 program in the country when Deion took over. The game has become a professional endeavor. The players are paid. They can transfer every season without penalty. The players have agents. Realignment hovers over nearly every program in the Big 12 and ACC.

Cal if they want to stay P4 needs to navigate this new world much better than they have. Ron Rivera is here because what this program and athletic department was doing was not working. The transfer portal is a tool. But you still need dynamic personalities and coaches that attract talent. Justin Wilcox is the polar opposite of that. That is fine if you are winning. But when you lose and recruit as poorly as this program has you need to look at any and all options to improve the product.

And the collective is likely the only thing that has kept this program from completely bottoming out. The rankings for the portal are flawed. Colorado did not even have a competitive G5 roster in 2022. Cal still did not beat them. They improved in 2023 and last season they won 9 games. When was the last time Cal won 9 games? Deion rebuilt Colorado. Can they stay there? TBD but his method worked. Their trendline is up. Where is Cals trendline?

I hate the portal. But it is here and not going away. Same with NIL or Revenue share or whatever they call it. And realignment looms. It could be that every P4 team gets a seat. But few believe that is likely. So Cal better find a coach that can win games. And utilize all the tools available to produce a winning product, or get the F*** out of college football.

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I'm not arguing against the portal or saying anything about what Colorado has done under Deion. I'm merely talking about the transfer portal team rankings that keep getting cited. Colorado did not have the best transfer portal class that year by a long shot. They ranked that high in the ON3 ranking because they had 50 players and because it also factored in impact, in other words how much Colorado's existing roster sucked. Their average individual ranking was terrible. Deion probably would have traded his class wholesale with 30 other teams. They went 4-8 but they finished 1-8 in the Pac-12, same record as the year before and in last place. If that portal class was the best in the country, they would have finished higher.

Cal, and any team, has to recruit successfully in all facets, very much including the portal. I don't care if we get our players from high school or the portal. I am in no way saying we shouldn't use the portal. I'm saying the rankings are bogus and we have to stop citing them to say things they don't say.

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calumnus said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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6956bear said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

---

In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

The year before Colorado had the #79 Portal class, well behind #55 Jackson State, where Deion was then HC. Utah was #56, Purdue #63, Vanderbilt #65, Ohio State #73, Notre Dame #75.

Colorado alums are not the wealthiest in the country, and did not suddenly get richer going from #79 to #1 in a single year. Jackson State does not have a ton of NIL but they landed a better portal class than Ohio State or Notre Dame? Cmon, you have to admit the difference was Deion.

Last year, In his second year, Colorado pulled in the #8 transfer class.

So it isn't just NIL. Kids still want to play for a coach they want to play for. The best players want a shot at the NFL and a coach that has NFL cred, or a record of winning and sending players to the NFL. There is a reason Cal's best recruiting has been at DB given the same NIL funding source.

It isn't just up to the players to form chemistry. The coaches get paid $millions to be leaders and create that chemistry.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but Brennan Marion in his first year at Sac State just pulled in the #64 Portal Class (including Jaden Rashada) by far the highest for any FCS program and ahead of Pitt, BC, Tennessee, Northwestern, Florida, Clemson, BYU… Basically recruiting to an FCS like Deion did at Jackson State. It will be really interesting to see how he does in this his first year and how he uses Rashada. He also just got a commit from 4 Star WR Xavier McDonald out of Mississippi (beating out Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Florida State, Miami, Nebraska, Penn State, Tennessee….) with Sac State's 2026 HS recruiting currently ranked #53. Marion's personality, not Sac State's boosters, was far and away the difference.

Oh, and Marion's salary as Head Coach at Sac State is $350,000. Probably less than we are paying Rolovich as an "offensive assistant." People said we couldn't afford to fire Wilcox after he went 2-6 in the ACC last year, but Wilcox's contract is a sunk cost, like Knowlton's, the true incremental cost is his replacement and we had affordable options like Ron Rivera who came anyway, or an up and coming coach like Marion.

It will be interesting to see how Marion's offense looks this year and how flexible it can be. As OC at UNLV last year he had the #15 scoring offense. Someone to keep an eye on.

---

I don't know what I have to do to debunk this. Colorado had the supposed #1 portal class Sanders' first year because they brought in 50 players. Their average player rating was very low. The transfer portal ranking that keeps getting cited is hot garbage. As was, by the way the Colorado team that played the season with the #1 transfer portal class. I'm pretty sure the actual top transfer portal class would have managed to finish somewhere in the top 11 of the PAC-12.

---

Lots of good stuff has happened to Colorado football due to Deion. Yes that first season underwhelmed but the previous season they won but 1 game. Of course that 1 win came against our Bears. So they go 4-8 in year 1 then last season 9-4 and 7-2 in the Big 12. They had the Heisman trophy winner (Travis Hunter) and Shadeur Sanders was a very prolific college QB.

Many do not like how Colorado turned their program around. But they did do that. They are now a threat on the recruiting trail, and still a top draw on TV and they now fill their stadium and donations are up. Heck Deion does not even leave Boulder to recruit.

Cal should be so lucky. Cal has had a very high number of transfers these past 3 seasons. And they are still mediocre overall and a lower division team in the ACC. They are picked near the bottom this season, have an over/under win total of 5.5 and are a underdog to a team they beat 44-7 last season.

I do believe the best use of the portal is to supplement your roster to fill holes. But Cal has been a transfer portal user these past 3 cycles and the roster is still below average. And their HS recruiting is among the very worst in all the P4.

I am not advocating for how Deion did it, but the results are up. Colorado was way down. Some considered them the worst P4 program in the country when Deion took over. The game has become a professional endeavor. The players are paid. They can transfer every season without penalty. The players have agents. Realignment hovers over nearly every program in the Big 12 and ACC.

Cal if they want to stay P4 needs to navigate this new world much better than they have. Ron Rivera is here because what this program and athletic department was doing was not working. The transfer portal is a tool. But you still need dynamic personalities and coaches that attract talent. Justin Wilcox is the polar opposite of that. That is fine if you are winning. But when you lose and recruit as poorly as this program has you need to look at any and all options to improve the product.

And the collective is likely the only thing that has kept this program from completely bottoming out. The rankings for the portal are flawed. Colorado did not even have a competitive G5 roster in 2022. Cal still did not beat them. They improved in 2023 and last season they won 9 games. When was the last time Cal won 9 games? Deion rebuilt Colorado. Can they stay there? TBD but his method worked. Their trendline is up. Where is Cals trendline?

I hate the portal. But it is here and not going away. Same with NIL or Revenue share or whatever they call it. And realignment looms. It could be that every P4 team gets a seat. But few believe that is likely. So Cal better find a coach that can win games. And utilize all the tools available to produce a winning product, or get the F*** out of college football.

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I'm not arguing against the portal or saying anything about what Colorado has done under Deion. I'm merely talking about the transfer portal team rankings that keep getting cited. Colorado did not have the best transfer portal class that year by a long shot. They ranked that high in the ON3 ranking because they had 50 players and because it also factored in impact, in other words how much Colorado's existing roster sucked. Their average individual ranking was terrible. Deion probably would have traded his class wholesale with 30 other teams. They went 4-8 but they finished 1-8 in the Pac-12, same record as the year before and in last place. If that portal class was the best in the country, they would have finished higher.

Cal, and any team, has to recruit successfully in all facets, very much including the portal. I don't care if we get our players from high school or the portal. I am in no way saying we shouldn't use the portal. I'm saying the rankings are bogus and we have to stop citing them to say things they don't say.

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Yes, the ranking methodology is flawed, that is why I often just go with the number of 4 and 5 star players. And yes, it isn't just the transfer portal, HS recruiting too. Look at all the 4 and 5 star players Colorado has brought in. It is not just the three family members from Jackson State. And yes, Colorado has woefully underperformed given the talent level, but that is a different issue.

My point was only to refute one poster's assertion that the coach's personality, whether positive or negative, doesn't matter anymore, that all that matters is NIL and X's and O's.

While I am a HUGE proponent of smart coaches with innovative, flexible strategies, personality matters, especially at a place like Cal. In college you still need a coach that can attract and retain great players above and beyond your NIL budget and inspire them to believe in the coaches, the system and themselves for their own success and the success of the team. Right now we have that at DB. Maybe LB. Nowhere else, though OL is looking promising.

I think Marion is a good example because he is smart, flexible, innovative, AND has a great personality. Again, getting Rashada to Sac State and then landing an elite 4 star WR out of the Deep South with offers from all of the SEC and much of the top teams in the B1G is insane no matter how you rank his class. I am not sure that I love the "Go Go" offense, but I love that he has created his own offense and he is able to get god players to come play for him.

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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calumnus said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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6956bear said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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calumnus said:

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72CalBear said:

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Say what you like, but the NIL and portal make it extremely difficult (not just for Cal!) to build in anything close to continuity and development with the players. As such, players don't need that "personality coach" that many of you rave about. They don't care about locker room HC speak. What we should concern ourself with all the newcomers is locker room and team chemistry. Everyone is looking out for themselves these days. Transferring is on every players mind. Second string or back up? See you later! My concern (also in high school where I am involved) is the revolving door and how teams/coaches/admin address the tentative nature of a team now. A Bear this year and a ______? next year. It's down in the high schools now and here in Long Beach, players have jumped around freely and the privates are pouncing. Loyalty? Commitment to team and school? Bear staff have new challenges besides Xs and O's.

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In 2023 Deion Sanders became Colorado's head coach and they pulled in the #1 Transfer Portal class in the country.

The year before Colorado had the #79 Portal class, well behind #55 Jackson State, where Deion was then HC. Utah was #56, Purdue #63, Vanderbilt #65, Ohio State #73, Notre Dame #75.

Colorado alums are not the wealthiest in the country, and did not suddenly get richer going from #79 to #1 in a single year. Jackson State does not have a ton of NIL but they landed a better portal class than Ohio State or Notre Dame? Cmon, you have to admit the difference was Deion.

Last year, In his second year, Colorado pulled in the #8 transfer class.

So it isn't just NIL. Kids still want to play for a coach they want to play for. The best players want a shot at the NFL and a coach that has NFL cred, or a record of winning and sending players to the NFL. There is a reason Cal's best recruiting has been at DB given the same NIL funding source.

It isn't just up to the players to form chemistry. The coaches get paid $millions to be leaders and create that chemistry.

I don't know if anyone noticed, but Brennan Marion in his first year at Sac State just pulled in the #64 Portal Class (including Jaden Rashada) by far the highest for any FCS program and ahead of Pitt, BC, Tennessee, Northwestern, Florida, Clemson, BYU… Basically recruiting to an FCS like Deion did at Jackson State. It will be really interesting to see how he does in this his first year and how he uses Rashada. He also just got a commit from 4 Star WR Xavier McDonald out of Mississippi (beating out Alabama, LSU, Ole Miss, Auburn, Arkansas, Florida State, Miami, Nebraska, Penn State, Tennessee….) with Sac State's 2026 HS recruiting currently ranked #53. Marion's personality, not Sac State's boosters, was far and away the difference.

Oh, and Marion's salary as Head Coach at Sac State is $350,000. Probably less than we are paying Rolovich as an "offensive assistant." People said we couldn't afford to fire Wilcox after he went 2-6 in the ACC last year, but Wilcox's contract is a sunk cost, like Knowlton's, the true incremental cost is his replacement and we had affordable options like Ron Rivera who came anyway, or an up and coming coach like Marion.

It will be interesting to see how Marion's offense looks this year and how flexible it can be. As OC at UNLV last year he had the #15 scoring offense. Someone to keep an eye on.

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I don't know what I have to do to debunk this. Colorado had the supposed #1 portal class Sanders' first year because they brought in 50 players. Their average player rating was very low. The transfer portal ranking that keeps getting cited is hot garbage. As was, by the way the Colorado team that played the season with the #1 transfer portal class. I'm pretty sure the actual top transfer portal class would have managed to finish somewhere in the top 11 of the PAC-12.

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Lots of good stuff has happened to Colorado football due to Deion. Yes that first season underwhelmed but the previous season they won but 1 game. Of course that 1 win came against our Bears. So they go 4-8 in year 1 then last season 9-4 and 7-2 in the Big 12. They had the Heisman trophy winner (Travis Hunter) and Shadeur Sanders was a very prolific college QB.

Many do not like how Colorado turned their program around. But they did do that. They are now a threat on the recruiting trail, and still a top draw on TV and they now fill their stadium and donations are up. Heck Deion does not even leave Boulder to recruit.

Cal should be so lucky. Cal has had a very high number of transfers these past 3 seasons. And they are still mediocre overall and a lower division team in the ACC. They are picked near the bottom this season, have an over/under win total of 5.5 and are a underdog to a team they beat 44-7 last season.

I do believe the best use of the portal is to supplement your roster to fill holes. But Cal has been a transfer portal user these past 3 cycles and the roster is still below average. And their HS recruiting is among the very worst in all the P4.

I am not advocating for how Deion did it, but the results are up. Colorado was way down. Some considered them the worst P4 program in the country when Deion took over. The game has become a professional endeavor. The players are paid. They can transfer every season without penalty. The players have agents. Realignment hovers over nearly every program in the Big 12 and ACC.

Cal if they want to stay P4 needs to navigate this new world much better than they have. Ron Rivera is here because what this program and athletic department was doing was not working. The transfer portal is a tool. But you still need dynamic personalities and coaches that attract talent. Justin Wilcox is the polar opposite of that. That is fine if you are winning. But when you lose and recruit as poorly as this program has you need to look at any and all options to improve the product.

And the collective is likely the only thing that has kept this program from completely bottoming out. The rankings for the portal are flawed. Colorado did not even have a competitive G5 roster in 2022. Cal still did not beat them. They improved in 2023 and last season they won 9 games. When was the last time Cal won 9 games? Deion rebuilt Colorado. Can they stay there? TBD but his method worked. Their trendline is up. Where is Cals trendline?

I hate the portal. But it is here and not going away. Same with NIL or Revenue share or whatever they call it. And realignment looms. It could be that every P4 team gets a seat. But few believe that is likely. So Cal better find a coach that can win games. And utilize all the tools available to produce a winning product, or get the F*** out of college football.

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I'm not arguing against the portal or saying anything about what Colorado has done under Deion. I'm merely talking about the transfer portal team rankings that keep getting cited. Colorado did not have the best transfer portal class that year by a long shot. They ranked that high in the ON3 ranking because they had 50 players and because it also factored in impact, in other words how much Colorado's existing roster sucked. Their average individual ranking was terrible. Deion probably would have traded his class wholesale with 30 other teams. They went 4-8 but they finished 1-8 in the Pac-12, same record as the year before and in last place. If that portal class was the best in the country, they would have finished higher.

Cal, and any team, has to recruit successfully in all facets, very much including the portal. I don't care if we get our players from high school or the portal. I am in no way saying we shouldn't use the portal. I'm saying the rankings are bogus and we have to stop citing them to say things they don't say.

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Yes, the ranking methodology is flawed, that is why I often just go with the number of 4 and 5 star players. And yes, it isn't just the transfer portal, HS recruiting too. Look at all the 4 and 5 star players Colorado has brought in. It is not just the three family members from Jackson State. And yes, Colorado has woefully underperformed given the talent level, but that is a different issue.

My point was only to refute one poster's assertion that the coach's personality, whether positive or negative, doesn't matter anymore, that all that matters is NIL and X's and O's.

While I am a HUGE proponent of smart coaches with innovative, flexible strategies, personality matters, especially at a place like Cal. In college you still need a coach that can attract and retain great players above and beyond your NIL budget and inspire them to believe in the coaches, the system and themselves for their own success and the success of the team. Right now we have that at DB. Maybe LB. Nowhere else, though OL is looking promising.

I think Marion is a good example because he is smart, flexible, innovative, AND has a great personality. Again, getting Rashada to Sac State and then landing an elite 4 star WR out of the Deep South with offers from all of the SEC and much of the top teams in the B1G is insane no matter how you rank his class. I am not sure that I love the "Go Go" offense, but I love that he has created his own offense and he is able to get god players to come play for him.

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I don't disagree with your primary points. I just have to say that maybe Colorado didn't woefully underperform the talent level. Maybe Cal didn't woefully underperform the talent level. Maybe the view of the talent level is skewed by the fact that they are relying on transfer portal rankings that are flawed.

But definitely if Marion can bring god players, sign him up. I want god players.

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BearSD said:

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calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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6956bear said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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JeffMcd said:

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Hope is not a strategy. Why has it taken nine seasons for Wilcox to get a competent Offensive coaching staff? (With the exception of the one Spavital season). Thankfully we now have a Chancellor who abhors incompetence and will make sure ADs demand results. There's no excuse for the past 16 years of losing conference records. Lyons will do all he can to create a successful football program. He actually likes the sport.

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Lyons has already put himself on the record: 6 and 7 win seasons are NOT ACCEPTABLE anymore

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Yeah, except multiple chancellors have come in making big noise that we are striving for championships, something I have very much noted has been dropped from the messaging in recent years. And no actions were taken. No offense, but it is easy to say things. It is not easy to achieve things. Early comments on Christ were that she gets it and was going to turn things around and the program is possibly at its least healthy point in my lifetime.

Hiring Rivera was good. His botched messaging and massive delay in fixing the botched messaging, the protest that ensued, and the national coverage that ensued was like chopping off an arm and watching the person bleed out and putting on the tourniquet at the last possible second.

And if 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable, we have a coach who has failed to meet even that standard 4 times out of 8, and has only passed not acceptable 1 time in eight years, barely, winning 8 games once. Lyons had the opportunity to end that unacceptable situation and he didn't. And I know some of you are going to say he wasn't here long enough, he had other things to do, he didn't want Knowlton hiring the next guy or a bunch of other excuses for not taking decisive action, but the bottom line is he chose not to take decisive action, but instead chose to buy a truckload of lipstick to slap on the same old pig. If 6 and 7 win seasons were truly not acceptable Wilcox would be gone. Or is this like the tv show Barry where we are going to stop murdering the football program now...okay, now...okay, now...okay, now.

In any case, genuine good intentions or not, words and effort stopped meaning anything a long time ago. We'll know 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable when they actually stop.

Yes Christ did talk a big game.
But Lyons has not just talked a big game, he has provided Wilcox with the resources to make his talk a reality. That is the reason why Lyons says that 6 and 7 win seasons are no longer acceptable.

If Wilcox continues with his typical 5-7 win seasons, this will be his FINAL year as Cal's HC.

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I think he is likely gone even if he gets to 8.

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We don't live in a universe in which Cal will fire a coach after an 8-win season. Alabama might do that. Not Cal.

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Who is "Cal"? Not disagreeing with you necessarily. But are you saying Rivera/Lyons or just "the consensus"? That big donors would be satisfied and not be willing to put up money that Lyons would want put up before Wilcox gets fired? Or that big donors might push for yet another contract extension so that Wilcox doesn't go into year 10 with only 1 year left on his contract?

Also, is "8 wins" 7-5 (4-4) plus a win in a minor bowl?

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It's donors. Alabama football donors would buy out an 8-4 coach; for that matter no one would be too surprised if it happened this year provided the Tide wins 8 or fewer games. Cal does not have athletic donors who will write those giant checks to get rid of an 8-4 coach, nor has there ever been a Cal administration, including the current one, that would pressure donors to put up the money to fire an 8-4 coach. And with funding for the entire university under attack from the bad guys back east, we can't even entertain a fantasy of university funds being used for that purpose.

And no, I am not saying that donors or anyone else would extend Wilcox after this season. Maybe if he reaches the final season on his contract with no extension on the table, he might follow Chip Kelly's path and leave for a coordinator job elsewhere instead of coaching one last season as a lame duck head coach.

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HKBear97! said:

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BearSD said:

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calumnus said:

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BearSD said:

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6956bear said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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GivemTheAxe said:

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JeffMcd said:

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Hope is not a strategy. Why has it taken nine seasons for Wilcox to get a competent Offensive coaching staff? (With the exception of the one Spavital season). Thankfully we now have a Chancellor who abhors incompetence and will make sure ADs demand results. There's no excuse for the past 16 years of losing conference records. Lyons will do all he can to create a successful football program. He actually likes the sport.

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Lyons has already put himself on the record: 6 and 7 win seasons are NOT ACCEPTABLE anymore

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Yeah, except multiple chancellors have come in making big noise that we are striving for championships, something I have very much noted has been dropped from the messaging in recent years. And no actions were taken. No offense, but it is easy to say things. It is not easy to achieve things. Early comments on Christ were that she gets it and was going to turn things around and the program is possibly at its least healthy point in my lifetime.

Hiring Rivera was good. His botched messaging and massive delay in fixing the botched messaging, the protest that ensued, and the national coverage that ensued was like chopping off an arm and watching the person bleed out and putting on the tourniquet at the last possible second.

And if 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable, we have a coach who has failed to meet even that standard 4 times out of 8, and has only passed not acceptable 1 time in eight years, barely, winning 8 games once. Lyons had the opportunity to end that unacceptable situation and he didn't. And I know some of you are going to say he wasn't here long enough, he had other things to do, he didn't want Knowlton hiring the next guy or a bunch of other excuses for not taking decisive action, but the bottom line is he chose not to take decisive action, but instead chose to buy a truckload of lipstick to slap on the same old pig. If 6 and 7 win seasons were truly not acceptable Wilcox would be gone. Or is this like the tv show Barry where we are going to stop murdering the football program now...okay, now...okay, now...okay, now.

In any case, genuine good intentions or not, words and effort stopped meaning anything a long time ago. We'll know 6 and 7 win seasons are not acceptable when they actually stop.

Yes Christ did talk a big game.
But Lyons has not just talked a big game, he has provided Wilcox with the resources to make his talk a reality. That is the reason why Lyons says that 6 and 7 win seasons are no longer acceptable.

If Wilcox continues with his typical 5-7 win seasons, this will be his FINAL year as Cal's HC.

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I think he is likely gone even if he gets to 8.

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We don't live in a universe in which Cal will fire a coach after an 8-win season. Alabama might do that. Not Cal.

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Who is "Cal"? Not disagreeing with you necessarily. But are you saying Rivera/Lyons or just "the consensus"? That big donors would be satisfied and not be willing to put up money that Lyons would want put up before Wilcox gets fired? Or that big donors might push for yet another contract extension so that Wilcox doesn't go into year 10 with only 1 year left on his contract?

Also, is "8 wins" 7-5 (4-4) plus a win in a minor bowl?

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It's donors. Alabama football donors would buy out an 8-4 coach; for that matter no one would be too surprised if it happened this year provided the Tide wins 8 or fewer games. Cal does not have athletic donors who will write those giant checks to get rid of an 8-4 coach, nor has there ever been a Cal administration, including the current one, that would pressure donors to put up the money to fire an 8-4 coach. And with funding for the entire university under attack from the bad guys back east, we can't even entertain a fantasy of university funds being used for that purpose.

And no, I am not saying that donors or anyone else would extend Wilcox after this season. Maybe if he reaches the final season on his contract with no extension on the table, he might follow Chip Kelly's path and leave for a coordinator job elsewhere instead of coaching one last season as a lame duck head coach.

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This. As I pointed out in another thread, the Wilcox buyout after this season is approximately $10.5 million. By Cal standards, that's significant and likely means he's here for another year regardless.

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