freshfunk said:

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pnaidu said:

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freshfunk said:

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I think it's kind of amusing the level of confirmation bias people are willing to partake in to rationalize their feelings. Hey, let's cherry pick the exceptions and ignore all the times such a thing failed.

And now people are saying "well maybe Rolo is the real OC." ???? Does that make any sense?? How does that go over in offensive staff meetings? How do you even hire a staff under him? You tell all those other coaches that Rolo is the the real OC but Somerville is your boss. ??? Sorry, that just doesn't make sense. Rolo is not going to do all the work of an OC while being paid as a position coach. Sure, he might be there to help and mentor but there's a ton of work an OC needs to do.

And, yes, we don't have to hire a 55 year old Musgrave. I'm not saying that. Apparently, the only 2 choices are a 29 year old who's never been an OC and a retired 55-year old.

Maybe it's just me, but I thought we could do better. I thought we had more pull. When I heard that we were getting interest from the NFL, I assumed more. I thought we could pull in someone with a more impressive resume. Apparently, people feel like this is the best we could do. This just sounds like we're rolling the dice because maybe we didn't have the budget to go for a bigger hire.

I hope Somerville turns out to be an offensive genius that just hasn't gotten his chance yet. But if I were a betting man, I'm counting on some growing pains in the least.

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Tough to say, but if the vision is being sold by a man that people believe in... the vision will be bought.

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I can see that. The Tosh hype is so strong everyone's bought it .. blindly. That's everyone's prerogative. I'm more of a "trust but verify" kind of guy.

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freshfunk said:

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DonnieMcCleskey said:

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His resume isn't that different than Will Stein at Oregon before Lanning hired him as OC (other than Stein playing QB in college) and that seemed to work out fine.

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This is Will Stein's history before Oregon:

2013
Louisville (GA)

2014
Louisville (QC)

20152017
Texas (QC)

20182019
Lake Travis HS (TX) (AHC/OC/QB)

20202021
UTSA (PGC/WR)

2022
UTSA (Co-OC/QB)

Not only was he OC (Co-OC) at UTSA, he had about 9 years experience including being at Louisville and Texas. This kind of resume would be more understandable because you have at least 1 year under your belt of managing an offense, perhaps under the tutelage of someone else more experienced.

People here seem to think the only option we have are completely inexperienced projects like Somerville or "retreads." And yet we point to examples like Will Stein which are neither. Somerville is an assistant QB coach right now. How much does he know about the organizational aspects of being a coordinator? I'm not saying you have to hire a guy who's retired an in his 50's, but even at least 1 year of experience at a successful G5 team would be promising.

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sycasey said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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Rolovich is the QB coach. He will develop the QBs. Lupoi had every opportunity to hire him to be OC. He didn't. There is zero reason for Rolovich to take a job as shadow OC. Lupoi made his hire. That hire is Somerville.

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I agree with a lot of your points, but point of order on Rolovich:

His title is not just "QB Coach," it's "Assistant Head Coach and QB Coach." Is that other part just a figurehead title? Maybe. But per your other points: if you are taking Tosh at his word when he hires his staff then it looks like Rolo will have more authority over the team than the usual QB coach. Given that his specialty is on offense I don't think it's unreasonable to think he might be a kind of shadow OC, or will have significant input on that side of the ball.

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Sebastabear said:

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Having quickly perused this thread (yikes) let me just repeat what I put on the insider board and add a few specific additional thoughts:

This was Tosh's top target as OC and he has been pursuing him since the day he was hired. Tosh worked with him at Oregon, knows him and has seen him in action. A fierce recruiter whose skills in some ways were being squandered in the NFL.

In terms of this being a "budget hire" . . . lol. Guys you don't buy a G650 and then decide to skimp on the jet fuel. We're all making major investments here. This is who the head coach wants. This is going to be the new OC (full time and non-shadowed). Everyone in the business I've talked to says he's a wunderkind and will kill it as a college OC. True? Not true? Will this work? I don't know. But I guarantee he's going to bring in some top talent on that side of the ball.

Cal is taking a swing.

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sycasey said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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Rolovich is the QB coach. He will develop the QBs. Lupoi had every opportunity to hire him to be OC. He didn't. There is zero reason for Rolovich to take a job as shadow OC. Lupoi made his hire. That hire is Somerville.

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I agree with a lot of your points, but point of order on Rolovich:

His title is not just "QB Coach," it's "Assistant Head Coach and QB Coach." Is that other part just a figurehead title? Maybe. But per your other points: if you are taking Tosh at his word when he hires his staff then it looks like Rolo will have more authority over the team than the usual QB coach. Given that his specialty is on offense I don't think it's unreasonable to think he might be a kind of shadow OC, or will have significant input on that side of the ball.

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freshfunk said:

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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DonnieMcCleskey said:

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His resume isn't that different than Will Stein at Oregon before Lanning hired him as OC (other than Stein playing QB in college) and that seemed to work out fine.

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This is Will Stein's history before Oregon:

2013
Louisville (GA)

2014
Louisville (QC)

20152017
Texas (QC)

20182019
Lake Travis HS (TX) (AHC/OC/QB)

20202021
UTSA (PGC/WR)

2022
UTSA (Co-OC/QB)

Not only was he OC (Co-OC) at UTSA, he had about 9 years experience including being at Louisville and Texas. This kind of resume would be more understandable because you have at least 1 year under your belt of managing an offense, perhaps under the tutelage of someone else more experienced.

People here seem to think the only option we have are completely inexperienced projects like Somerville or "retreads." And yet we point to examples like Will Stein which are neither. Somerville is an assistant QB coach right now. How much does he know about the organizational aspects of being a coordinator? I'm not saying you have to hire a guy who's retired an in his 50's, but even at least 1 year of experience at a successful G5 team would be promising.

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You're someone who claims to know something about evaluation of assistant coach talent and who might be in the marketplace to be considered for a Cal job. What are YOUR credentials? What's your coaching experience. For that matter, how much do you have on the line to back up your observations? Are you offering to put up $$ millions that your judgment would be better?

We're all entitled to say our piece, but the dealin's done.

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If this is the criteria for making a comment, then you might as well shut down the message board because who would qualify? Low IQ comment.

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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DonnieMcCleskey said:

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His resume isn't that different than Will Stein at Oregon before Lanning hired him as OC (other than Stein playing QB in college) and that seemed to work out fine.

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This is Will Stein's history before Oregon:

2013
Louisville (GA)

2014
Louisville (QC)

20152017
Texas (QC)

20182019
Lake Travis HS (TX) (AHC/OC/QB)

20202021
UTSA (PGC/WR)

2022
UTSA (Co-OC/QB)

Not only was he OC (Co-OC) at UTSA, he had about 9 years experience including being at Louisville and Texas. This kind of resume would be more understandable because you have at least 1 year under your belt of managing an offense, perhaps under the tutelage of someone else more experienced.

People here seem to think the only option we have are completely inexperienced projects like Somerville or "retreads." And yet we point to examples like Will Stein which are neither. Somerville is an assistant QB coach right now. How much does he know about the organizational aspects of being a coordinator? I'm not saying you have to hire a guy who's retired an in his 50's, but even at least 1 year of experience at a successful G5 team would be promising.

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You're someone who claims to know something about evaluation of assistant coach talent and who might be in the marketplace to be considered for a Cal job. What are YOUR credentials? What's your coaching experience. For that matter, how much do you have on the line to back up your observations? Are you offering to put up $$ millions that your judgment would be better?

We're all entitled to say our piece, but the dealin's done.

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If this is the criteria for making a comment, then you might as well shut down the message board because who would qualify? Low IQ comment.

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Criterion.

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sycasey said:

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BearlyCareAnymore said:

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Rolovich is the QB coach. He will develop the QBs. Lupoi had every opportunity to hire him to be OC. He didn't. There is zero reason for Rolovich to take a job as shadow OC. Lupoi made his hire. That hire is Somerville.

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I agree with a lot of your points, but point of order on Rolovich:

His title is not just "QB Coach," it's "Assistant Head Coach and QB Coach." Is that other part just a figurehead title? Maybe. But per your other points: if you are taking Tosh at his word when he hires his staff then it looks like Rolo will have more authority over the team than the usual QB coach. Given that his specialty is on offense I don't think it's unreasonable to think he might be a kind of shadow OC, or will have significant input on that side of the ball.

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Big C said:

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SOMERVILLE'S GONNA BE THE OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR, DAMMIT! NOT ROLO. Yes, within a well-functioning organization, there is often a lot of knowledge shared, both horizontally and vertically.


Assistant Head Coach
Associate Head Coach
Passing Game Coordinator
Run Game Coordinator

Often, those are titles that are awarded to justify a higher salary relative to others on the staff.

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TonyTiger said:

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I remember when Ben Johnson took over in Detroit as the offensive coordinator for Jared Goff. Early on, people laughed and even joked that they'd both be out of a job by the end of the year. Instead of panicking, they did something smart: they studied great play-callers throughout football history together and made common-sense adjustmentslike giving Goff a reliable emergency "bail-out" receiver at tight end on nearly every pass play.
Almost immediately, the offense started to look good.
Why? Because they were intelligent, humble, and committed to learning every single day. Neither had prior coordinator or quarterback-revival experience. What they did have was youth, mutual respect, and a relentless desire to improvetogether.
Now Ben Johnson is kicking butt in Chicago, and Detroit is clearly struggling without him.
Two guys with zero experiencejust youth, hunger, and collaboration (sound familiar?)and one is now widely regarded as one of the best play-callers in the NFL and a head coach.
Contrast that with the 80% of older offensive coordinators Cal has hired over the yearsmost of whom had "experience," yet never amounted to anything.
Experience alone doesn't win. Intelligence, adaptability, and the willingness to learn do.

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bearsandgiants said:

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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DonnieMcCleskey said:

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His resume isn't that different than Will Stein at Oregon before Lanning hired him as OC (other than Stein playing QB in college) and that seemed to work out fine.

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This is Will Stein's history before Oregon:

2013
Louisville (GA)

2014
Louisville (QC)

20152017
Texas (QC)

20182019
Lake Travis HS (TX) (AHC/OC/QB)

20202021
UTSA (PGC/WR)

2022
UTSA (Co-OC/QB)

Not only was he OC (Co-OC) at UTSA, he had about 9 years experience including being at Louisville and Texas. This kind of resume would be more understandable because you have at least 1 year under your belt of managing an offense, perhaps under the tutelage of someone else more experienced.

People here seem to think the only option we have are completely inexperienced projects like Somerville or "retreads." And yet we point to examples like Will Stein which are neither. Somerville is an assistant QB coach right now. How much does he know about the organizational aspects of being a coordinator? I'm not saying you have to hire a guy who's retired an in his 50's, but even at least 1 year of experience at a successful G5 team would be promising.

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You're someone who claims to know something about evaluation of assistant coach talent and who might be in the marketplace to be considered for a Cal job. What are YOUR credentials? What's your coaching experience. For that matter, how much do you have on the line to back up your observations? Are you offering to put up $$ millions that your judgment would be better?

We're all entitled to say our piece, but the dealin's done.

---

If this is the criteria for making a comment, then you might as well shut down the message board because who would qualify? Low IQ comment.

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Criterion.

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These are

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freshfunk said:

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So who's assembling the offensive coaching staff? Is it Tosh or Somerville? Does Somerville have the connections and pull to bring in a quality staff with his slim experience?

Normally we'd say "let the OC build his own staff." Yet does anyone have the confidence here that Somerville can assemble one?

I think it's funny that anybody asking questions is met with so much resistance. I guess some have so fully jumped on the Tosh hype-train that there's no point in questioning any decisions whatsoever. This is the sort of blind faith that has bit us so much in the past and yet some just haven't learned.

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freshfunk said:

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So who's assembling the offensive coaching staff? Is it Tosh or Somerville? Does Somerville have the connections and pull to bring in a quality staff with his slim experience?

Normally we'd say "let the OC build his own staff." Yet does anyone have the confidence here that Somerville can assemble one?

I think it's funny that anybody asking questions is met with so much resistance. I guess some have so fully jumped on the Tosh hype-train that there's no point in questioning any decisions whatsoever. This is the sort of blind faith that has bit us so much in the past and yet some just haven't learned.

Btw, those saying this is "high risk, high reward." What about him or his past says "high reward"? All I see is "high risk." His resume reads like his next move up would be a position coach, maybe an OC at a much smaller program.

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BearForceOne said:

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freshfunk said:

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So who's assembling the offensive coaching staff? Is it Tosh or Somerville? Does Somerville have the connections and pull to bring in a quality staff with his slim experience?

Normally we'd say "let the OC build his own staff." Yet does anyone have the confidence here that Somerville can assemble one?

I think it's funny that anybody asking questions is met with so much resistance. I guess some have so fully jumped on the Tosh hype-train that there's no point in questioning any decisions whatsoever. This is the sort of blind faith that has bit us so much in the past and yet some just haven't learned.

Btw, those saying this is "high risk, high reward." What about him or his past says "high reward"? All I see is "high risk." His resume reads like his next move up would be a position coach, maybe an OC at a much smaller program.

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I would definitely agree with you that this is a high risk hire, but with unknown/unproven potential for high reward. I hope he turns out to be a great hire and has great success, but it is far from a lock. Anybody saying otherwise is kidding themselves.

Tosh might be able to sell this kind of risky hire at Cal since we have been down for a while and people are more willing to try something, anything different, but if he were hired as a HC at, say, Oregon or Alabama or Michigan, and said he wants to hire someone with such a thin resume as the OC, I don't think it will fly.

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Rushinbear said:

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freshfunk said:

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So who's assembling the offensive coaching staff? Is it Tosh or Somerville? Does Somerville have the connections and pull to bring in a quality staff with his slim experience?

Normally we'd say "let the OC build his own staff." Yet does anyone have the confidence here that Somerville can assemble one?

I think it's funny that anybody asking questions is met with so much resistance. I guess some have so fully jumped on the Tosh hype-train that there's no point in questioning any decisions whatsoever. This is the sort of blind faith that has bit us so much in the past and yet some just haven't learned.

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It's that the die is cast. Whatever influence a few might have had has been for naught, if that influence was exerted in another direction. I questioned the choice of Tosh, pretty strongly, I think. And, what became of it (given that I don't have the $$$ million to donate in return for some leverage)?

So, the choice is now to tilt at windmills or to see if someone can make something of the situation.

I said from the beginning that the hc would most likely be someone that we don't know. I was wrong about that, but the OC fits that category. So, we have little basis on which to criticize, and that little is of little consequence (experience), given how this guy is being set into the org.

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BearForceOne said:

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sycasey said:

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Cal cannot attract the same kinds of candidates that Oregon or Alabama could.

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But I thought Tosh said NFL coaches were calling him up saying they want to come coach here?

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freshfunk said:

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sycasey said:

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BearForceOne said:

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freshfunk said:

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So who's assembling the offensive coaching staff? Is it Tosh or Somerville? Does Somerville have the connections and pull to bring in a quality staff with his slim experience?

Normally we'd say "let the OC build his own staff." Yet does anyone have the confidence here that Somerville can assemble one?

I think it's funny that anybody asking questions is met with so much resistance. I guess some have so fully jumped on the Tosh hype-train that there's no point in questioning any decisions whatsoever. This is the sort of blind faith that has bit us so much in the past and yet some just haven't learned.

Btw, those saying this is "high risk, high reward." What about him or his past says "high reward"? All I see is "high risk." His resume reads like his next move up would be a position coach, maybe an OC at a much smaller program.

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I would definitely agree with you that this is a high risk hire, but with unknown/unproven potential for high reward. I hope he turns out to be a great hire and has great success, but it is far from a lock. Anybody saying otherwise is kidding themselves.

Tosh might be able to sell this kind of risky hire at Cal since we have been down for a while and people are more willing to try something, anything different, but if he were hired as a HC at, say, Oregon or Alabama or Michigan, and said he wants to hire someone with such a thin resume as the OC, I don't think it will fly.

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Cal cannot attract the same kinds of candidates that Oregon or Alabama could.

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I thought Tosh was all about talent acquisition, including his staff?

I hope to be more impressed with the rest of his hires, particularly on the defensive side of the ball. I assume he has a much better network and greater ability to bring people here because of his bona fides. But I'm even more concerned now how the rest of the offensive staff will look. My worries will be allayed if he brings on coaches with more experience. If this becomes an "all the young dudes" staff, I'm going to be a bit worried. I'm all for young talent and energy, but not a room full of ONLY that.

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sycasey said:

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BearForceOne said:

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sycasey said:

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Cal cannot attract the same kinds of candidates that Oregon or Alabama could.

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But I thought Tosh said NFL coaches were calling him up saying they want to come coach here?

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He just hired one!

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BearForceOne said:

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sycasey said:

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BearForceOne said:

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sycasey said:

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Cal cannot attract the same kinds of candidates that Oregon or Alabama could.

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But I thought Tosh said NFL coaches were calling him up saying they want to come coach here?

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He just hired one!

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I'm glad he didn't hire an assistant strength and conditioning coach to be our OC then. Because that is an NFL coach too.

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