Another thread derailed by DO and anti-DO.<br /><br />Look. DO wants us to win. DO thinks Tedford is never going to win. DO wants Tedford gone.<br /><br />I don't think it's that complicated. Can we all just please move on?

<blockquote><div class="name-said">atticus;683010 said:</div><hr>What recruiting tactics are you referring to?<hr></blockquote><br /><br />I was going to ask the same question. DO?

<blockquote><div class="name-said">ncbears;683202 said:</div><hr>IF Tosh was hired to sabotage Cal's class, then Tosh is in a very precarious position. His value to UW is only for this year. And that value may be questionable as there are no results yet to show - other than McCarthy which according to this board was also a very tentative at best commit.<br />If Tosh can't duplicate a class at UW next year, at his salary, he could be gone in a flash. <br />And having shown a lack of loyalty - and perhaps ethics - once, there is no reason for Sark/UW to trust him at all in the future.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />as a recruiter and a DL coach. The question will be how does Sark do. So far he's thrown money around with very little to show for it. These next few years he better have big money results or he and his staff will be gone. Then Tosh will be on the assistant coach nomad tour. I hope he has a long career at that, similar to Marshall, 2 years here, 3 years there, repeat.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">jyamada;683303 said:</div><hr>I was going to ask the same question. DO?<hr></blockquote><br /><br />I think the thread has long moved on lol

<blockquote><div class="name-said">elpbear;683286 said:</div><hr>Another thread derailed by DO and anti-DO.<br /><br />Look. DO wants us to win. DO thinks Tedford is never going to win. DO wants Tedford gone.<br /><br />I don't think it's that complicated. Can we all just please move on?<hr></blockquote><br /><br />You're right, it's not complicated. But you missed a few.<br /><br />DO spews the same opinion over and over again that puts a poor light on Tedford.<br />DO has no evidence to back it up.<br />DO is called on that and plays games avoiding the question.<br />DO spews his same rant again.<br /><br />Yes, let's move on.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">jyamada;683303 said:</div><hr>I was going to ask the same question. DO?<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Question avoided. It asks DO for specifics, which of course he doesn't have!!!

Most every issue where football has a loss-wins vs losing, coaching decisions & now an arms race that we were not going to win & then Tosh behaves like Ed O. when leaving Tennessee, you take the low road. Your thousands of posts are tiresome...give us a break. :headbang

@alarsuel you just made California Golden Blogs, what will you do next?

<a href="<a href="<a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"""</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"""</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a></a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>"</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>"</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a></a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="<a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"""</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"""</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index""</a></a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>"</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a>"</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index"</a></a></a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br""</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br""</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"</a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"</a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"</a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br"</a></a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a>""" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a>""</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a>"</a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a>"</a></a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="<a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a></a>"" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a></a>"</a> class="postlink " target="_blank"><a href="http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a></a></a>" class="postlink " target="_blank">http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index</a></a><br</a></a></a></a> /><br />Have questions, comments or a show idea? Viewers please call us at 1-866-ESPN-OTL (866-377-6685).<br /><br />Who wants to make the call?

DO, everybody. Let's stop bickering between ourselves. I am having too much fun bashing UW and To$h. Maybe soon, UO will get sanctions and then we can bash them.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">mechaniCAL;683185 said:</div><hr>I believe this has already been posted somewhere, but I just wanted to reiterate:<br /><br />Will Heyward attempt to get the recruits to follow him to the Huskies?<br /><br />"No, I won't," he said. "That would be unethical. No."<br /><br />That's right... It would be UNETHICAL<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Tosh has already begun messing with Cal recruits. <br /><br />Forget the ethics -- is there no recourse for Cal on this NCAA-wise?

<blockquote><div class="name-said">ncbears;683202 said:</div><hr>IF Tosh was hired to sabotage Cal's class, then Tosh is in a very precarious position. His value to UW is only for this year. And that value may be questionable as there are no results yet to show - other than McCarthy which according to this board was also a very tentative at best commit.<br />If Tosh can't duplicate a class at UW next year, at his salary, he could be gone in a flash. <br />And having shown a lack of loyalty - and perhaps ethics - once, there is no reason for Sark/UW to trust him at all in the future.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Actually, Tosh's value to Wash. is NOT this year, unless he can convince Shaq among others to decommit and go to Seattle. Tosh's value actually lies in what he can do in 2013 and 2014. He has already begun contacting future recruits. That early contact means much more to these kids than any last minute orchestrations by SC, UCLA or Washington. So many times we have heard about the loyalty of a recruit to a particular coach, because "he was recruiting me for two years."<br /><br />My answer to this would be to create a website on Google setting forth exactly what Lupoi did to Cal and why he did it. His apparent sincerity and earnest way of convincing kid and parents about his loyalty (to Washington) should be seen as gossamer thin. It's all about the money! When the kid or the parents Google him they will see another side of his heartfelt pitch to be a Husky. This will protect us in 2013/14. Hopefully, by that time, we have found a person who can promote the good things about Cal and why the recruit should be there.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">atticus;682963 said:</div><hr>Are you seriously arguing that Tedford has the power to turn other people into slimeballs?<hr></blockquote>He does have the power to turn a throwing motion ugly, so...<br /><br />:p

<blockquote><div class="name-said">elpbear;683286 said:</div><hr>Another thread derailed by DO and anti-DO.<br /><br />Look. DO wants us to win. DO thinks Tedford is never going to win. DO wants Tedford gone.<br /><br />I don't think it's that complicated. Can we all just please move on?<hr></blockquote>DO is like freakin' bruce lee, often finding himself parrying attacks from all sides..

It took YEARS to get an updated stadium.<br /><br />It took YEARS to get new training facilities.<br /><br />Years and years and years of loyal persistence, faith, and trouncing political red tape to get this program/infrastructure in elite competitive position.<br /><br />FINALLY, you're seeing the the benefits of Tedford's "build it and they will come" mantra come to fruition....in spades.<br /><br />....Then TWO WEEKS before LOI (engineered timing), on the cusp of a Top 1-5 recruiting class, your top recruiter bolts without a word, all the while <b><i>[U]INTENTLY[/U]</i></b> DOING HARM to your so-called <b>"<i>family</i>"</b> (existing coaches, players) by telling committed Cal recruits: "Dude, don't go to Cal....f*ck Cal...come to UW."<br /><br />Wow! There is a [U]RIGHT[/U] way of doing things and a WRONG way of moving on. Lupoi chose to [U]<i>SCORCH EARTH</i>[/U] EVERY RELATIONSHIP he had at Cal.<br /><br />Regardless if you're a fan of this school or not, there are no words for such a naked display of disloyalty, lack of inner ethics, greed, and outright aggression/anger to do extensive damage to friendships at your university and undermine their hard work they have put into the program.<br /><br />ACTIONS speak louder than words and I hope recruits witness and realize that Lupoi and his silver tongue talk can't be trusted at <i>ANY LEVEL</i>. His MO is now exposed.<br /><br />The guy chose to become a <i>mercenary</i> and will throw "family, friendships" under the bus without compunction as soon as he's done with them. <br /><br />If Lupoi can do this to Cal - his alma mater, what's to stop him from acting similarly at other programs? <br /><br />Caveat Emptor....big time!

<blockquote><div class="name-said">Papitobear;683495 said:</div><hr>....Then TWO WEEKS before LOI (engineered timing), on the cusp of a Top 1-5 recruiting class, your top recruiter bolts without a word, all the while <b><i>[U]INTENTLY[/U]</i></b> DOING HARM to your so-called <b>"<i>family</i>"</b> (existing coaches, players) by telling committed Cal recruits: "Dude, don't go to Cal....f*ck Cal...come to UW."<br /><br />Wow! There is a [U]RIGHT[/U] way of doing things and a WRONG way of moving on. Lupoi chose to [U]<i>SCORCH EARTH</i>[/U] EVERY RELATIONSHIP he had at Cal.<hr></blockquote>If someone offered me three times my salary to switch jobs, I'd be gone without a second thought. But here's what principled and decent guy says: "Sounds fantastic, we have this big thing coming up in two weeks, then I'd like to take the weekend off to see my family, and start on Monday." If the response is "Great, looking forward working with you," it's the right job. If it's "Sorry, we want you here for years but can't wait for two weeks," and your job is one that depends on long months of relationship-building, you should know that you're probably going to work for dishonest sh!tbags.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">BearyWhite;683519 said:</div><hr>If someone offered me three times my salary to switch jobs, I'd be gone without a second thought. But here's what principled and decent guy says: "Sounds fantastic, we have this big thing coming up in two weeks, then I'd like to take the weekend off to see my family, and start on Monday." If the response is "Great, looking forward working with you," it's the right job. If it's "Sorry, we want you here for years but can't wait for two weeks," and your job is one that depends on long months of relationship-building, you should know that you're probably going to work for dishonest sh!tbags.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />If they said, "no, we need you now, not in two weeks," you then know that the things they are going to be asking you to do during those two weeks are the real reasons why you are getting the new fat paycheck. At that point, you have a decision to make ...

<blockquote><div class="name-said">drunkoski;682976 said:</div><hr>people here want to believe that tedford is different from everyone else and therefore tosh must have been as well. it was all bullshit before and will be afterwards. if we want to win we have to get our hands dirty a little.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Disagree. Reread the 2nd sentence on the Andy Smith bench.<br /><br /><blockquote><div class="name-said">BearyWhite;683519 said:</div><hr>If someone offered me three times my salary to switch jobs, I'd be gone without a second thought. But here's what principled and decent guy says: "Sounds fantastic, we have this big thing coming up in two weeks, then I'd like to take the weekend off to see my family, and start on Monday." If the response is "Great, looking forward working with you," it's the right job. If it's "Sorry, we want you here for years but can't wait for two weeks," and your job is one that depends on long months of relationship-building, you should know that you're probably going to work for dishonest sh!tbags.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Well stated!

<blockquote><div class="name-said">drunkoski;683524 said:</div><hr>my primary issue was him not even telling his players. he didn't even text em. not telling jt in person was pretty slimy too. i don't have an issue with him not giving jt a chance to match since reportably JT told him he wouldn't get into a bidding war. calling recruits is also obviously very slimy, but as you say sadly part of the job.<hr></blockquote><br /><br />DO - my understanding is that Cal matched TWO prior UW offers to Tosh. When JT went to match the SECOND offer (which necessitated a round of hitting on alums for $$), Lupoi gave his word that the matter would be resolved resolved if Cal matched (again). Tosh gave his word he would cease discussions with UW. It wasn't just JT telling him that he "wouldn't get into a bidding war." Cal already had engaged in a bidding war and asked for and received Tosh's assurance that the bidding war was over (after Tosh professed that his heart was at Cal). Having received Tosh's promises, JT and Tosh recruited together, etc. Doesn't it bother you that Tosh gave his word and failed to honor it?

<blockquote><div class="name-said">BearGoggles;684122 said:</div><hr>DO - my understanding is that Cal matched TWO prior UW offers to Tosh. When JT went to match the SECOND offer (which necessitated a round of hitting on alums for $$), Lupoi gave his word that the matter would be resolved resolved if Cal matched (again). Tosh gave his word he would cease discussions with UW. It wasn't just JT telling him that he "wouldn't get into a bidding war." Cal already had engaged in a bidding war and asked for and received Tosh's assurance that the bidding war was over (after Tosh professed that his heart was at Cal). Having received Tosh's promises, JT and Tosh recruited together, etc. Doesn't it bother you that Tosh gave his word and failed to honor it?<hr></blockquote><br /><br />What I wanna know is why all the older players and ex-players that have been vocal about the situation (+ Mike Silver) have clearly stated that they aren't mad at Tosh, in fact they understand why he did what he did. Obviously they have more knowledge of what really went down, which makes this more interesting.<br /><br />What really happened?!

<blockquote><div class="name-said">EchoOfSilence;684127 said:</div><hr>What I wanna know is why all the older players and ex-players that have been vocal about the situation (+ Mike Silver) have clearly stated that they aren't mad at Tosh, in fact they understand why he did what he did. Obviously they have more knowledge of what really went down, which makes this more interesting.<br /><br />What really happened?!<hr></blockquote><br /><br />What Bear Goggles said...that is what really happened according to insiders..Silver has ties and sources but he isn't an insider like others are on the minute details...

Silver, Tepper et all are buddied of Tosh and have his back. They don't know what went on.

Sorry but I think the players are too close to Tosh to see this for what it is. They have a personal relationship and are more forgiving. <br /><br />Silvers being irrational about this too. I had a back and forth with him and he clearly was just shifting the argument without addressing the real issues. <br /><br />I think if there was a shred of truth vindicating Tosh in some light we would've heard from someone by now. Simply saying "you dont know he whole story" and not giving information or a counterpoint is a cop out.

<blockquote><div class="name-said">KoreAmBear;683399 said:</div><hr>@alarsuel you just made California Golden Blogs, what will you do next?<hr></blockquote><br />He's going to the University of Washington!

<blockquote><div class="name-said">EchoOfSilence;684127 said:</div><hr>What I wanna know is why all the older players and ex-players that have been vocal about the situation (+ Mike Silver) have clearly stated that they aren't mad at Tosh, in fact they understand why he did what he did. <b>Obviously they have more knowledge of what really went down, which makes this more interesting.</b><br /><br />What really happened?!<hr></blockquote><br /><br />Do they? and which ex-players?

Think of it from their perspective. Before now, Tosh had always been a Bear, and was a trooper with these guys. Players stick together with players, and Tosh was the closest thing to a player-coach as you can find.<br /><br />To imagine Tosh doing the things he did would be pretty hard for any of these players to accept, and I doubt many of them ever will. Better to accept the "Oregon" narrative, because it makes Tosh's departure sound reasonable, makes it sound like the Tosh they know. Cognitive dissonance y'all.