Agree. I think they are making the calculation that the TV money is better than the out of town fan money, or even the local fan money that may not be able to attend a game.

The TV money more than the ticket revenue. I think overall, the ticket, concessions are about the same as TV revenue. But since TV is fixed revenue, it makes sense for them to maximize the stadium revenue - by generating a full house.

One of the things they could do is offer students free tickets - or else $20 per game if you come after kickoff or after the first 8000 are sold. That would get the fans in the seats quicker. Put in some fan service on the student side to generate revenue, and have a beer garden on Kleeberger like they do at Washington during halftime (or else just serve in the stands).

Tombear,

You and I are on the same page when it comes to attending games. I had season tickets for 37 years, 4 of them in fact as we would always treat another couple to the game. Do you know why? Because going to a football game at CAL was more than just a football game, it was different because it was Memorial, it was the view, it was the atmosphere, it was the CAL Band, it was the great CAL songs, it was the pregame rally at Sproul Hall. Going to a CAL game was different than going to any other college game in the PAC8,10,12. We had such glorious traditions, a culture that could not be duplicated at any other football venue.

Well all that has changed as CAL has now gone Hollywood. Instead of maintaing the culture and traditions, those in charge have copied what goes on at other college venues. From the piped in music to all the other garbage you have to put up to attend a game, it's not the same. In fact, for me, it's torture.

The people in charge think some silence is a sin and that fans are entertained by all the garbage that goes through the speaker system

So why should I go to a game and be tortured. No thanks, I stay home now and will never and I mean never attend another CAL football game.

CaptOski;842563112 said:

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3) I think there's a lag between success and the fan base showing up. Your casual fan probably doesn't even know we're 5-0. Once we have a strong season, and the media really picks up on it then it'll be a part of people's conversations and reach the general pop.

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After thinking on it a bit, I think this is what's really going on. Cal attendance was also not great during the first two Tedford years (2002-2003), with the exception of the usual big draws like USC, UCLA, and Furd. But after having a couple of winning seasons and a lot of excitement and preseason ranking heading into the next one, in 2004 we saw a crowd of 60k show up for a game against New Mexico State. After that we saw consistent attendance of 50k+ for all home games up until the bottom fell out of the Tedford era. So it's clear that it takes a while for casual fans to be convinced that Cal football is worth paying money to see.

That said, tickets were also cheaper for games at old Memorial, before the renovation. The athletic department might do well to offer more deals on tickets for the less exciting opponents.

Student tickets are free, I believe. Even when I was on campus, they were cheap, like $20 for the season, so not much financial cost there anyway.

This is not mentioned much, but after the stadium renovation...it is something that was obviously needed, we finally have decent concessions and bathrooms, and the SAHPC is great, but the atmosphere is not the same, and I am not sure why. I hardly hear the band at all, which is more about presentation, but it feels more like an NFL game than a college venue.

Of course, these kinds of complaints are not uncommon, Texas fans are kind of nostalgic for DKR prior to the arrival of Mack and the Godzillatron, as some of you know a game in Austin is so full of corporate crap it is kind of unbearable.

Strykur;842563135 said:

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Student tickets are free, I believe. Even when I was on campus, they were cheap, like $20 for the season, so not much financial cost there anyway.

This is not mentioned much, but after the stadium renovation...it is something that was obviously needed, we finally have decent concessions and bathrooms, and the SAHPC is great, but the atmosphere is not the same, and I am not sure why. I hardly hear the band at all, which is more about presentation, but it feels more like an NFL game than a college venue.

Of course, these kinds of complaints are not uncommon, Texas fans are kind of nostalgic for DKR prior to the arrival of Mack and the Godzillatron, as some of you know a game in Austin is so full of corporate crap it is kind of unbearable.

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That must give at least three people a seizure per game. When Cal fans complain on here about our replay screens, I shake my head. Granted, I have very good vision. But I have no problem seeing the replays. And when you add screen space, the powers that be merely see ad space (see Texas, the SF Giants, everywhere else with massive screens).

Strykur;842563135 said:

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This is not mentioned much, but after the stadium renovation...it is something that was obviously needed, we finally have decent concessions and bathrooms, and the SAHPC is great, but the atmosphere is not the same, and I am not sure why. I hardly hear the band at all, which is more about presentation, but it feels more like an NFL game than a college venue.

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Have you been to an NFL game recently? While it's true that the Cal Memorial experience has inched a bit closer to that standard, it's still not anywhere near the kind of cacophony you get at one of those games. The noise literally never stops, from the moment you enter to the moment you leave.

First of all, IMHO opinion the people clamoring to move the students are just cheap, they don't want to pay the ESL fees, and so are looking for a way to get 50-year seats without paying them. Converting the student section to alumni will undercut ESL, and my guess is we'd end up with less net revenue overall. You also lose a way to connect with future contributors, by obviously demeaning the student fans. Also, the same people who are too cheap to buy ESL are also probably the first people to dump their tickets when a revenue opportunity presents itself. Do you really want Furdies or U$C people sitting where the students used to sit?

Second, TV and the rules changes, particularly the interminable play reviews, have undercut the stadium experience. Football, when you take off the atmosphere, tends to be better on TV anyway, because things like the block that sprung the touchdown aren't readily apparent without instant replay up the gazoo. By contrast, baseball is far better in person, because so much of what is going on occurs away from where the ball is. Basketball works either on TV or live. When the games get too long, watching them from your couch on a big screen, with free food and flush toilets at hand becomes a lot more attractive.

Thirdly, Cal simply has a lot of fair weather friends, even among the students and alumni. I daresay that the bottom dropping out of the Tedford era, after so much promise of finally becoming a Division I power, probably scarred a lot of fans, who won't come back until Dykes has at least gotten us to a second-tier bowl (Sun, Peach, Outback, Holiday, etc.) and won it. If that happens, attendance will pick up again.

I will continue to bear witness in person from Section I, along with my father and our families. Rose Bowl or bust!!!

I think another big issue is that Bay Area sports have been generally good this decade (compared to last decade, when they were decrepit) so Cal fans are having to make choices about how to spend their money.

Do they choose to spend their money on the defending champion Warriors?
Or head on over to watch the Giants in their beautiful ballpark?
Or make a choice to watch the Raiders or the 49ers instead?

Many Cal fans local to the Bay are still probably pro fans first--many of my Cal alumni friends would still pick the NFL over college football to watch during a random weekend. Cal hasn't had great success since 2009 so it's easy for alumni to get detached from the team and attendance to suffer during these lull periods.

Back in 2006/2007 when we had multiple 72,000+ sellouts, Furd was pathetic, Giants were going nowhere, A's were doing nothing, Raiders were bad as always, 49ers were mediocre, and the Warriors were making a bit of a run but the NBA playoffs are in May. So, we were not just a winning team at the time, we were the only show going on in the entire Bay Area. Sharks do not count.

sycasey;842563148 said:

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Have you been to an NFL game recently? While it's true that the Cal Memorial experience has inched a bit closer to that standard, it's still not anywhere near the kind of cacophony you get at one of those games. The noise literally never stops, from the moment you enter to the moment you leave.

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I make it to one or two broncos games here in Denver each year, and have to say I don't get all the NFL hate. Was there yesterday, I don't remember a single promotion that intruded on my game watching... comfortable chair backs, lots of replays on the big screen, some piped in music that wasn't all that bad, some beer to be had, and a good game on the field. Only saw one angry drunk all game and it wasn't even close to fight level.

Cal games are a complete mess of distracting stuff, poorly planned promotions, knees in backs for most, and poor concessions. The remodel was fun for a couple of years, but the luster is wearing off and the fact of the matter is that when close to capacity CMS is a uncomfortable mess for all but the 9,000 west-siders, and even there, I'd say it's not on par with comparable CFB stadiums. That said, it is what we have, so Cal needs to focus on making the games better for those who do attend.

The best thing to happen during the Tedford era is bandwagon fans. Win and they will come and they are a good thing.

Honestly, I think some of the student section should be sold to the general public but only enough to get it full every game.

There would also be rules like you will stand the whole game or leave, must to the card stunt.

I doubt it happens. Likely they'll convert all the student section or nothing per the usual UC Berkeley methodology of pissing people off.

oskithepimp;842562814 said:

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I was at the game and thought the crowd was great. Sure,it wasn't full, but those that were there were loud and there was a lot to cheer about. One of the more fun games I've been to.

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Pretty much how I felt... I was disappointed with the size of the crowd, but it didn't look "terrible" once the game was well underway and it was a very spirited crowd.

One of the really nice things that happened after the game is Goff was the last person to leave the field... He did an interview or something... so as he was jogging towards the North Tunnel he got a rousing ovation from the crowd, with the folks in the South Endzone really letting him hear it. He was excited threw his towel (almost) into the crowd... It's one of the things you love about college sports.

LessMilesMoreTedford;842561989 said:

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Pretty sad.

I don't know if Cal will ever come close to selling out a non-California game, people just don't want to go through the hassle of going to games anymore.

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Attendance lags a year from success; it has for the 45 years I been keeping track. We've lost the equity in our fanbase that had been built during Tedford due to poor seasons, less parking, stadium club price increases and the embarrassing results from football graduation rates. This is nothing new, it's trending the way it always has. If you remember, 28,000 showed up for the season opener v. Baylor in 2002 which was Tedford's first game.

ColoradoBear1;842563435 said:

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I make it to one or two broncos games here in Denver each year, and have to say I don't get all the NFL hate. Was there yesterday, I don't remember a single promotion that intruded on my game watching... comfortable chair backs, lots of replays on the big screen, some piped in music that wasn't all that bad, some beer to be had, and a good game on the field. Only saw one angry drunk all game and it wasn't even close to fight level.

Cal games are a complete mess of distracting stuff, poorly planned promotions, knees in backs for most, and poor concessions. The remodel was fun for a couple of years, but the luster is wearing off and the fact of the matter is that when close to capacity CMS is a uncomfortable mess for all but the 9,000 west-siders, and even there, I'd say it's not on par with comparable CFB stadiums. That said, it is what we have, so Cal needs to focus on making the games better for those who do attend.

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NFL games tend to be very professionally produced, no doubt. One of the issues with Cal is that they try to do promotions and whatnot, but there is too often something "off" about them so it comes off poorly.

That said, the last couple of NFL games I went to (at Candlestick Park) I noticed that they pretty much constantly played music and/or advertisements over the sound system, at all times other than when an actual play was being run. It was all professionally and slickly presented, but there was never any time to just sit and take in the atmosphere, not like you get in college games. They are constantly selling their product to you.

But hey, that's what the NFL is, a billion-dollar business. The college experience should be different and more traditional, otherwise what is the point in going to watch football played at a lower level of quality?

barabbas;842563490 said:

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Attendance lags a year from success; it has for the 45 years I been keeping track. We've lost the equity in our fanbase that had been built during Tedford due to poor seasons, less parking, stadium club price increases and the embarrassing results from football graduation rates. This is nothing new, it's trending the way it always has. If you remember, 28,000 showed up for the season opener v. Baylor in 2002 which was Tedford's first game.

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And to further your point, only 33,553 showed up for our opener against Southern Miss the following year.

59000 for New Mexico State in JTs third year. I had never seen so many show up for a game with a "who cares" opponent. That meant the fan base was solid. They just wanted to see the 1-0 Bears.

Many of you do realize that CMS isn't exactly easy to get to by car right?

The last time I was at CMS it was for Real Madrid, and seriously it was only because you get to see them maybe once every 5 years in your life unless you live in Europe. For many fans who live in the peninsula, it either means nightmare traffic to get into and out of Berkeley, pay an exorbitant amount for parking, and terrible parking situation on top of that.

I hesitate to say this, but Stanfurd has WAAAAY BETTER parking - they just charge 20 bucks (well, the last time i went to a tennis game 3 years ago), and it's not like if you have to fight through 30 minutes of hell on road. Yes there's some traffic in PA but you have a El Camino, University, Embarcardero and tons of outlets.

The last time I drove up to BART from where I live and walked to CMS? It took a total of 2 hours to get to CMS. And I doubt I am the minority here.

And oh yes it's not as if Stanfurd attendance is great - they are probably even worse ... for a consistently good team the last few years they sure don't represent well ...

But you gotta remember that a lot of students go to CAL to study their tail off and not because of football. This ain't 'Bama or Ole Miss where with all due respect, not as competitive in academics.

Strykur;842562040 said:

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I expect to see lots of empty seats on Halloween now.

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If Cal beats the Utes, there will likely be a night game at CMS against $C.

Who is going to buy seats above the standing students. Wrong sell the lower seats. Put the students in the upper half

oskidunker;842563561 said:

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Who is going to buy seats above the standing students. Wrong sell the lower seats. Put the students in the upper half

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That would suck every bit of energy out of the stadium.

CMS actually has a varying slope that starts pretty shallow and gets steeper at the top. Do it right and standing students absolutely will not block the views from the back rows. Or look at Haas (only problem there IMO is that student section is not deep enough).

And doing it right would also mean digging under that top 1/3 and putting in facilities. So, not going to happen for a while due to expense.

barabbas;842563490 said:

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Attendance lags a year from success; it has for the 45 years I been keeping track. We've lost the equity in our fanbase that had been built during Tedford due to poor seasons, less parking, stadium club price increases and the embarrassing results from football graduation rates. This is nothing new, it's trending the way it always has. If you remember, 28,000 showed up for the season opener v. Baylor in 2002 which was Tedford's first game.

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Do you really think that grad rates hurt attendance? I can't imagine any casual swing fan that would have this in their mental calculus about whether or not they head over for a game.

There was SAT test last Sat. don't know if it affected attendance.

LessMilesMoreTedford;842562072 said:

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Yes we all know how pathetic the Farm is at drawing fans.

Cal has ten times as many students and graduates every year than the Furd. Probably at least a good million who live in the Bay or at least an hour's drive away.

And yet the problem persists.

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Attendance for Stanford's game against Arizona on Saturday was 46,628. That's tickets scanned. Cal's was 42,042.

You can continue to beat the drum about Stanford's Stadium De Minimis. Here are last year's attendance stats, both teams had 6 home games.

Stanford: 287,174 total, 47,862 avg per game
Cal: 286,051 total, 47,675 avg per game

But then you have 10X as many students and graduates every year than Stanford. And a significantly larger population of alums in the Bay Area.

Stanford has no stadium debt. The Stadium is easy to get to. The seating is comfortable. There are no porta potties. Stanford's recent (5 year) record is pretty good. 4 BCS games. And we will win the Big Game this year....and Stanford Stadium will be full.

threepointer;842563728 said:

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Attendance for Stanford's game against Arizona on Saturday was 46,628. That's tickets scanned. Cal's was 42,042.

You can continue to beat the drum about Stanford's Stadium De Minimis. Here are last year's attendance stats, both teams had 6 home games.

Stanford: 287,174 total, 47,862 avg per game
Cal: 286,051 total, 47,675 avg per game

But then you have 10X as many students and graduates every year than Stanford. And a significantly larger population of alums in the Bay Area.

And Stanford has no stadium debt.

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As someone who's actually attended all of the games from last year and was at the Arizona game, 46k last night "scanned" is laughable. 46k is much more likely tickets sold + distributed/given out. With regards to last year's numbers, you can't seriously expect me to believe that the half-empty stadium against Army + Davis and quarter-empty (at best) stadium against Utah and Oregon State worked out to an average of 94% of capacity.

iVinshe;842563729 said:

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As someone who's actually attended all of the games from last year and was at the Arizona game, 46k "scanned" is laughable. 46k is much more likely tickets sold + distributed/given out.

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Additionally 20% of these tickets at worst go to local road alumni. 30% if it's Oregon, 40% if it's UCLA/USC, 60% if it's Cal.

threepointer;842563728 said:

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Attendance for Stanford's game against Arizona on Saturday was 46,628. That's tickets scanned. Cal's was 42,042.

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LOL you actually think furd reports scanned tickets and not paid attendance?

iVinshe;842563729 said:

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As someone who's actually attended all of the games from last year and was at the Arizona game, 46k last night "scanned" is laughable. 46k is much more likely tickets sold + distributed/given out. With regards to last year's numbers, you can't seriously expect me to believe that the half-empty stadium against Army + Davis and quarter-empty (at best) stadium against Utah and Oregon State worked out to an average of 94% of capacity.

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Actually, that's a problem with Stanford fans and rules. Half of the "scanned" tickets were outside the stadium for most of the game. The Stanford tailgate areas are within walking distance of the Stadium (100 yards). You can enter or leave the stadium at your leisure and return. So, if it's Army, Davis, or a 55-17 blowout of Arizona...why not just go outside and watch the game on a wide screen while having an adult beverage. Both Cal and Stanford could benefit by dropping the ridiculous ban on beer or other beverage sales in the stadiums.

College students and alums drink and don't like to be patted down? I'm shocked.

threepointer;842563728 said:

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Attendance for Stanford's game against Arizona on Saturday was 46,628. That's tickets scanned. Cal's was 42,042.

You can continue to beat the drum about Stanford's Stadium De Minimis. Here are last year's attendance stats, both teams had 6 home games.

Stanford: 287,174 total, 47,862 avg per game
Cal: 286,051 total, 47,675 avg per game

But then you have 10X as many students and graduates every year than Stanford. And a significantly larger population of alums in the Bay Area.

Stanford has no stadium debt. The Stadium is easy to get to. The seating is comfortable. There are no porta potties. Stanford's recent (5 year) record is pretty good. 4 BCS games. And we will win the Big Game this year....and Stanford Stadium will be full.

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LOL, you know damn well why it will be full: Because Cal will bring 20,000 vocal fans and the stadium doesn't hold very many people anyway.

See you there! Go Bears!

Cal has the second largest attendance increase in college football this year (+16%) behind only Virginia (+29%). We are actually tied with Kentucky at 16%.

hanky1;842564153 said:

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Cal has the second largest attendance increase in college football this year (+16%) behind only Virginia (+29%). We are actually tied with Kentucky at 16%.

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It will be off the hook for $C (esp. if we win at least 1/2 against Utah and UCLA) and ASU. Oregon State who knows.