This is hardly worth the carbon emissions spent storing this on a high energy data server.....

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/15492344/wish-college-football-expansion-realignment-looked-like

I can't believe how lame this analysis is. My dog sheots a more accurate map of major conference realignment.

Why do idiots keep thinking Boise State has more than a chance in hell to get into a PAC-12 expansion scenario?

Strykur;842687429 said:

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Why do idiots keep thinking Boise State has more than a chance in hell to get into a PAC-12 expansion scenario?

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+1 That was my first thought. BSU isn't Pac12 material. I would let it slide if it they divided things into: old Pac8 and the rest.

Texas plus Oklahoma plus 2 Texas or Oklahoma- only thing that would expand not dilute the conference

ShaggyTexas has a 1000 page thread with 3.5 million views if you want to slog through it for ideas


(not an endorsement)

I get Texas-OU but if it follows PAC history wouldn't Colorado State and Utah State be added for continuity...sounds strange but it seems we have a pattern to fulfill...

FCBear;842687454 said:

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ShaggyTexas has a 1000 page thread with 3.5 million views if you want to slog through it for ideas


(not an endorsement)

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Shocky is jelly.

NYCGOBEARS;842687457 said:

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Shocky is jelly.

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That's a nice slogan

FCBear;842687456 said:

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I get Texas-OU but if it follows PAC history wouldn't Colorado State and Utah State be added for continuity...sounds strange but it seems we have a pattern to fulfill...

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Hate the authors proposal. I'd prefer kicking out Utah and Colorado and getting four new teams from Texas. Utah State gave the world Merlin Olsen. But Pac-12? I hope not.

Forget expansion, move Stanford and Cal to the south and Utah and Colorado to the north, the way it should have been in the first place. Why placate two new schools who have no history in the league over long-time members, including one of the original members? If indeed that was what happened.

NYCGOBEARS;842687457 said:

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Shocky is jelly.

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That makes me feel like I need a bath.

petalumabear;842687468 said:

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That makes me feel like I need a bath.

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A long one.

beelzebear;842687431 said:

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... I would let it slide if it they divided things into: old Pac8 and the rest.

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+1
Pac = Pacific (as in the Ocean)

States on the Pacific Ocean = 3 with 8 teams
- WA has UW and WSU
- OR has OR and OSU
- CA has ucla, u$c, furd Jr u and University of California, Berkeley (Cal)

Pac8 and t'hell with anything else.

1979bear;842687459 said:

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Hate the authors proposal. I'd prefer kicking out Utah and Colorado and getting four new teams from Texas. Utah State gave the world Merlin Olsen. But Pac-12? I hope not.

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Lol. Big Ten only got a 6 year TV deal from Fox. All P5 conferences outside of the SEC will have exipring deals with in a year of each other. Might get to interesting then, especially if TV revenue is declining (look at ESPN and the effect of cord cutting already). Before then, grant of rights makes shuffling hard.... Sure adding a team is easy, but that's dilution especially in p12 territory. No way the nets pay more PER TEAM of we add then likes of boise, cal state anything or csu (ft collins that is). Why would the conference vote to reduce money,just to get to 16.ESPN overpaid for the playoff too. Expanding that to 8 would mean giving back money for the semis and finals.. And the Rose/sugar just to get extra for the quarters. Might not turn out that profitable. But yeah, 2023 might be crazy, especially if some of these smaller schools want in, or are let in now, and the bigs want them out later.

1979bear;842687459 said:

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Hate the authors proposal. I'd prefer kicking out Utah and Colorado and getting four new teams from Texas. Utah State gave the world Merlin Olsen. But Pac-12? I hope not.

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but it follows the PAC footprint to consolidate a state

CALiforniALUM;842687424 said:

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This is hardly worth the carbon emissions spent storing this on a high energy data server.....

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/15492344/wish-college-football-expansion-realignment-looked-like

I can't believe how lame this analysis is. My dog sheots a more accurate map of major conference realignment.

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Wow, whomever wrote this really has no knowledge of what expansion is really about. It is about adding new television markets, and television inventory that is strong enough to raise the current average. Colorado State, UNLV, Hawaii, these schools do nothing but lower the average. Las Vegas would need to triple in size to match the Bay Area media market, and the Bay isn't even the biggest media market in the conference. Honolulu would have to grow by over (5) times to match. Also, the only real reason it made sense to add Utah and Colorado, was to gain the money from the conference title game. Adding them as media markets, didn't do much.

For the Pac-12 it is Texas or bust.

Promoting the idea of the Pac-8 breaking away and forming a new conference with some good ACC schools makes more sense than that (Duke, North Carolina, Clemson, Virginia, etc.), and that is crazy for implying both the Pac-12 and the ACC give up allegiances and disintegrate.

golden sloth;842687495 said:

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Wow, whomever wrote this really has no knowledge of what expansion is really about. It is about adding new television markets, and television inventory that is strong enough to raise the current average. Colorado State, UNLV, Hawaii, these schools do nothing but lower the average. Las Vegas would need to triple in size to match the Bay Area media market, and the Bay isn't even the biggest media market in the conference. Honolulu would have to grow by over (5) times to match. Also, the only real reason it made sense to add Utah and Colorado, was to gain the money from the conference title game. Adding them as media markets, didn't do much.

For the Pac-12 it is Texas or bust.

Promoting the idea of the Pac-8 breaking away and forming a new conference with some good ACC schools makes more sense than that (Duke, North Carolina, Clemson, Virginia, etc.), and that is crazy for implying both the Pac-12 and the ACC give up allegiances and disintegrate.

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Adding schools 3 times zones away (travel, cost, jet lag) is indeed crazy, which doesn't preclude it given the geniuses that decide and manufacture the conferences.
Pac8 made sense; everything else is nutz.

Wouldn't maximize revenue, but eight eight team major conferences would be better for student athletes than four sixteen team super conferences. Round robin in football, no conference championship games, and an eight team playoff. Double round robin in hoops and a more manageable conference tournament. More sensible geographic structure, more reasonable travel, and less missed classes.

CALiforniALUM;842687424 said:

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This is hardly worth the carbon emissions spent storing this on a high energy data server.....

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/15492344/wish-college-football-expansion-realignment-looked-like

I can't believe how lame this analysis is. My dog sheots a more accurate map of major conference realignment.

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Why all the love for North South in the PAC12.
I can just as easily split up to an East - West division.
With the West being made up of the old PAC8.
That would keep all traditional West Coast rivalries (which have been around for as much as 100 years) in place.

If you add Tex and OK to the PAC 12 plus maybe two more (BYU, Air Force???); then an East - West division would make even more sense since Tex and OK have huge separate fan bases and strong natural recruiting areas.
Plus adding BYU and Air Force give Utah and Colorado more natural in-state rivals. (I don't know much about the academics of BYU but IMO Air Force should have strong academics.)

I wanted to bring this back because the Big-12 news cycle is now a circus, first there was Houston, now UCF is pushing itself as a "monster," Justin Timberlake pushing Memphis, and now some bullshit that Tulane is in the cards. Yeah, no fucking joke, TULANE.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/17158462/ucf-knights-ideal-fit-big-12-according-athletic-director-danny-white

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/113630/could-tulane-be-the-big-12-expansion-wildcard

Go look at the realignment thread on shaggytexas thread..crazy ****..

FCBear;842687490 said:

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but it follows the PAC footprint to consolidate a state

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I feel as though we need new media markets more than we need to consolidate the states currently in the Pac.

BYU and Air Force are dead before delivery!

golden sloth;842687495 said:

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Wow, whomever wrote this really has no knowledge of what expansion is really about. It is about adding new television markets, and television inventory that is strong enough to raise the current average. Colorado State, UNLV, Hawaii, these schools do nothing but lower the average. Las Vegas would need to triple in size to match the Bay Area media market, and the Bay isn't even the biggest media market in the conference. Honolulu would have to grow by over (5) times to match. Also, the only real reason it made sense to add Utah and Colorado, was to gain the money from the conference title game. Adding them as media markets, didn't do much.

For the Pac-12 it is Texas or bust.

Promoting the idea of the Pac-8 breaking away and forming a new conference with some good ACC schools makes more sense than that (Duke, North Carolina, Clemson, Virginia, etc.), and that is crazy for implying both the Pac-12 and the ACC give up allegiances and disintegrate.

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Hawaii actually brings a lot to the PAC-12 in regards to inventory. It's kind of like adding 1.5 teams. The Hawaii exemption applies to all sports. It allows any team that plays a contest or series hosted by Hawaii the opportunity to schedule an extra contest or series. That means the conference would have 10 extra basketball games.(Hawaii+9 PAC teams that play on the islands). Teams can play 13 games if they play at Aloha Stadium, which could add up to 6 games(Hawaii + up to 5 PAC teams) to the total inventory.

Beginning next year, football teams can also start their season a week early if they travel to Honolulu. People are pretty much referring to it as a Week 0. If the PAC-XX added Hawaii, Week 0 would then turn into PAC-XX Week. The maximum number of Week 0 FBS games would be 8 or 9 in any given year and the PAC-XX would have 5-6 of those.(Hawaii, plus 4-5 others based on a 9 game schedule.) The potential to own most of the new opening weekend football inventory could be just as valuable as a conference championship game, if not more.

dinan3;842710596 said:

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BYU and Air Force are dead before delivery!

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BYU will be added to the Big 12. An announcement should come within the next week or two. This will be a blow to the Pac 12 as it will expand the footprint of the Big 12 into the west. There is also talk of possibly adding CSU.

I get that people don't want to add BYU for non-athletic reasons, but they are easily the best non-P5 out there. Their athletics are strong from top to bottom. It would have been nice to keep the Big 12 out of our footprint.

Vegas Bear;842710702 said:

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BYU will be added to the Big 12. An announcement should come within the next week or two. This will be a blow to the Pac 12 as it will expand the footprint of the Big 12 into the west. There is also talk of possibly adding CSU.

I get that people don't want to add BYU for non-athletic reasons, but they are easily the best non-P5 out there. Their athletics are strong from top to bottom. It would have been nice to keep the Big 12 out of our footprint.

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I disagree, the big 12 is just a zombie conference right now waiting for someone to kill it off.

Vegas Bear;842710702 said:

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It would have been nice to keep the Big 12 out of our footprint.

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The total population of the P12 states adds up to ~69 million. Utah is 3 million of that. That's 1/23rd of the total population.

Not much to protect in Utah. Sure it's bad for the University of Utah if BYU goes B12, but the Pac 12 cannot really afford to add a school like BYU (even more so now that they have added Utah). The Big 12 has an entirely different TV contract, so the math works out so the new schools don't dilute the TV $$$ but actually add to the $$$ to current B12 members who won't pay out a even share.

The main issue right now facing the P12 is that the in-market interest level (ie CA, or even more so Southern CA) is not enough to warrant Charter and DTV from carrying the P12 network at the current price. Adding schools outside the footprint that dilute the conference just to keep up might just dilute even more interest in the P12N.

The math is was very different for the B12 adding Rutgers and Maryland. They took it as almost a given that they would get their network carried in the DC and NYC markets. That means big $$ through expansion. Honest revisionist question for the P12N - would addition of CA schools increase the interest level in CA markets enough to force carriage on Charter and DTV?

And duh, UT and OU = instant profit. But that would have to wait until 2023 at the soonest, unless someone wants to challenge the grant of rights, or make a play to dissolve the B12. If the B12 invites a lot of small time schools that don't deliver, OU and UT might very well look to move in 2023 as the B12 schedule could absolutely become a sham. On the other hand, put UT and OU in different divisions, have them play the RRS every year in October, and get enough UT/OU Conference Championship games, and maybe the strategy of adding schools will work out - just for the purpose of serving as fodder to the two most popular programs in the conference.

It's a zombie conference that just disbursed $30 million plus per team (and that does not even include third tier tv rights).

Vegas Bear;842710712 said:

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It's a zombie conference that just disbursed $30 million plus per team (and that does not even include third tier tv rights).

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That's actually nominally the same as the p12 (we get bowl, FB playoff and hoops money on top of media rights as well), and there is almost no hope for a 3rd tier network in the b12. UCLA gets as much from 3rd tier as Texas does for LHN (avg $15 mil), without the TV rights. So if Larry can ever sell the p12N, there could be a lot of cash in waiting.

What are the chances of the P12Network just folding as it exists and redistributing itself in a similar deal with ESPN? (On a side note I always thought NBC might be a reasonable partner to approach about partnering for a Pac network deal seeing that FOX will get either the B1G or the SEC eventually)

I think the pac 12 network should team up with the big 12. Put those games on the network for a fee.

byu did not pass the academic test, and not playing on Sunday and football only? This was covered several years ago.........

dpc8302;842710697 said:

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Hawaii actually brings a lot to the PAC-12 in regards to inventory. It's kind of like adding 1.5 teams. The Hawaii exemption applies to all sports. It allows any team that plays a contest or series hosted by Hawaii the opportunity to schedule an extra contest or series. That means the conference would have 10 extra basketball games.(Hawaii+9 PAC teams that play on the islands). Teams can play 13 games if they play at Aloha Stadium, which could add up to 6 games(Hawaii + up to 5 PAC teams) to the total inventory.

Beginning next year, football teams can also start their season a week early if they travel to Honolulu. People are pretty much referring to it as a Week 0. If the PAC-XX added Hawaii, Week 0 would then turn into PAC-XX Week. The maximum number of Week 0 FBS games would be 8 or 9 in any given year and the PAC-XX would have 5-6 of those.(Hawaii, plus 4-5 others based on a 9 game schedule.) The potential to own most of the new opening weekend football inventory could be just as valuable as a conference championship game, if not more.

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It would also allow the Pac--XX to dominate the late night airwaves with sports bars all running the game from Aloha Stadium into the wee hours.