calumnus said:

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KoreAmBear said:

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puget sound cal fan said:

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Well, if Fox was trying to run-Bradley-off, he succeeded, right?

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I don't think he was trying to run off Bradley, our best player. I think Fox just wanted things done his way, and he sent a message to him by sitting him in the second half at UCLA and calling him a 'good' player during the post-game presser. Fox probably thought Bradley needed it. Bradley likely felt disrespected.

Let's see if the better chemistry narrative plays out this season.

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Yeah, that was bad.

He also benched Bradley and Kelly for the start of the Stanford game in the PAC-12 Tournament.

He disrespected the players in his first speech to the team and three starters immediately transferred.

He is a fairly young coach but he is old school. As I've said, I think that is a really bad fit for most kids of this generation, especially elite African American players, but particularly at a place like Cal.

However, he is finding a niche with foreign and now especially African immigrant players, which he started doing at Georgia and who are now the majority of his recruits at Cal.

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Enjoy your comments and data research CalAlumnus - however to be objective and not consider the verdict closed, 1) the 3 players who transferred had both feet out the door - and regardless of who the new coach was, were gone (per one parent of her son, and the other two, per the players to a person). I don't know if Fox will raise the program to the top half of the conference by next season, but He has the full backing of the AD, has the respect of the roster (heard that from starters and the back ups) each player says the coach/staff has their trust and that they are confident in the preparation of the team via practices and opponent game planning. Coaching is not a "democracy" the Coach is in charge and knowledge, development, preparation and confidence are key factors in a team growth. Elite black players buy into the trust and belief in the coach/staff's ability to develop the players and chemistry, along with consistently treating each player the same(ie Cronin at ucla, Bobby Hurley asu, Smith at wsu who are not warm and fuzzy coaches). Thus far Coach Fox has the respect of the team. Can He/staff recruit better, can they develop the 3 promising freshmen, can they get the team to play better defense, along with getting more out of Kuany, Jalen, Joel, Jared? We don't know. Yes on finding his niche but He also has recruited Hyder, Roberson, Bowers. Fox is dogmatic and frankly does not care about the outside "keyboard warriors"/writers etc that have not seen his team. I am remaining neutral till the end of this season, before putting the heat on. Most concerned with lack of interior defense, limited # of 3 point shooters, and while athleticism is improving, still bottom half of conference.

4thGenCal said:

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calumnus said:

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KoreAmBear said:

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puget sound cal fan said:

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Well, if Fox was trying to run-Bradley-off, he succeeded, right?

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I don't think he was trying to run off Bradley, our best player. I think Fox just wanted things done his way, and he sent a message to him by sitting him in the second half at UCLA and calling him a 'good' player during the post-game presser. Fox probably thought Bradley needed it. Bradley likely felt disrespected.

Let's see if the better chemistry narrative plays out this season.

---

Yeah, that was bad.

He also benched Bradley and Kelly for the start of the Stanford game in the PAC-12 Tournament.

He disrespected the players in his first speech to the team and three starters immediately transferred.

He is a fairly young coach but he is old school. As I've said, I think that is a really bad fit for most kids of this generation, especially elite African American players, but particularly at a place like Cal.

However, he is finding a niche with foreign and now especially African immigrant players, which he started doing at Georgia and who are now the majority of his recruits at Cal.

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Enjoy your comments and data research CalAlumnus - however to be objective and not consider the verdict closed, 1) the 3 players who transferred had both feet out the door - and regardless of who the new coach was, were gone (per one parent of her son, and the other two, per the players to a person). I don't know if Fox will raise the program to the top half of the conference by next season, but He has the full backing of the AD, has the respect of the roster (heard that from starters and the back ups) each player says the coach/staff has their trust and that they are confident in the preparation of the team via practices and opponent game planning. Coaching is not a "democracy" the Coach is in charge and knowledge, development, preparation and confidence are key factors in a team growth. Elite black players buy into the trust and belief in the coach/staff's ability to develop the players and chemistry, along with consistently treating each player the same(ie Cronin at ucla, Bobby Hurley asu, Smith at wsu who are not warm and fuzzy coaches). Thus far Coach Fox has the respect of the team. Can He/staff recruit better, can they develop the 3 promising freshmen, can they get the team to play better defense, along with getting more out of Kuany, Jalen, Joel, Jared? We don't know. Yes on finding his niche but He also has recruited Hyder, Roberson, Bowers. Fox is dogmatic and frankly does not care about the outside "keyboard warriors"/writers etc that have not seen his team. I am remaining neutral till the end of this season, before putting the heat on. Most concerned with lack of interior defense, limited # of 3 point shooters, and while athleticism is improving, still bottom half of conference.

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I wasn't counting transfers, and I said "most" so I was thinking Brown, Kuany, Thiemann, Anywanwu, Alajiki, Celestine, Klonaras and Okafor. So yes, Bowser and Roberson from BOD are the two exceptions, so 80%. I wouldn't call them "elite" but add local players, especially BOD, as an obvious recruiting niche.

Those are both good niches for Cal. My concern is they may be small pools and we need to fish in big pools too. Fox in his 16 years as a HC has never landed a recruit from LA or SoCal in general (except Anywanwu from San Diego, who fits the first category). It is tough to be even a moderately successful coach for California's flagship school without recruiting California's largest metroplolis.

As far as players "having a foot out the door" that sounds like a cop-out. They entered the portal a couple days after Fox was introduced. They could have entered the portal before Fox was hired. Fox might have convinced them to stay. Fox did the opposite. I only have connections to the Sueings, but Fox's speech about getting the players to work "harder" on the court and in the classroom, implying they were lazy or dumb something, was insulting to a guy who lead the team in scoring and rebounding AND was All PAC-12 Academic in two years of pre-med classes at Cal. These were incredibly hard working and highly self motivated young men. What they needed to hear was how he would make them better, not how he was going to be a hardass and make them work harder.

This team may not be a "democracy" but the players can vote with their feet, either by not coming or by leaving. The best organizations these days are lead by more democratic, collaborative leaders. Moreover, the type of person who is attracted to Cal is generally not looking for an authoritarian leadership style, as a coach, a teacher or as a future employer. There are ways to teach without relying on punishment, especially when it is someone like Matt Bradley.

So you say Fox doesn't care what players or fans think and that is exactly my point. He thinks it is HIS team. The players are his unpaid employees, he makes the rules, his way or the highway. I think the players are the team. He serves them. He is paid, and paid extremely well, to make them better. To teach. The players, and the fans, are his clients. I want every kid that chooses Cal to be happy they made that choice. I root for them.

And the above is true whether we win 0, 25 or 25.

calumnus said:

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4thGenCal said:

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calumnus said:

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KoreAmBear said:

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puget sound cal fan said:

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Well, if Fox was trying to run-Bradley-off, he succeeded, right?

---

I don't think he was trying to run off Bradley, our best player. I think Fox just wanted things done his way, and he sent a message to him by sitting him in the second half at UCLA and calling him a 'good' player during the post-game presser. Fox probably thought Bradley needed it. Bradley likely felt disrespected.

Let's see if the better chemistry narrative plays out this season.

---

Yeah, that was bad.

He also benched Bradley and Kelly for the start of the Stanford game in the PAC-12 Tournament.

He disrespected the players in his first speech to the team and three starters immediately transferred.

He is a fairly young coach but he is old school. As I've said, I think that is a really bad fit for most kids of this generation, especially elite African American players, but particularly at a place like Cal.

However, he is finding a niche with foreign and now especially African immigrant players, which he started doing at Georgia and who are now the majority of his recruits at Cal.

---

Enjoy your comments and data research CalAlumnus - however to be objective and not consider the verdict closed, 1) the 3 players who transferred had both feet out the door - and regardless of who the new coach was, were gone (per one parent of her son, and the other two, per the players to a person). I don't know if Fox will raise the program to the top half of the conference by next season, but He has the full backing of the AD, has the respect of the roster (heard that from starters and the back ups) each player says the coach/staff has their trust and that they are confident in the preparation of the team via practices and opponent game planning. Coaching is not a "democracy" the Coach is in charge and knowledge, development, preparation and confidence are key factors in a team growth. Elite black players buy into the trust and belief in the coach/staff's ability to develop the players and chemistry, along with consistently treating each player the same(ie Cronin at ucla, Bobby Hurley asu, Smith at wsu who are not warm and fuzzy coaches). Thus far Coach Fox has the respect of the team. Can He/staff recruit better, can they develop the 3 promising freshmen, can they get the team to play better defense, along with getting more out of Kuany, Jalen, Joel, Jared? We don't know. Yes on finding his niche but He also has recruited Hyder, Roberson, Bowers. Fox is dogmatic and frankly does not care about the outside "keyboard warriors"/writers etc that have not seen his team. I am remaining neutral till the end of this season, before putting the heat on. Most concerned with lack of interior defense, limited # of 3 point shooters, and while athleticism is improving, still bottom half of conference.

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I wasn't counting transfers, and I said "most" so I was thinking Brown, Kuany, Thiemann, Anywanwu, Alajiki, Celestine, Klonaras and Okafor. So yes, Bowser and Roberson from BOD are the two exceptions, so 80%. I wouldn't call them "elite" but add local players, especially BOD, as an obvious recruiting niche.

Those are both good niches for Cal. My concern is they may be small pools and we need to fish in big pools too. Fox in his 16 years as a HC has never landed a recruit from LA or SoCal in general (except Anywanwu from San Diego, who fits the first category). It is tough to be even a moderately successful coach for California's flagship school without recruiting California's largest metroplolis.

As far as players "having a foot out the door" that sounds like a cop-out. They entered the portal a couple days after Fox was introduced. They could have entered the portal before Fox was hired. Fox might have convinced them to stay. Fox did the opposite. I only have connections to the Sueings, but Fox's speech about getting the players to work "harder" on the court and in the classroom, implying they were lazy or dumb something, was insulting to a guy who lead the team in scoring and rebounding AND was All PAC-12 Academic in two years of pre-med classes at Cal. These were incredibly hard working and highly self motivated young men. What they needed to hear was how he would make them better, not how he was going to be a hardass and make them work harder.

This team may not be a "democracy" but the players can vote with their feet, either by not coming or by leaving. The best organizations these days are lead by more democratic, collaborative leaders. Moreover, the type of person who is attracted to Cal is generally not looking for an authoritarian leadership style, as a coach, a teacher or as a future employer. There are ways to teach without relying on punishment, especially when it is someone like Matt Bradley.

So you say Fox doesn't care what players or fans think and that is exactly my point. He thinks it is HIS team. The players are his unpaid employees, he makes the rules, his way or the highway. I think the players are the team. He serves them. He is paid, and paid extremely well, to make them better. To teach. The players, and the fans, are his clients. I want every kid that chooses Cal to be happy they made that choice. I root for them.

And the above is true whether we win 0, 25 or 25.

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My point is to be objective and not continually knock Fox/staff - Fox has the respect of the players - I know this first hand, he inherited an extremely difficult situation and mix in the Cal process (University, allocation of monies, lack of practice facility, and the City regulations with the Pandemic etc) its even tougher. Fox was referring to the writers who forecast a last place finish w/o seeing his team practice/play etc and those who are critical w/o having first hand knowledge etc. He definitely cares about building the fan base. Fox does care about his players and what they think/feel. The steps he has taken to ensure their mental health last year was above and beyond most coaches( heck he personally gave haircuts when asked to do so by 2 players). He has the players giving back to the community and is teaching them to be selfless (food kitchens, community projects involvement etc). He has brought in a psychologist for the team to assess each players potential via leadership, goal setting, team building etc. (not unusual steps but steps taken nonetheless). His priority is the program and He and staff are completely invested (btw his and staff are in the bottom 1/3 of pay scale of conf). We can disagree on Fox's approach - but until one meets him, watches practices, hear's what his players say about him, attends games vs remotely lobbing criticism, its simply not being objective and fully informed. Again, I am not sure Coach Fox and his staff are the answer to raise the program to the top half of the conference, as they have to recruit better. The bar should be high and if the staff does not show marked improvement, then the hot seat should be full steam. Can't emphasize how tough it is for our bball program to win consistently and just looking at the historical record over the past 60 years underscores that - namely just one conf. title. We agree on rooting for the players - I highly respect them. I have some interaction with them outside of bball as well and thus understand their demanding schedules, respect for the staff and the hurdles they face. Pulling for all of their experiences at Cal to be positive!

concernedparent said:

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calumnus said:

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4thGenCal said:

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calumnus said:

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KoreAmBear said:

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puget sound cal fan said:

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Well, if Fox was trying to run-Bradley-off, he succeeded, right?

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I don't think he was trying to run off Bradley, our best player. I think Fox just wanted things done his way, and he sent a message to him by sitting him in the second half at UCLA and calling him a 'good' player during the post-game presser. Fox probably thought Bradley needed it. Bradley likely felt disrespected.

Let's see if the better chemistry narrative plays out this season.

---

Yeah, that was bad.

He also benched Bradley and Kelly for the start of the Stanford game in the PAC-12 Tournament.

He disrespected the players in his first speech to the team and three starters immediately transferred.

He is a fairly young coach but he is old school. As I've said, I think that is a really bad fit for most kids of this generation, especially elite African American players, but particularly at a place like Cal.

However, he is finding a niche with foreign and now especially African immigrant players, which he started doing at Georgia and who are now the majority of his recruits at Cal.

---

Enjoy your comments and data research CalAlumnus - however to be objective and not consider the verdict closed, 1) the 3 players who transferred had both feet out the door - and regardless of who the new coach was, were gone (per one parent of her son, and the other two, per the players to a person). I don't know if Fox will raise the program to the top half of the conference by next season, but He has the full backing of the AD, has the respect of the roster (heard that from starters and the back ups) each player says the coach/staff has their trust and that they are confident in the preparation of the team via practices and opponent game planning. Coaching is not a "democracy" the Coach is in charge and knowledge, development, preparation and confidence are key factors in a team growth. Elite black players buy into the trust and belief in the coach/staff's ability to develop the players and chemistry, along with consistently treating each player the same(ie Cronin at ucla, Bobby Hurley asu, Smith at wsu who are not warm and fuzzy coaches). Thus far Coach Fox has the respect of the team. Can He/staff recruit better, can they develop the 3 promising freshmen, can they get the team to play better defense, along with getting more out of Kuany, Jalen, Joel, Jared? We don't know. Yes on finding his niche but He also has recruited Hyder, Roberson, Bowers. Fox is dogmatic and frankly does not care about the outside "keyboard warriors"/writers etc that have not seen his team. I am remaining neutral till the end of this season, before putting the heat on. Most concerned with lack of interior defense, limited # of 3 point shooters, and while athleticism is improving, still bottom half of conference.

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As far as players "having a foot out the door" that sounds like a cop-out. They entered the portal a couple days after Fox was introduced. They could have entered the portal before Fox was hired. Fox might have convinced them to stay. Fox did the opposite. I only have connections to the Sueings, but Fox's speech about getting the players to work "harder" on the court and in the classroom, implying they were lazy or dumb something, was insulting to a guy who lead the team in scoring and rebounding AND was All PAC-12 Academic in two years of pre-med classes at Cal. These were incredibly hard working and highly self motivated young men. What they needed to hear was how he would make them better, not how he was going to be a hardass and make them work harder.

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100%. Unless they were flunking out of class, or found Berkeley to be so intolerable that they had to leave (despite already spending 2 years there), that is on Fox. These were starters who would get all the minutes and shots they'd want. Maybe they wanted to win? But then that's also on Fox to convince them. A core of Bradley-Sueing-Vanover-McNeill with Antecevich, Kelly, Brown can make it to March with the right coaching.

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"100% on Fox for the transfers"? Wow, McNeil was not a loss and wanted to play near his hometown and Mom (has not elevated his game btw), Vanover and Mom were very close with Wyking and he was not staying regardless of the new coach and was going home, w/o the coach he signed up for. Again not much of a loss - great young man, and very good outside shot, but challenged defensively and physically - huge problem to gain weight despite the extra emphasis/food intake (3 year project at best). Sueing a definite loss, but he was tired of losing and wanted to play for a top contending program. He felt by leaving, his next level playing chances would increase. I liked his game and his loss was definitely felt. Flip side with Brown and Thorpe, who both stayed after meeting with Fox. Team GPA btw is very good and academics and class attendance by the players is closely monitored.

89Bear said:

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Not saying this is true of any of the players, but if one of your students is lazy and has a bad attitude don't they deserve the truth???

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If someone isn't doing the work I speak to them privately about how completing the homework assignments will improve their learning and their grade. I never call them lazy, especially in class or in public.