Lots of Monty deep sixing Joe P because of NikeGate/Arizona recruiting.

Does anyoe know why JK/Monty didn't like AAR? Feels like he had STRONG backing from a bunch of our recent grads.

Yeah, I find it surprising that there is no reporting about AAR at all. No re-upping with Kennesaw. No reports of him interviewing elsewhere. Kind of odd for such a hot commodity.

I will suddenly believe that JK is playing three dimensional chess if the delay isn't due to the NIT/Birth of Daughter but because he was waiting for an off day so that Brown could be at the presser ;-)

socaltownie said:

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Lots of Monty deep sixing Joe P because of NikeGate/Arizona recruiting.

Does anyoe know why JK/Monty didn't like AAR? Feels like he had STRONG backing from a bunch of our recent grads.

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Mike Montgomery just "had a feeling" about Mark Madsen. This was a biased hire - Cal of all places should be all over DEI and steering away from even the perception of conflict of interest.

We are out potentially millions in NIL because of this dinosaur that couldn't get us to where Braun took us.

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

Pittstop said:

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Since when do programs (ANY program) report on why candidates who WEREN'T hired didn't get the job? Posters and writers "speculate", but they don't know either. They tell us what they THINK, or "feel", or "believe". And that's about it.

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Since never. But we can still be curious! I know I am.

Generally, there is much confidentiality around personnel situations. With hiring of college coaches, the emphasis of the athletic department is generally on playing up the person who was hired, not on justifying why that person rose above others. Sports fans generally take a very strong interest in hiring of coaches, but still generally aren't privy to what actually drove a decision and are left with speculation and rumors. It seems that this time around at Cal the hiring process is attracting especially intense scrutiny since the last hire was so bafflingly bad. We should keep in mind that Cal hasn't yet hired a coach.

Steve Kerr is still coaching his team

ManBearLion123 said:

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tbh, there are A LOT of question marks around AAR.

Kennesaw's season was a great story but that was his first winning season as a HC (in a very bad conference).

He also has minimal West Coast ties and, though he seems charismatic from what I've seen, he feels more like a slow, long term team builder than a guy who can turn things around in a couple seasons through elite recruiting.

If his last name wasn't Abdur-Rahim, he probably wouldn't even be considered.

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Agree.
Perhaps he saw the job as one he didn't need to take at this point in his career. Being from the southeast, lack of familiarity with west coast hoops, .. maybe he's looking for an ACC or SEC job in a year or two.
Nobody knows but it will be interesting to follow his trajectory.

rfmason44 said:

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Think it's pretty obvious- JP and AAR had significant donor support and Knowlton wanted to show he was the boss.

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I saw "big donor support" connected to JP, but I only saw "Shareef and Jaylen endorse" attached to AAR. Did AAR have a group of donors backing him?

Big C said:

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Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

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That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

jump on the #MadDogTrain one way ticket from HoopsHell

My impression was that AAR didn't want to go to Cal and preferred to stay in the SouthEast.

KoreAmBear said:

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BC Calfan said:

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And there it is...

South Florida is expected to hire Kennesaw State's Amir Abdur-Rahim as its next head coach, sources told ESPN. Led one of the biggest rebuilds in college basketball, going from winning one game in 2019-20 to winning the ASUN regular-season and tournament titles this season.

— Jeff Borzello (@jeffborzello) March 29, 2023

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Looks like we could have had him if we wanted. I guess he "didn't interview well" over Teams. Knowlton is such an azz.

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I think we will regret Knowlton rejecting Gates and now Abdur-Rahim.

Madsen is a huge upgrade from Fox, I like him, but my gut says Knowlton found his Wilcox for basketball. Hope I am wrong and he kills it.

mbBear said:

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Big C said:

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Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

uh, Ben Braun comes to mind (unless you think Eastern Michigan to be a big D-1 school).

But wrt to AAR, if I'm him, I strongly consider the lack of a qualified AD, and with my SE-only connections, consider other opportunities.

Big Dog said:

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mbBear said:

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Big C said:

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Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

uh, Ben Braun comes to mind (unless you think Eastern Michigan to be a big D-1 school).

But wrt to AAR, if I'm him, I strongly consider the lack of a qualified AD, and with my SE-only connections, consider other opportunities.

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And Campanelli came from James Madison. Kuchen came from Notre Dame.

You couldn't come up with more different candidates. JP, AAR, MM, RB, SJ. What does that say about the market place or our process or maybe nothing.

Big Dog said:

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mbBear said:

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Big C said:

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Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

uh, Ben Braun comes to mind (unless you think Eastern Michigan to be a big D-1 school).

But wrt to AAR, if I'm him, I strongly consider the lack of a qualified AD, and with my SE-only connections, consider other opportunities.

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Yeah, but BB was coming off a fresh Duke victory on the way to the Sweet 16. He had Coach K and Bob Huggins thinking he was some kind of offensive mastermind.

Civil Bear said:

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Big Dog said:

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mbBear said:

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Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

uh, Ben Braun comes to mind (unless you think Eastern Michigan to be a big D-1 school).

But wrt to AAR, if I'm him, I strongly consider the lack of a qualified AD, and with my SE-only connections, consider other opportunities.

---

Yeah, but BB was coming off a fresh Duke victory on the way to the Sweet 16. He had Coach K and Bob Huggins thinking he was some kind of offensive mastermind.

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Braun inherited a team with talent. What we needed was someone who coach them up and he seemed to fit the bill. In retrospect, he was a good fit at the time. Now we need someone who can hit the ground and recruit immediately. We have 2-3 legitimate Pac-12 players. that's it. We have hit an unprecedented low, with a program on life support. We need a coach who can do it all: recruit talent, fundraise, and coach talent.

Big C said:

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mbBear said:

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Big C said:

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Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

mbBear said:

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Big C said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

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Pete Carroll strongly agrees.

mbBear said:

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Big C said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

---

The people that recommended Madsen had way too much input and those that recommended someone else got dissed. It's a story as old as time.

Civil Bear said:

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mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

---

The people that recommended Madsen had way too much input and those that recommended someone else got dissed. It's a story as old as time.

---

All that we can hope for is the wrong people being right then...or right for the wrong reasons perhaps?

mbBear said:

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Civil Bear said:

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mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

---

The people that recommended Madsen had way too much input and those that recommended someone else got dissed. It's a story as old as time.

---

All that we can hope for is the wrong people being right then...or right for the wrong reasons perhaps?

---

Sure, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Although I'm not sure Monty would be considered as a wrong person. He is probably one of the most qualified to know what kind of person will be needed to succeed at Cal.

Civil Bear said:

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mbBear said:

---

Civil Bear said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

mbBear said:

---

Big C said:

---

Yes, why MM over AAR (or even Stan Johnson, for that matter)? The three of those guys all had fairly similar resumes, IMO.

Obviously, Knowlton will never tell...

---

That's really ignoring Madsen's years in the league (I call that graduate school) and then his years as an assistant in the league.
The other guys may have had more years on the recruiting trail, but Madsen has been around a lot more great minds of basketball X and O's....

Let's get real here: AAR was considered as a courtesy to his brother and Jaylen Brown, maybe a couple of others. In what other universe is Cal considering a coach from a small D-1 school and conference east of the Mississippi?
I'm not starting (or extending) the argument that he would have worked out great, that he has a great ceiling etc...but he had zero ties to the West Coast recruiting scene.....

---

Believe me, I have leaped onto the Mad Dog Train today! Let's go!!!


(still fair to discuss Knowlton and his hiring process... two separate issues)

---

From first reports, I thought Knowlton was handling JP poorly, without respect, and basically blew the opportunity. IF in fact someone got in his ear about "ethical" concerns regarding JP, then it makes a little more sense that he never felt comfortable making an offer.
Not to say that I agree with Knowlton's decision at all...and the process could still be flawed if a couple of people had way too much input...and honestly, I don't need a patron saint as a head coach. But you are right, let's go!!!! (we have a long ways to go.....)

---

The people that recommended Madsen had way too much input and those that recommended someone else got dissed. It's a story as old as time.

---

All that we can hope for is the wrong people being right then...or right for the wrong reasons perhaps?

---

Sure, even a broken clock is right twice a day. Although I'm not sure Monty would be considered as a wrong person. He is probably one of the most qualified to know what kind of person will be needed to succeed at Cal.

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So, he isn't one of the ones who had too much input???