Finnish Oski said:

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People should probably forget the idea of Charmin Smith being considered for the Cal head coaching job or any other for that matter. If you've ever heard her "speak" before a group, you'll know why. I was her neighbor for a few years and she was painfully shy. Charmin's really good working with individuals but a lot of the duties a head coach has to handle would be very difficult for her.

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"If you've ever heard her 'speak' before a group, you'll know why."

Wow--are we talking about the same person? I've heard Charmin give dozens of pre-game talks, and have always been impressed by her poise, knowledge and wit. Maybe it depends on the setting.

... said:

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... Does JK use a search firm and then make a decision like Fox (which may work), or the process of asking around and picking based on word of mouth and Cal fit (like with Johnson). If it is the later, I see in no particular order:

1) Smith (former Cal)
2) Felton
3) Paye
4) Gross
5) Rueck
6- Perry
7) Langley (success at an academic school like Rice, and I believe she knows Knowlton)
8) Fortier
9) Cambell (male issue)

...
Here are more the search firm types:

Norman
Cheek
Ivey (great recruiter supposedly)
Johnston (male issue)
Drake coach
FSU coach
Kelly Bond White
Hatchell (a total Mark Fox type hire)
Smith (Elon coach (bad last season after two surprising NCAA appearances)) ...

---

When I compiled my list, I played two roles: the search committee (of one) and the candidate. It was easy being the search committee - thumbs up or thumbs down for every head coach. It was much harder being the candidate, since I had to figure out whether she could possibly say yes to Cal. The fact that it was June made it a lot harder to get to yes. If she said no, I left her off the list because as I said before, I didn't want to give any false hopes.

Here's my rationale for each of the head coaches on your list:

Gross (UC Davis): Probably not but maybe, so I put her on the list.

Rueck (Oregon State): Situation at his alma mater in terms of on-court performance and fan support is way too good to even think about re-starting at Cal.

Langley (Rice): Rice is just starting to get good with some very good potential for next season, so I can't see her short-circuiting the process. She might start to think about moving up at the end of next season after Erica Ogwumike graduates. But how does she know Knowlton??? That might tip her to yes.

Fortier (Gonzaga): I already explained why I couldn't get her to yes.

Johnston (South Dakota State): He is a prime example of what I referred to as institutional or geographical loyalty. After all the times he has said no to other and geographically closer teams, why would a call from Cal in the middle of June suddenly make him say yes? I can't see it.

Baranczyk (Drake): I already explained my tortured reasoning to put her on the list (barely).

FSU coach (?): Do you mean Jamie White of Fresno State? My search committee said no (early success was with inherited players, give her credit for some later success but not good enough considering it's in the weakening Mountain West). If you mean Sue Semrau at Florida State, why would she step down to Cal?

Hatchell (retired from NC): I said Knowlton would rather not explain why he took someone who left her previous job under a cloud, so my search committee said no.

Smith (Elon): I said Knowlton also wouldn't want a coach coming off a bad season, so the search committee said no. Plus if you watch the games, the CAA just isn't as strong as it used to be so I think she's gotten too much credit at least up until now.

I listed some assistants on my list only because I thought people would ask why I didn't list any, not because I actually wanted to talk about any of them. To me, assistants are Plan B and very often a sucker's bet (a fan can end up thinking she's a good head coaching prospect based on one nice interview, a fawning article, an appealing sideline demeanor and/or the self-serving online bio).

But yes, I recognize your listed assistants beyond Charmin and Kai. The big issue it's June. The time to jump off a staff is earlier, not in the middle of recruiting season (yes we have 3 more quiet weeks but still ...) So it becomes an even bigger crapshoot to figure who would make a good head coach AND how personally committed she may feel to her head coach once she signs on for the year. I will acknowledge that Shannon Perry of UCLA superficially seems very appealing and has no obvious pre-destination, but others have either a likelier destination than Cal or are in the pure guesswork category. I will admit I was shocked that Bond-White interviewed with Witchita State a couple of years back since I assumed she was Gary Blair's heir apparent, but I still think she's the likeliest heir.

WayneBear said:

---

... said:

---

... Does JK use a search firm and then make a decision like Fox (which may work), or the process of asking around and picking based on word of mouth and Cal fit (like with Johnson). If it is the later, I see in no particular order:

1) Smith (former Cal)
2) Felton
3) Paye
4) Gross
5) Rueck
6- Perry
7) Langley (success at an academic school like Rice, and I believe she knows Knowlton)
8) Fortier
9) Cambell (male issue)

...
Here are more the search firm types:

Norman
Cheek
Ivey (great recruiter supposedly)
Johnston (male issue)
Drake coach
FSU coach
Kelly Bond White
Hatchell (a total Mark Fox type hire)
Smith (Elon coach (bad last season after two surprising NCAA appearances)) ...

---

When I compiled my list, I played two roles: the search committee (of one) and the candidate. It was easy being the search committee - thumbs up or thumbs down for every head coach. It was much harder being the candidate, since I had to figure out whether she could possibly say yes to Cal. The fact that it was June made it a lot harder to get to yes. If she said no, I left her off the list because as I said before, I didn't want to give any false hopes.

Here's my rationale for each of the head coaches on your list:

Gross (UC Davis): Probably not but maybe, so I put her on the list.

Rueck (Oregon State): Situation at his alma mater in terms of on-court performance and fan support is way too good to even think about re-starting at Cal.

Langley (Rice): Rice is just starting to get good with some very good potential for next season, so I can't see her short-circuiting the process. She might start to think about moving up at the end of next season after Erica Ogwumike graduates. But how does she know Knowlton??? That might tip her to yes.

Fortier (Gonzaga): I already explained why I couldn't get her to yes.

Johnston (South Dakota State): He is a prime example of what I referred to as institutional or geographical loyalty. After all the times he has said no to other and geographically closer teams, why would a call from Cal in the middle of June suddenly make him say yes? I can't see it.

Baranczyk (Drake): I already explained my tortured reasoning to put her on the list (barely).

FSU coach (?): Do you mean Jamie White of Fresno State? My search committee said no (early success was with inherited players, give her credit for some later success but not good enough considering it's in the weakening Mountain West). If you mean Sue Semrau at Florida State, why would she step down to Cal?

Hatchell (retired from NC): I said Knowlton would rather not explain why he took someone who left her previous job under a cloud, so my search committee said no.

Smith (Elon): I said Knowlton also wouldn't want a coach coming off a bad season, so the search committee said no. Plus if you watch the games, the CAA just isn't as strong as it used to be so I think she's gotten too much credit at least up until now.

I listed some assistants on my list only because I thought people would ask why I didn't list any, not because I actually wanted to talk about any of them. To me, assistants are Plan B and very often a sucker's bet (a fan can end up thinking she's a good head coaching prospect based on one nice interview, a fawning article, an appealing sideline demeanor and/or the self-serving online bio).

But yes, I recognize your listed assistants beyond Charmin and Kai. The big issue it's June. The time to jump off a staff is earlier, not in the middle of recruiting season (yes we have 3 more quiet weeks but still ...) So it becomes an even bigger crapshoot to figure who would make a good head coach AND how personally committed she may feel to her head coach once she signs on for the year. I will acknowledge that Shannon Perry of UCLA superficially seems very appealing and has no obvious pre-destination, but others have either a likelier destination than Cal or are in the pure guesswork category. I will admit I was shocked that Bond-White interviewed with Witchita State a couple of years back since I assumed she was Gary Blair's heir apparent, but I still think she's the likeliest heir.

---

This is freaking great stuff. It was rather apparent last round that the lead candidate was Gottlieb, but I don't see one now. Your are dead right about the timing problem. Someone who is out of a job (like Fox) might be more optimal, if they don't have baggage.

Interesting post about Knowlton's mindset -- and it makes sense.

So the default P5 hire in women's basketball is either a black female assistant from a successful program or a successful mid-major coach who comes relatively cheaply (gender/ethnicity less important).

Next would be a female P5 assistant, then a male P5 assistant. Hiring a retread usually doesn't happen.

A lot of coaches would be thrilled to get a P5 job, even if it's likely they'll get fired after three years (which is certainly possible here, given the state of the roster), because that improves their resume considerably.

But there are some coaches who want their first and maybe only shot at a P5 job to be one in which they can see a road to success, and I'm not sure that group would be interested in Cal.

But maybe there's more potential than I see (and I'm not alone), and the right coach could get this group to the middle of the Pac-12 and on the fringes of the NCAA tournament.

The last consideration is timing. The recruiting season ends July 24, I believe, so if no one is in place by July 14 or so, then there's no real rush at all. But to get someone before July 14 would be pushing the timeline pretty hard.

In short, interesting times for Knowlton for what is usually considered the third or fourth most important program at a P5 school.

ClayK said:

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Interesting post about Knowlton's mindset -- and it makes sense.

So the default P5 hire in women's basketball is either a black female assistant from a successful program or a successful mid-major coach who comes relatively cheaply (gender/ethnicity less important).

Next would be a female P5 assistant, then a male P5 assistant. Hiring a retread usually doesn't happen.

A lot of coaches would be thrilled to get a P5 job, even if it's likely they'll get fired after three years (which is certainly possible here, given the state of the roster), because that improves their resume considerably.

But there are some coaches who want their first and maybe only shot at a P5 job to be one in which they can see a road to success, and I'm not sure that group would be interested in Cal.

But maybe there's more potential than I see (and I'm not alone), and the right coach could get this group to the middle of the Pac-12 and on the fringes of the NCAA tournament.

The last consideration is timing. The recruiting season ends July 24, I believe, so if no one is in place by July 14 or so, then there's no real rush at all. But to get someone before July 14 would be pushing the timeline pretty hard.

In short, interesting times for Knowlton for what is usually considered the third or fourth most important program at a P5 school.

---

I was going to ask about the timing on naming a new coach, but I think you've answered my question. If we don't get someone right away to do some last-minute recruiting, then we shouldn't rush. OTOH, would be great to have somebody on board by the start of the school year. I'd be curious to know if there are any decent uncommitted players left out there to cherry pick at the last minute.

ClayK said:

---

Interesting post about Knowlton's mindset -- and it makes sense.

---

+1

ClayK said:

---

So the default P5 hire in women's basketball is either a black female assistant from a successful program ...

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Does April Phillips qualify?

ClayK said:

---

In short, interesting times for Knowlton for what is usually considered the third or fourth most important program at a P5 school.

---

Too "interesting" for me.

Quote:

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I'd be curious to know if there are any decent uncommitted players left out there to cherry pick at the last minute.

---

Ask Mark Fox, he and his staff found four.

ClayK said:

---

I don't know what Knowlton's goal is, so it's hard to say ... and I also don't know the budget.

If his goal is to be as competitive as possible as soon as possible, then he needs to spend a lot of money, for both the head coach and assistants and expenses. If he's willing to offer $500,000 for the head coach plus good salaries for assistants, he can probably lure a Lisa Fortier or successful mid-major. I can't see him getting an established Power 5 coach for that much, though, given the sorry state of the program. But to be immediately competitive, he has to hire someone who has sent a lot of players to the WNBA, who has won a lot of games, and who has a dynamic system, and I don't know if he can find that person.

If his goal is to be willing to sacrifice the present and lay the foundation for long-term success, then he can look deeper into successful assistants and less-obvious mid-major coaches, but one issue is that bringing a Karl Smesko, say, in from the East Coast would mean it would take time to build up West Coast connections. Or he can go out of the box for a very, very successful high school/AAU coach and try to build it that way.

There are also a couple other issues:

1) How important will it be to hire a black female as head coach? This may or may not play into the decision -- again, we can't know from the outside.

2) How much does Knowlton grasp about the present situation? Does he realize that Cal is probably the 11th or 12th best team in the Pac-12 right now, and could be 12th if more players transfer? If he thinks they're better than they are, he might feel he can hire someone to turn things around very soon, but if he agrees with me and a lot of others that there's not much in the cupboard, he might be more willing to hire a young coach, or go out of the box.

All that said, it's hard for me to think of someone who would be available and who's a sure thing. With any assistant or mid-major, you just don't know how they'll adjust to the new level. You could say that Kelly Graves, say, could come in and win, but there aren't many elite coaches and none of them are likely to come to Cal.

Likely path: They hire someone who gets the program pointed in the right direction but loses a lot of games, and then fire them and hire someone else three years down the road, as at that point, it's a much better job.

---

that last paragraph sounds like my initial take on the Fox hire. But I'm not sure JK appreciates the direction of the women's program, where the men's program being a complete rebuild was apparent. One thing is I expect is JK has little room budget wise since he is going to be paying some coin for offensive football coachers after this upcoming season, one way or the other (raises, severance and/or higher new coach salaries), having postponed decisions in that regard this year.

Edit: met Fox today and we may be prleasanlty surprised. Intellectual guy who I can see making a good impression on an AD, alums and the right players. BTW, and a bit O/T, but very high on the German kid.

The talent pool in women's basketball is much shallower than for men, and in addition, teams have 15 scholarships, not 13.

The hard truth: There are more D-1 women's basketball scholarships than there are D-1 women's basketball players.

Y'all may want to visit the Insider board.

Under the present circumstances, Cal might just be better off going with a one-year interim coach from within their present staff. It would give them a year to set up their hire while maintaining some sort of continuity with the present players. The only shortcoming would be that they might lose a year in recruiting, but that probably would happen with a short term hire anyway. The cupboard is really bare under the present circumstances.

Does anyone know why the recruiting has not been great the past three years?
This past season was a disappointment as far as wins. It was so good to watch
Kristen Anigwe score and rebound this last seasom. She brought excitement to
the games. Lindsay said this team reminded her of the Final Four team...
What Happened!! I have felt it was time for a coaching change. I really like the players,
and feel badly for them when they lose badly. I would like to see Cal Women Basketball
go Big, and hire someone terrific. The games at Haas are so much fun....GO BEARS...

Ashfield63 said:

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Does anyone know why the recruiting has not been great the past three years?
This past season was a disappointment as far as wins. It was so good to watch
Kristen Anigwe score and rebound this last seasom. She brought excitement to
the games. Lindsay said this team reminded her of the Final Four team...
What Happened!! I have felt it was time for a coaching change. I really like the players,
and feel badly for them when they lose badly. I would like to see Cal Women Basketball
go Big, and hire someone terrific. The games at Haas are so much fun....GO BEARS...

---

Because there are much better programs on the west coast now. We were passed up around 3-4 years ago, everyone's caught on.

Why?

Thanks to SFCALBear72, we now have some insight into Knowlton's search. He and BearGreg indicated that Knowlton is focused on a Power 5 head coach or associate head coach. And as I said in another thread, that strongly suggests that the people assisting in the search did NOT do a wide-ranging search (which might have uncovered the names on my list). They likely just asked around and immediately zoomed in on one Power 5 associate and said OK, let's focus on her and a few others in the same category, and gave those names to Knowlton.

Let's immediately dispense with the likelihood of a Power 5 head coach. Yes, I like former Cal assistant and current Wake Forest coach Jennifer Hoover, and she might actually do a good job, but you can't hire someone who just finished last in the ACC. And as things stand now and as things fall apart (with the departure of Mackenzie Forbes), the chances of TCU's Raegan Pebley climbing aboard the sinking ship doesn't make sense (it might have barely made sense a week ago but not now). So unless some Power 5 head coach secretly loves the Bay Area so much that she's willing to end her career with a swoon at Cal, a lateral hire doesn't seem possible.

So which Power 5 associate might be willing to come to the Bay Area and tackle the Cal rebuild? One possibility leaps to mind - it would be just like Cal to ask VanDerveer for advice and one name that she would mention would be former Stanford player and current Texas associate Jamie Carey. Since it's just guesswork as far as how an associate would do as a head coach, she's as good a possibility as any and certainly has the right background of academics, character and especially perserverance. Another thing - there's always been some lingering doubt about Texas head coach Karen Aston and they've had some players leave, so Carey wouldn't exactly be leaving a perfect situation. As long as Knowlton assures her that Cal will be patient, a rebuild may not sound much worse than a shaky situation at Texas.

If the people helping Knowlton then thought if Carey says no, perhaps the underlying idea of a Power 5 associate may still be the way to go. It's a money-saver as far as the initial contract and it's also assuring that she has intimately experienced the challenge of preparing for a Power 5 schedule. And there's absolutely no reason to include males - it's all guesswork anyway and there are more than enough good-sounding female associates to fit the bill.

I've already listed Power 5 associates Melanie Balcomb, Niele Ivey, and Stephanie Norman. Wifeisafurd also mentioned Stanford's Kate Paye and Texas A&M's Kelly Bond-White. All five are longshots and probably not worth contemplating. But there are well over a dozen remaining associates who we could realistically take a shot at and while there are too many to name, a couple of the more obvious ones with Pac-12 connections are Arizona State's Jackie Moore and Florida's Kelly Rae Finley (5 previous years as a Pac-12 assistant most recently at Arizona in 2016-17, and 3 years at Harvard as well).

bearchamp said:

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Why?

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Because the rest of the conference got sick and tired of seeing the furds atop The standings year after year, and the Oregon schools decided to do something about it. Sadly Cal couldn't stay on top because 5 star white girls didn't want to play for LG.

Dont think many 5* 'white girls' even for the last two before Lindsay. Who was the last 5* white player to play at Cal, especially a USA player!

OBear073akaSMFan said:

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Dont think many 5* 'white girls' even for the last two before Lindsay. Who was the last 5* white player to play at Cal, especially a USA player!

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Might have to go back to Milica Vukadinovic, who came from (then) Yugoslavia.

Ccajon2 said:

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bearchamp said:

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Why?

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Because the rest of the conference got sick and tired of seeing the furds atop The standings year after year, and the Oregon schools decided to do something about it. Sadly Cal couldn't stay on top because 5 star white girls didn't want to play for LG.

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What? Please explain.

WayneBear said:

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Thanks to SFCALBear72, we now have some insight into Knowlton's search. He and BearGreg indicated that Knowlton is focused on a Power 5 head coach or associate head coach. And as I said in another thread, that strongly suggests that the people assisting in the search did NOT do a wide-ranging search (which might have uncovered the names on my list). They likely just asked around and immediately zoomed in on one Power 5 associate and said OK, let's focus on her and a few others in the same category, and gave those names to Knowlton.

Let's immediately dispense with the likelihood of a Power 5 head coach. Yes, I like former Cal assistant and current Wake Forest coach Jennifer Hoover, and she might actually do a good job, but you can't hire someone who just finished last in the ACC. And as things stand now and as things fall apart (with the departure of Mackenzie Forbes), the chances of TCU's Raegan Pebley climbing aboard the sinking ship doesn't make sense (it might have barely made sense a week ago but not now). So unless some Power 5 head coach secretly loves the Bay Area so much that she's willing to end her career with a swoon at Cal, a lateral hire doesn't seem possible.

So which Power 5 associate might be willing to come to the Bay Area and tackle the Cal rebuild? One possibility leaps to mind - it would be just like Cal to ask VanDerveer for advice and one name that she would mention would be former Stanford player and current Texas associate Jamie Carey. Since it's just guesswork as far as how an associate would do as a head coach, she's as good a possibility as any and certainly has the right background of academics, character and especially perserverance. Another thing - there's always been some lingering doubt about Texas head coach Karen Aston and they've had some players leave, so Carey wouldn't exactly be leaving a perfect situation. As long as Knowlton assures her that Cal will be patient, a rebuild may not sound much worse than a shaky situation at Texas.

If the people helping Knowlton then thought if Carey says no, perhaps the underlying idea of a Power 5 associate may still be the way to go. It's a money-saver as far as the initial contract and it's also assuring that she has intimately experienced the challenge of preparing for a Power 5 schedule. And there's absolutely no reason to include males - it's all guesswork anyway and there are more than enough good-sounding female associates to fit the bill.

I've already listed Power 5 associates Melanie Balcomb, Niele Ivey, and Stephanie Norman. Wifeisafurd also mentioned Stanford's Kate Paye and Texas A&M's Kelly Bond-White. All five are longshots and probably not worth contemplating. But there are well over a dozen remaining associates who we could realistically take a shot at and while there are too many to name, a couple of the more obvious ones with Pac-12 connections are Arizona State's Jackie Moore and Florida's Kelly Rae Finley (5 previous years as a Pac-12 assistant most recently at Arizona in 2016-17, and 3 years at Harvard as well).

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I don't buy the "sinking ship" excuse. Its basketball...much easier to turn around a program than say, football. And you are recruiting and playing in the best conference in the country...so you suck for a year, maybe even two.
If they don't like the support/resources that the team gets, especially relative to their present situation, then that's different.

Of course, basketball success is just a couple players away, but at the same time, basketball is much more a players' game than a coaches' game. (If I have five better players than you, it's pretty hard to scheme your way to victory ...)

And look at the Cal roster right now ... there are three complementary Pac-12 starters in CJ West, Jaelyn Brown and Alayshia Styles, two of whom will be seniors. There's the oft-injured Mi'Cole Cayton, who conceivably could be a decent player in the toughest conference in the country.

So if I'm one of those game-changing young players, why would I choose Cal? Most elite players want to play with other elite players and win lots of games (just like every level, down to pickup -- do you like to play on a team that will hold the court all day or be the best player on a team that never wins?). Maybe some kind of package deal could bring a pair of stars to Cal, but barring that unlikely occurrence, the process is going to be a slow one, especially since two of the team's best players have only one more year left.

Of course, you can get lucky and someone develops late, or an elite player loves Berkeley, but realistically, this is not a good job, and will be a difficult rebuilding project, again, especially considering you're in the Pac-12.

Fyght4Cal said:

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I generally agree that it's better to hire a head coach with a solid record. However, Charmin has been such an integral part of building this team, it seems that she might at least get some consideration.

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Welcome home, Head Coach Charmin Smith!

Future so bright, I gotta wear shades.

She may be the next Pete Newell, but, this hire presents as a bunt single. ( and only because thge infielders were all playing deep)

Maybe it's a Texas Leaguer and the runs score.

ClayK said:

---

Of course, basketball success is just a couple players away, but at the same time, basketball is much more a players' game than a coaches' game. (If I have five better players than you, it's pretty hard to scheme your way to victory ...)

And look at the Cal roster right now ... there are three complementary Pac-12 starters in CJ West, Jaelyn Brown and Alayshia Styles, two of whom will be seniors. There's the oft-injured Mi'Cole Cayton, who conceivably could be a decent player in the toughest conference in the country.

So if I'm one of those game-changing young players, why would I choose Cal? Most elite players want to play with other elite players and win lots of games (just like every level, down to pickup -- do you like to play on a team that will hold the court all day or be the best player on a team that never wins?). Maybe some kind of package deal could bring a pair of stars to Cal, but barring that unlikely occurrence, the process is going to be a slow one, especially since two of the team's best players have only one more year left.

Of course, you can get lucky and someone develops late, or an elite player loves Berkeley, but realistically, this is not a good job, and will be a difficult rebuilding project, again, especially considering you're in the Pac-12.

---

Cal has gotten elite players in recent years (probably not enough of them, give you that). I refuse to believe that the University does't sell itself more frequently in the women's game, more so than on the men's side.
But, the academics aside, they now have a coach that can talk being involved with draft picks and NCAA tournament appearances on a pretty consistent basis over the last number of years. A Final Four banner hangs at Cal, and is much fresher than the men's version.
No question they could be a very strong program nationally, and maybe just 4th or 5th best in the Pac-12. A huge hurdle to over-come, I can't deny that.
Come on-you don't believe that its always the 5 best in college hoop? Sure UConn supports your argument, but does Kentucky? Villanova has had some talent, but their success is not based on having the 5 best, and is totally about scheme and culture. If you want to argue that its a women's hoop thing, that scheme is trumped by talent always, okay, I can't argue that. But on the men's side, we see scheme oriented teams succeed year in and year out at a high level.

Agreed ... I overstated the talent edge. In general, though, basketball is a players' game, as opposed to football, say, where coaching can cover up a lot of talent deficits.

But as I've noted in two other posts, Cal not only has a talent deficit, it has an incredibly huge talent deficit in the toughest conference in the country. And if the Final Four banner and NCAA tournament trips (don't look at the 30-42 Pac-12 record in the last four years) didn't get any recruits in the recent past -- which they didn't -- it's hard to see how they will in the future, given the likelihood that a 10th place finish this season would be a significant overachievement.

I like Charmin and she knows the game, and I hope she can turn the ship around. But it's a monumental task right now, and I don't know if there's anyone who can get it done.

Then again, I've been wrong (many) times before, and stranger things have happened ...

ClayK said:

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Agreed ... I overstated the talent edge. In general, though, basketball is a players' game, as opposed to football, say, where coaching can cover up a lot of talent deficits.

But as I've noted in two other posts, Cal not only has a talent deficit, it has an incredibly huge talent deficit in the toughest conference in the country. And if the Final Four banner and NCAA tournament trips (don't look at the 30-42 Pac-12 record in the last four years) didn't get any recruits in the recent past -- which they didn't -- it's hard to see how they will in the future, given the likelihood that a 10th place finish this season would be a significant overachievement.

I like Charmin and she knows the game, and I hope she can turn the ship around. But it's a monumental task right now, and I don't know if there's anyone who can get it done.

Then again, I've been wrong (many) times before, and stranger things have happened ...

---

Mike Williams gave LG a salary increase and a three year extension after the 4-14 season so it would help her recruit. Unfortunately that didn't help much.

Last year the pac-12 coaches picked us 4th and we were lucky to finish tied for 6th. The coaches that knew us the best knew we had good talent last year. Now we are left with bottom 3 talent so I agree that 10th will be an over achievement. If Charmin pulls that off I hope she gets credit for doing a good job. I'm sure some will say look what happens when LG leaves.

Finnish Oski said:

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People should probably forget the idea of Charmin Smith being considered for the Cal head coaching job or any other for that matter. If you've ever heard her "speak" before a group, you'll know why. I was her neighbor for a few years and she was painfully shy. Charmin's really good working with individuals but a lot of the duties a head coach has to handle would be very difficult for her.

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Ouch???

ClayK said:

---

Agreed ... I overstated the talent edge. In general, though, basketball is a players' game, as opposed to football, say, where coaching can cover up a lot of talent deficits.

But as I've noted in two other posts, Cal not only has a talent deficit, it has an incredibly huge talent deficit in the toughest conference in the country. And if the Final Four banner and NCAA tournament trips (don't look at the 30-42 Pac-12 record in the last four years) didn't get any recruits in the recent past -- which they didn't -- it's hard to see how they will in the future, given the likelihood that a 10th place finish this season would be a significant overachievement.

I like Charmin and she knows the game, and I hope she can turn the ship around. But it's a monumental task right now, and I don't know if there's anyone who can get it done.

Then again, I've been wrong (many) times before, and stranger things have happened ...

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I'm not denying that I am looking at this through Blue and Gold glasses. Nor, do I doubt your pulse on the basketball community. Why didn't they come over the last few years? I don't know, but a fresh coach is going to see if LG was part of that reason.
Why come to Cal? There was once(not so long ago) enough reasons for a Final Four team to come...the men's team haven't been able to say that in a very long time.