As far as I can see, Shocky got played by Martin just like the rest of us, since it appears that Martin basically had one foot out the door from the point at which the Missouri job became available. Either he hid it successfully from everyone, including Shocky. Or Shocky knew about it and didn't tell anyone in order to try to maintain his access. Either way, I also don't support hiring Pasternack, because I don't think he'd stay with the program if he's successful, and there's no evidence based on his stint at New Orleans that he'd be successful, although to be fair, I believe that job was basically terminated by Hurricane Katrina. I'd rather go straight to Gates, and try and build something long term. I also agree that we need the practice facility, but like the football stadium, I don't think just doing that solves the problem, so I'm only willing to do it in conjunction with a coach who is willing to make some kind of commitment to the school if we do it. Again, just my opinion.

UrsaMajor;842820615 said:

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Guys:

This kind of hissy-fight is not terribly useful. Shocky: if your delusions about high school basketball players reading this thread all the time are accurate, do you actually think this kind of **** is likely to impress them?

Also, having season tickets does not define someone's worth as a human being (and I'm someone who's had season tix longer than you have, Shocky).

Content, not insults, are what are useful.

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Shocky is garbage, plain and simple. He insults here, and sends countless of us private messages to entertain himself.

That's his form of masturbation, I suppose.

I am a season tix holder. Screw Ben Brauns bag man Pasternak, if they hire the POS, I think we are done. Shitty idea, talk about settling for mediocrity.

Shocky1;842820592 said:

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joe pasternack is arguably the most energized recruiter on the west coast & he's the best person to get the necessary dedicated practice facility done

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I know I risk getting a DM for this, but... shouldn't we hold Pasternack accountable for recruiting and coaching PED user Allonzo Trier?

(disclaimer: I would have loved having Trier on this year's team)

ThesePretzels;842820718 said:

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I know I risk getting a DM for this, but... shouldn't we hold Pasternack accountable for recruiting and coaching PED user Allonzo Trier?

(disclaimer: I would have loved having Trier on this year's team)

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Again, I don't know how one separate out Pasternack from Arizona's HISTORICALLY ALWAYS GOOD TRACK RECORD AT RECRUITING.

To$h showed that he could recruit to Cal. He showed he could recruit to Washington. He is showing he can recruit to 'Bama. Now this isn't trying to recruit at Washington State but it is three schools with three successes.

Josh P has "recruited" well at Zona. He might recruit well at Cal. He could well not. If that is the ticket than I think you have to really wonder - I would take the coach in waiting at SDSU in a heartbeat over Josh because that is recruiting into a relatively difficult sell (though less than in the past) since out of the P5 and not a major media market (MW tv deal SUCKS)

SBGold;842819688 said:

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whoa, young Porter to Cal?

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sbgold, your instincts in reading the clues are pretty good but that's not what the deal maker had in mind

young ivee did not play in the nit because of discussions with his moms tami that morning, he made the right decision to protect his health at all costs & best prepare himself for the 2017 nba draft

truly love that family

diamonds are not forever (but they shine fiercely in berkeley when they do)#

socaltownie;842820609 said:

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Hah. Buddy. Got in. Decided I wanted to date yoGA girls rather than live at home since dorms impacted in early 80s

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go aztecs#

Shocky1;842820747 said:

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go aztecs#

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acutally go Pioneers and Tritons. But given what I do and where I live we support the aztecs as well

#benicetoothers

FrankBear21;842820637 said:

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I like turtles.

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i like rescue mutts, links par 3s in the sand dunes & curvy brunette yoga females with flat stomachs

Shocky1;842820741 said:

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sbgold, your instincts in reading the clues are pretty good but that's not what the deal maker had in mind

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Thanks Shocky. tell us this, if Martin stuck around Cal and romar was let go, would Porter Sr (and young Porter) landed at Cal?

Jeff82;842820661 said:

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As far as I can see, Shocky got played by Martin just like the rest of us, since it appears that Martin basically had one foot out the door from the point at which the Missouri job became available. Either he hid it successfully from everyone, including Shocky. Or Shocky knew about it and didn't tell anyone in order to try to maintain his access. Either way, I also don't support hiring Pasternack, because I don't think he'd stay with the program if he's successful, and there's no evidence based on his stint at New Orleans that he'd be successful, although to be fair, I believe that job was basically terminated by Hurricane Katrina. I'd rather go straight to Gates, and try and build something long term. I also agree that we need the practice facility, but like the football stadium, I don't think just doing that solves the problem, so I'm only willing to do it in conjunction with a coach who is willing to make some kind of commitment to the school if we do it. Again, just my opinion.

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Pasternack, Gates and Randy Bennett: The Three Stooges of "guys not to hire"

No way in the world Gates would be on anyone's list, short, long, or in between, if he hadn't have played here and excelled academically. And if you watched him play while he was here, you saw a guy who was marketed as a "defensive specialist", simply because he had nothing else to his game, but we wanted to market him because of his academics. Then, his senior year, he took umbrage at the "defense only" label and jacked up a bunch of three pointers, usually at the wrong time, missing the vast majority. He had no basketball IQ as a player, so I doubt he has a lot now. He's an assistant on the other side of the country who goes out and recruits. Nothing more.

Would prefer Musselman, or, better yet, bringing back Travis DeCuire.

socaltownie;842820748 said:

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acutally go Pioneers and Tritons. But given what I do and where I live we support the aztecs as well

#benicetoothers

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Read that as benice toothers ar first and was a bit confused

Big C_Cal;842820794 said:

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Pasternack, Gates and Randy Bennett: The Three Stooges of "guys not to hire"

No way in the world Gates would be on anyone's list, short, long, or in between, if he hadn't have played here and excelled academically. And if you watched him play while he was here, you saw a guy who was marketed as a "defensive specialist", simply because he had nothing else to his game, but we wanted to market him because of his academics. Then, his senior year, he took umbrage at the "defense only" label and jacked up a bunch of three pointers, usually at the wrong time, missing the vast majority. He had no basketball IQ as a player, so I doubt he has a lot now. He's an assistant on the other side of the country who goes out and recruits. Nothing more.

Would prefer Musselman, or, better yet, bringing back Travis DeCuire.

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You clearly don't follow the ACC.

Big C_Cal;842820794 said:

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Pasternack, Gates and Randy Bennett: The Three Stooges of "guys not to hire"

No way in the world Gates would be on anyone's list, short, long, or in between, if he hadn't have played here and excelled academically. And if you watched him play while he was here, you saw a guy who was marketed as a "defensive specialist", simply because he had nothing else to his game, but we wanted to market him because of his academics. Then, his senior year, he took umbrage at the "defense only" label and jacked up a bunch of three pointers, usually at the wrong time, missing the vast majority. He had no basketball IQ as a player, so I doubt he has a lot now. He's an assistant on the other side of the country who goes out and recruits. Nothing more.

Would prefer Musselman, or, better yet, bringing back Travis DeCuire.

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You are way off on Gates. He's one of the best young coaches on east coast and a big part of FSu's success.

TheSouseFamily;842820800 said:

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You clearly don't follow the ACC.

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LOL, I used to, before kids. So tell me: What's he done that would indicate he would be a good Head Coach?

ecb;842820798 said:

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Read that as benice toothers ar first and was a bit confused

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I read it that way, too. Oddly, it made perfect sense to me.

Big C_Cal;842820834 said:

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LOL, I used to, before kids. So tell me: What's he done that would indicate he would be a good Head Coach?

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I think being part of the crew that got FSU - which isn't a great hoops tradition - to number 3 seed. Gates comes, if I have my dates right, in 2010 to FSU. Since then seasons of (25, 18,22,17, 20 and now 25 wins).
How much Gates, how much Leonard Hamilton? Well who knows. Also those win numbers need to be put in the context of the ACC - which some believe are equal to 2-3 more in the Pac-12 (or not. Endless debate).

Most say the recruiting of high level classes corresponds to Gates arrival. But who knows....none of us are probably close enough to the program to know enough to seperate out the reality.

Again, my main criterion is someone that wants to be here and build a program. That rules out Musselman. We'd be a way-station for him. I can also see going back to Travis, although we really have no idea how he'd be as a recruiter. At Montana, he doesn't really have access to the talent pool. At Cal, he wasn't working for a coach with closing skills, which brings us back to the coach-up-the-players vs. recruit-the-studs debate. I would also say that if the coach-up-the-players camp really believes that, then they should be willing to hire someone like Decuire or Gates, on a seven-year contract, with a big buyout on both sides, which forces us to stay the course, even if it's bumpy at the beginning.

Jeff82;842820904 said:

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Again, my main criterion is someone that wants to be here and build a program. That rules out Musselman. We'd be a way-station for him. I can also see going back to Travis, although we really have no idea how he'd be as a recruiter. At Montana, he doesn't really have access to the talent pool. At Cal, he wasn't working for a coach with closing skills, which brings us back to the coach-up-the-players vs. recruit-the-studs debate. I would also say that if the coach-up-the-players camp really believes that, then they should be willing to hire someone like Decuire or Gates, on a seven-year contract, with a big buyout on both sides, which forces us to stay the course, even if it's bumpy at the beginning.

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+1.

I know if I could create our coach in a laboratory it would also be a coach who WANTS to be at an R1. I hate to say it but a guy like Bob Knight (minus the idiocy and senility of later life) - who actually was interested and did write books about history.....or the coach many years ago from Iowa that held a doctorate in Psych and still did research outside of his job.

I thought Martin "got that" even if he isn't a published scholar. He definitely SAID all the right things. But I think we will continue to put a round peg in a square hole until we find a guy who wants to be affiliated with a university as much as he wants to "coach basketball".


One observation. We have NEVER tried a service academy coach. We might want to think about that since you don't take those jobs with the idea you are grooming guys to go play in the show as opposed to a higher purpose.

socaltownie;842820906 said:

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+1.

I know if I could create our coach in a laboratory it would also be a coach who WANTS to be at an R1. I hate to say it but a guy like Bob Knight (minus the idiocy and senility of later life) - who actually was interested and did write books about history.....or the coach many years ago from Iowa that held a doctorate in Psych and still did research outside of his job.

I thought Martin "got that" even if he isn't a published scholar. He definitely SAID all the right things. But I think we will continue to put a round peg in a square hole until we find a guy who wants to be affiliated with a university as much as he wants to "coach basketball".


One observation. We have NEVER tried a service academy coach. We might want to think about that since you don't take those jobs with the idea you are grooming guys to go play in the show as opposed to a higher purpose.

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Dr. Tom Davis(?), although my recollection is that he left Stanford because he felt the academic requirements were too severe to get the players he needed to win. He was succeeded by Monty. Interestingly, Davis left Stanford after four years. Perhaps his comments were what led Stanford to give Monty so much time to get his system in, and allow it to work. Davis was an historian. Not sure who you're referring to.

Jeff82;842820912 said:

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Dr. Tom Davis(?), although my recollection is that he left Stanford because he felt the academic requirements were too severe to get the players he needed to win. He was succeeded by Monty. Interestingly, Davis left Stanford after four years. Perhaps his comments were what led Stanford to give Monty so much time to get his system in, and allow it to work. Davis was an historian. Not sure who you're referring to.

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Davis. Getting disciplines mixed up.

What was Coach DiBiaso's excuse?

socaltownie;842820906 said:

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+1.

I know if I could create our coach in a laboratory it would also be a coach who WANTS to be at an R1. I hate to say it but a guy like Bob Knight (minus the idiocy and senility of later life) - who actually was interested and did write books about history.....or the coach many years ago from Iowa that held a doctorate in Psych and still did research outside of his job.

I thought Martin "got that" even if he isn't a published scholar. He definitely SAID all the right things. But I think we will continue to put a round peg in a square hole until we find a guy who wants to be affiliated with a university as much as he wants to "coach basketball".


One observation. We have NEVER tried a service academy coach. We might want to think about that since you don't take those jobs with the idea you are grooming guys to go play in the show as opposed to a higher purpose.

---

First off, stop cluttering up Bills blog with this relevant dumb azz ****

Second, the only two service academy coaches that come to mind are some guy named K from Army and a guy named Popovich from Air Force. I can't really recall how either of them turned out...

Better yet, that Popovich guy went from AF assistant to Pomona-Pitzer College.

BeachedBear;842820987 said:

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First off, stop cluttering up Bills blog with this relevant dumb azz ****

Second, the only two service academy coaches that come to mind are some guy named K from Army and a guy named Popovich from Air Force. I can't really recall how either of them turned out...

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No, Bobby Knight coached at Army from 1965-1971. This whole thread just went completely off the rails with the half baked Pasternak coming back to Berkeley idea earlier today. Just from a marketing standpoint, it is a horrible idea, not to mention the guy just seems like a little prick.

For sure taking a service academy coach would be a major flyer, since they maybe have the most limited recruiting pools in all of Division I. Also, the fact that Knight, whose pedigree included being on an NCAA champion at Ohio State, ended up working for a time at Army shows how much the landscape has changed, in terms of the number of schools playing.

Jeff82;842821027 said:

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For sure taking a service academy coach would be a major flyer, since they maybe have the most limited recruiting pools in all of Division I. Also, the fact that Knight, whose pedigree included being on an NCAA champion at Ohio State, ended up working for a time at Army shows how much the landscape has changed, in terms of the number of schools playing.

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Knight was a pretty insignificant cog in that OSU championship team.

SBGold;842820786 said:

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Thanks Shocky. tell us this, if Martin stuck around Cal and romar was let go, would Porter Sr (and young Porter) landed at Cal?

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the deal maker was putting together his golden parachute out of berkeley around the same time the bears went into their year end slump so the answer is no plus the porter family is originally from missouri...coach didn't think he could win big in berkeley with this administration team & their inability to get the dedicated practice facility shovels in the ground along with other issues like the lack of charter flights for road games & the misuse of the meb fund for operational recruiting costs instead of as the intended head coach discretionary fund when the dollars were solicited from guys like me

read my earlier post again re: the final straw, the bears practiced 3 times this season at a local high school, that's ****** up & that's on mike williams, ashwin puri & jeremy wang

the show me (the money) state#

UrsaMajor;842820615 said:

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Guys:

This kind of hissy-fight is not terribly useful. Shocky: if your delusions about high school basketball players reading this thread all the time are accurate, do you actually think this kind of **** is likely to impress them?

Also, having season tickets does not define someone's worth as a human being (and I'm someone who's had season tix longer than you have, Shocky).

Content, not insults, are what are useful.

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facts:

1) you are not part of my targeted market segment, makes no difference to me if you read the monster class or not
2) both ivan rabb & jaylen brown read the monster class in high school & they ended up in berkeley
3) the vast majority of the current players, staff & former coaches from the last 2 staff all read the monster class
4) informed sources tell me that the targeted recruits in cal's go all the way up (2017) & cal's started at the bottom (2018) class read the monster class

and your wrong, having season tickets does define one's worth if they are pretending to be cal fan but instead they are a loser who watches cal basketball on tv & then talks **** about the players & the coaches...not going to cal basketball games at haas is a major character flaw:nono:

Shocky1;842821081 said:

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facts:

1) you are not part of my targeted market segment, makes no difference to me if you read the monster class or not
2) both ivan rabb & jaylen brown read the monster class in high school & they ended up in berkeley
3) the vast majority of the current players, staff & former coaches from the last 2 staff all read the monster class
4) informed sources tell me that the targeted recruits in cal's go all the way up (2017) & cal's started at the bottom (2018) class read the monster class

and your wrong, having season tickets does define one's worth if they are pretending to be cal fan but instead they are a loser who watches cal basketball on tv & then talks **** about the players & the coaches...not going to cal basketball games at haas is a major character flaw:nono:

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Fact: You are truly delusional.

NYCGOBEARS;842821082 said:

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Fact: You are truly delusional.

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so what's your point?




shine bright (like diamonds in the sky)#

NYCGOBEARS;842821082 said:

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Fact: You are truly delusional.

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Amen...

NYCGOBEARS;842821082 said:

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Fact: You are truly delusional.

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I would add, immature.

NYCGOBEARS;842821082 said:

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Fact: You are truly delusional.

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i mean tough to argue with his effort, but does he read his own posts?