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Cal Basketball

Potential Men's Basketball Coaching Candidates

March 12, 2023
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With the historically unsuccessful Mark Fox era over at Cal, let's take a look at some potential replacement candidates in this critical juncture of Cal basketball.

But before we begin, the profound level of futility of not just the Mark Fox era but also the preceding two years of comparable lack of success from Wyking Jones needs to be examined to understand just how big a hole AD Jim Knowlton and the athletic department needs to figure out a way to dig itself out of.

Following the relatively successful 3-year tenure of Cuonzo Martin, who went 62-39 overall and

Former Cal HC Cuonzo Martin

29-25 in conference before departing to Missouri with a substantial raise that more than doubled his Cal contract, prior AD Mike WIlliams made a critical error in hiring Martin assistant Wyking Jones, who had no head coaching experience. The results were even worse than the gloomiest of sceptics could have imagined, with a pair of last-place finishes and an overall record of 16-47 overall and just 5-31 in conference.

Veteran coach Mark Fox, who had had a modest level of success took over and fared little better in his 4-year tenure at Cal, going just 38-67 overall and 17-61 in conference.

Fortunately in this day of portal transfers and NIL, if a program like Cal that has something

Former Cal HC Mark Fox

beyond futility to offer under the right leadership and framework, including a robust NIL program, the right coach and a few key transfer additions can dramatically change the fortunes of a program without having to suffer through a painfully slow rebuild project.

There are some non-negotiable traits this go-round that are crucial to picking the right person to lead what is not a particularly easy turnaround of a Cal program that’s been down six years now: A strong recruiter, a dynamic personality, high character, problem solver vs. a complainer, an inclusive approach (former players, donors, press, fans input considered), a proven head coach and teacher, a builder/change agent type and energetic.

With that in mind, here are some candidates that Cal can, will or possibly should consider:

Potential primary candidates:

Joe Pasternak UCSB head coach, age 41

Pasternack currently holds a record of 132–52 (.713) and 70–30 (.700) in Big West conference play in six seasons in Santa Barbara. The Gauchos tied for 1st in conference this season with a 15-5 record and 27-7 overall, also winning the Big West conference tourney. The Gauchos earned a 14th seed in the NCAA tournament, facing No. 3 seed Baylor in the first round of the South Region on Friday He has experience as an assistant at Cal and Arizona, where he was their lead recruiter, which could be viewed as a strong positive with the elite players he helped bring in

UCSB HC Joe Pasternack

or potentially a negative if he was personally involved in any of their recruiting violations when he was on staff under Sean Miller. He also helped engineer a turnaround at his first head coaching job at New Orleans so he also has experience digging out of holes. UCSB had also gone 25-36 in the two seasons prior to Pasternack’s arrival. He has strong west coast ties and is known as a strong recruiter.

Darian DeVries Drake head coach, age 47

DeVries currently holds a record of 122–47 (.722) and 63–29 (.685) in Missouri Valley conference play in 5 seasons at Drake.  Drake is currently 27-7 and finished 2nd in conference with a 15-5 record. Drake earned the No. 12 seed in the Midwest Region and will face No. 5 Miami in Albany, NY. DeVries was twice voted conference Coach of the Year and

Drake HC Darian DeVries

has a 1-1 record in NCAA tourney play. Prior to his arrival, Drake went just 23-40 before he engineered a quick turnaround. Combined with his time as an assistant at Creighton, he has a reputation as a strong recruiter and as a dynamic young coach who comes from a good coaching tree, though he does not appear to have particularly strong west coast ties.

Leon Rice, Boise State head coach, age 59

Rice currently holds a record of 267–153 (.636) and 141–88 (.616) in conference play at BSU. They went 13-5 in Mountain

Boise State HC Leon Rice

West play this season,  and 23-8 overall. Rice was twice named conference Coach of the Year and won two regular season conference and one conference tournament championship in his 14 seasons at BSU. He has significant coaching experience also serving as an assistant at Oregon and Gonzaga, though his age might be a bit less attractive.

Brian Dutcher, San Diego State head coach, age 63

Dutcher currently holds a record of 144–46 (.757) overall and 81–25 (.764) in conference play as head coach at SDSU. SDSU

Boise State HC Brian Dutcher

went 15-3 this season, winning the Mountain West conference title and Mountain West conference tourney. SDSU earned a No. 5 seed in the NCAA Tournament, facing 12th-seeded College of Charleston. Dutcher was a longtime assistant head coach for 9 years at Michigan and 18 years at SDSU under highly-successful head coach Brian Fisher. He’s won 3 conference championships and 2 conference championship tournaments in his 5 seasons with the Aztecs. Dutcher has strong west coast ties and a good recruiting reputation though his age may be seen by some as a drawback.

Mark Pope, BYU head coach, age 50

Pope currently holds a record at BYU of  85–40 (.680) overall and 39–21 (.650) in conference in his 4 seasons at BYU. They went 7-9 in conference this season and 17-15 overall, tying for fifth in the West Coast Conference. The Cougars went to the NCAA tourney in 2020-21 after finishing 20-7

BYU HC Mark Pope

and 10-3, 2nd in conference and to the NIT quarterfinals the next season. Dutcher also was an assistant at Wake Forest and Georgia as well as a player for 6 years in the NBA with Denver, Milwaukee and Indiana. He played for Washington and was the captain of Kentucky’s national championship team in 1996.

Next let’s take a look at several potential targets who some might see as a higher risk/higher reward option for various reasons.

Ryan Odom, Utah State head coach, age 48

Odom holds a record at Utah State of 41–23 (.641)overall and 20–15 (.571) in conference play at Utah State in his two seasons there, currently 23-7 and 12-6 in Mountain West Conference play,

Montana State HC Ryan Odom
​​​​​

finishing 2nd behind San Diego State and tied with Boise State. Prior to Utah State, Odom turned around an awful UMBC (University of Maryland, Baltimore County) who had gone 11-51 in the 2 seasons prior to his arrival to a first-season 21-13 record and 97-60 in 5 seasons. He was also an assistant at Virginia Tech, South Florida, Furman, UNC-Ashville and Charlotte.

Danny Sprinkle, Montana State, age 45

Sprinkle holds a record of 81–42 (.659) 49–23 (.681) at Montana State in Big Sky play, going 25–9 overall and 15–3 in conference this season, finishing 2nd in the regular season and earning a second straight NCAA tourney appearance with a Big Sky conference tournament championship this season. The Bobcats will face No. Kansas State on Friday in the opening round of the tournament in Greensboro, North Carolina. Sprinkle was named the Big Sky Coach of the Year this season. He took over a program that went just 28-46 in the two seasons before he arrived so he’s no stranger to big turnarounds. He's recruited on the west coast as an assistant at Cal State Northridge and Fullerton State and played collegiately at Montana State in the 90s.

Todd Simon, Southern Utah head coach, age 42

Simon holds a record at Southern Utah of 117-105  overall and 65-54 in conference play at Southern Utah in his 2 seasons there. They finished 20-11 overall currently and 12-6 in WAC Conference play. His teams have finished 64-27 in the last 3 seasons. Interestingly, Simon was part of the founding staff of Findlay Prep in Las Vegas and coached former Cal star Jorge Gutierrez in high school. He was also an assistant head coach and interim head coach at UNLV.

Stan Johnson, Loyola Marymount head coach, age 43

Johnson holds a record at LMU of 43–39 (.524) overall and 19–24 (.442) in WCC conference play at

LMU HC Stan Johnson

LMU in his 3 seasons there. They finished this season at 19-12 overall and 9-7 in conference play this season, finishing 4th. Before LMU, Johnson was an assistant at Marquette, ASU, Drake and Utah. He took over a Lions program that went 31-33 prior to his arrival.

Shantay Legans, Portland head coach, age 41

Legans holds a record at Portand of 32–33 (.492) overall and 12–18 (.400) in WCC conference play in his 2 seasons there. They finished this season 13-18 overall and 5-11 in conference play, finishing 8th. He took over a program that had gone just 15-38 the 2 seasons before his arrival. Legans went 39-14 in his final two seasons at Eastern

Portland HC Shantay Leggans

Washington before taking the Portland job. Legans played point guard at Cal from 1999 to 2002 before transferring to Fresno State.

Tim Miles, San Jose State head coach, age 56

Miles holds a record of 27–35 (.435) overall and 11–25 (.306) at San Jose State in Mountain West play in his 2 seasons there. They finished this season 20-12 overall and 10-8 in MWC play after struggling his first season, taking over a Spartans program that

San Jose State HC Tim Miles

went just 20-93 in the 4 prior seasons. Prior to SJS, Miles went 116–114 (.504) in 7 seasons at Nebraska and 71-88 at Colorado State.

Grant McCasland, North Texas head coach, age 46

MacCasland holds a record of 129–65 (.663) overall at North Texas and 71–36 (.664) in Conference USA play in his 6 seasons with the Mean Green. They finished the regular season 26-7 overall and 16-4 in C-USA, finishing second. He took over a North Texas program that has gone just 20-42 prior to his arrival, engineering a nice turnaround. His coaching experience at Baylor gave him bigger recruiting exposure and MacCasland also played at Baylor in the 90s.

Rodney Terry, Texas interim head coach, age 54

Terry holds a record of 17-7 overall at Texas and 12-6 in Big-12 conference play since taking over as interim coach after previous head coach Chris Beard was suspended then fired by the

Texas interim HC Rodney Terry

Longhorns. After knocking off No. 1 seed Kansas in the conference tourney, the Longhorns earned the No. 2 seed in the Midwest Region against No. 15 seed Colgate in Des Moines, Iowa on Thursday. Terry got his head coaching start at Fresno State in 2011, taking a few years before turning around the program and winning 20+ games his last three seasons with the Bulldogs. He then took over at UTEP, going 37–48 (.435) overall and 19–33 (.365) in C-USA play in three seasons before moving over to Texas.

Mark Madsen, Utah Valley head coach, age 47

Madsen holds a record of 65–49 (.570) overall at Utah Valley and 38–25 (.528) in WAC conference play since taking over 4 years ago. Utah Valley went 23–7 overall and 14–3 in conference play, winning the WAC conference championship.

Utah Valley HC Mark Madsen.

The former Stanford power forward had a 9-year NBA career with the Timberwolves and Lakers and spent the preceding years as an assistant, most recently with the Lakers for 4 seasons before taking over at Utah Valley.

 

Amir Abdur-Rahim, Kennesaw State, age 43

Abdur-Rahim holds a record of 45–73 (.381) overall and 24–41 (.369) in ASUN conference, though after three tough seasons to start his coaching career taking over a program that had gone just 16-46 in the two prior seasons, the younger brother of former Cal star forward Shareef Abdur-Rahim had a breakthrough season this year, going 26–8 overall and 15–3 in conference, winning the conference this season and earning them a No. 14 seed in the Midwest bracket and will take on No. 3 seed Xavier Friday. Prior to his first head coaching job, Abdur-Rahim was an assistant at Georgia, Texas A&M and College of Charleston.

The next category of coaches are likely not available due to various reasons, including jobs that currently could be considered better opportunities, higher salaries that perhaps couldn’t be matched, buyouts that would be impossible to cover and other various factors.

Dennis Gates, Missouri head coach, age 43

Gates holds a record of 24–8 (.750) overall and 11–7 (.611) in SEC play in his first season after taking over for former Cal head coach Cuonzo Martin after the Tigers stagnated in his final

Missouri HC Dennis Gates

seasons there. The Tigers earned a 7th seed in the 2023 NCAA tourney where they’ll face 10th-seeded Utah State in the first round, playing as part of the South regional in Sacramento.  Gates got his start as a head coach at Cleveland State, going 50–40 (.556) overall and 38–21 (.644) in Horizon League play after taking over a program that had gone just 40-89 in the four seasons prior to his arrival. However Gates has a prohibitive buyout that would make it very difficult to afford him even if he wanted to come to Cal. Gates played for the Bears from 1998 to 2002 and was an assistant at Cal when he got his start in coaching as well as at Northern Illinois, Nevada and Florida State before taking over at Cleveland State.

Jamie Dixon, TCU head coach, age 53

Dixon holds a record of 138–95 (.592) overall and 51–73 (.411) in Big 12 play and 21-12 overall and 9-9 in Big 12 play this season, earning 6th seed in the 2023 NCAA tournament, facing the winner of the First Four matchup between Arizona State and Nevada. The winner of that matchup will be the 11th seed. Dixon guided the Horned Frogs to the NCAA tourney last season as well, reaching the round of 32. Dixon took over a TCU team that had gone 30-36 in the two seasons prior to taking over after posting an impressive 328–123 (.727) overall and 143–81 (.638) ACC record at Pitt before making the move to TCU. Dixon however was extended to 2028, making his buyout prohibitive.

Todd Golden, Florida head coach, age 37

Golden holds a record of 16–16 at Florida overall and 9–9 in SEC play since taking over the Gators program this season. He parlayed a record of 57–36 (.613) overall at USF and 23–22 (.511) in conference play to the Florida job. But with 5 years and a 15 million buyout, Golden is not a likely addition.

Chris Beard, former Texas head coach, age 50

Golden posted a record at his most recent stop at Texas of 29–13 (.690) overall and 10–8 (.556) in Big 12 conference play before being dismissed for accusations of physical violence with his fiancee that were later retracted by her. Prior to his brief stint at Texas, Beard went 112–55 (.671) overall and 49–40 (.551) in Big 12 conference play, going to the NCAA finals, the Great 8 and round of 32 in three of his four seasons there. Talk is heating up about Ole Miss making a strong pitch for him and even though the allegations were withdrawn against him, he could be a tricky hire at Cal.

Related:

Cal Makes Change In Men's Basketball Leadership - Fox Gone

Discussion from...

Potential Men's Basketball Coaching Candidates

77,869 Views | 361 Replies | Last: 1 yr ago by Pittstop
bluesaxe
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In reply to socaltownie • 7:53a, 3/22/23
socaltownie said:
AAR is definately a high risk/high reward kind of candidate. Kenn State acceptance rate is 83%. Similar to Boise (and Penn state for your next trivia night) it started as a 2 year CC and then about 20 years ago moved to a 4 year status.

I can not stress enough to any donor with juice just how DIFFERENT that is than Cal. I mean fundamentally different. While like a LOT of American Higher education (really Cal is the outlier), Kennesaw and Cal are fundamentally different places.

Now we think that because HIS BROTHER Graduated a dozen years ago with a Cal BS AAR might know Cal. That is unknown.

I understand (and approve of) the idea of trying to find an African American Coach given the lack of diversity in the Pac-12 coaching ranks. AAR could be a home run. But this is absolutely my marker to say "I told you so" if coach comes to cal and finds it ain't like running a sports program in the deep south at a school with an 83% acceptance rate.
Not disputing any of this, but the man from all accounts is highly energetic and a real leader. Knowing Cal is a plus, but he seems like a guy who can coach and a guy who can recruit. While Cal has a different pool of recruiting candidates, it's not like that good players in that pool don't exist. I'm just pleased that they interviewed a higher risk guy, honestly, and that it's a young AA candidate who has some fire. I'll take that any day over a "safe" and "comfortable" choice.
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socaltownie
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7:56a, 3/22/23
While badger is an ass, he outlines some of the issues as a dad foe why I want sct Jr to broaden his search. I know every dead says so but the kid is genius level smart. Will finish with 15 plus aps and a single b frosh year and a 1530 sat on first try.

But being stuck in a big land grant school that doesn't prioritize teaching is such a waste. Mrs scr and I are willing to dig deep to get him to a school where he could thrive ...we just neeed to get him off ucsd, ucla, cal or bust
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udaman1
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7:56a, 3/22/23
I've been following the Cal admissions forum on College Confidential for the last few years. For the first time, they are limiting access to SOME impacted majors. In other words, if you want to major in Data Science, you have to list it in your application, and be accepted into the major as an incoming Freshman. You can no longer put down 'undeclared' and expect to get into the major as a Junior.

These impacted majors are: Art Practice, Economics, Operations Research & Management Science, Public Health, Computer Science, Global Studies, Political Economy, Social Welfare, Data Science, Media Studies, Psychology, Statistics

Cal remains a dream school for so many kids, and is considered the gold standard for computer science, and is highly sought after.
According to students and parents, the major concerns about going to Cal are student housing and crime.
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wraptor347
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8:03a, 3/22/23
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sluggo
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In reply to badger • 8:07a, 3/22/23
badger said:
Cal's espoused values and reputation do not match its reality. It is closing three libraries; the College of Letters and Science has 24K students and 31 advisors (thats nealry 800 stduents per advisor, students are on their own) it can house less than a 3rd of its students (compare that to places like Boston University who guarantees 4 years of housing); the campus is not safe and has is consistently rated in the bottom of campus safety in the US (according to Cleary Act data).
Faculty are hired for their research ability not their teaching, the majority of teaching is done by smart grad students, but also grad students who have no teaching skills; the university does next to nothing to prepare GSIs to be good teachers. The leadership is completely out of touch with what makes a university in the 21st century great.
Stop living in the past, Cal is not what many think it is.
If anyone expects a good hiring decsion out if this ****show, you are fooling yourself
Sounds like the same Cal I went to 35 years ago. Where the just awarded Nobel prize winner in chemistry gave a guest lecture in my first-year chemistry class. And where Jennifer Doudna recently won the Nobel prize in chemistry and is one of the most influential scientists alive. The campus is still beautiful, and the athletic department is still bad. Cal is exactly what it has always been. Whether it will make a good hire is anyone's guess.
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tequila4kapp
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8:16a, 3/22/23
My guess is there's a solid amount of culture and cultural change at play. In my time Cal's MO was sink or swim, no hand holding, no coddling. We are well into a generation + of helicopter parents and participation trophies. Society has moved beyond what Cal is/was. On top of that - or in conjunction with that - Berkeley is Berkeley and UCLA is Westwood. Easy choice for a lot of people.
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GoCal80
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In reply to badger • 9:28a, 3/22/23
Faculty are hired based on their research at all R1 universities. Small liberal arts colleges and perhaps community colleges hire based on teaching ability. Some top scholars are great teachers. Some are not.

Cal does have challenges. Chancellor Christ has made increasing student housing a top priority and she is overall very successful with multiple big construction projects underway. She's also has been tremendously successful at raising money and diversifying Cal's student body, faculty and staff.
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udaman1
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9:53a, 3/22/23
Berkeley City sides with Cal on People's Park Appeal

This is a switch. The city is on the side of Cal in its appeal to the state to be able to build housing. I'm all for maintaining open space. People's Park could be a great outdoor area for the whole community. But we're all aware that would never happen. Ever. 1000 dorm rooms would be a great plus for everyone.
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stu
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In reply to udaman1 • 10:15a, 3/22/23
udaman1 said:
Berkeley City sides with Cal on People's Park Appeal

This is a switch. The city is on the side of Cal in its appeal to the state to be able to build housing. I'm all for maintaining open space. People's Park could be a great outdoor area for the whole community. But we're all aware that would never happen. Ever. 1000 dorm rooms would be a great plus for everyone.
Excellent, I can't agree more!

However I'm not so sure about "open space". I lived across the street from People's Park when it was founded. After the University tore down the buildings on that lot then failed to build anything a loose community group took it on themselves to clean up and do a little planting. Fore a few weeks (or months, my memory is fading) the place really was open space. Then the University put up a fence and tore up the improvements. Understandable to protect their property rights but done in a way which outraged a lot of people and started a war. Ever since the place has been some sort of hallowed ground, nobody has dared to disturb the status quo. It's no longer open space because the vast majority of people are afraid to enter it.
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stu
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In reply to socaltownie • 10:28a, 3/22/23
socaltownie said:
But being stuck in a big land grant school that doesn't prioritize teaching is such a waste. Mrs scr and I are willing to dig deep to get him to a school where he could thrive ...we just neeed to get him off ucsd, ucla, cal or bust
IMHO UC Berkeley is one of the best places on the planet to be exposed to academics. But if you want any guidance or assistance on your journey you'd do better at a smaller school with a better faculty/student ratio and faculty who teach.

Besides, most of the Ivies have better basketball teams.
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BigDaddyBear
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10:57a, 3/22/23
As has been said ad nauseum, Cal isn't for everyone. I loved my experience as an undergrad being challenged without any handholding and having to make my own way. I went to a small private college for grad school and was surprised and sometimes embarrassed at the coddling and hand holding that took place. Our son who is a sophomore at Cal Poly SLO got admitted to CAL with the "change maker" program where he would have lived at Mills College for the first year, but didn't want to do that. I think SLO's a better fit for him, but Cal was a better fit for me.
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socaltownie
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In reply to stu • 11:17a, 3/22/23
stu said:
socaltownie said:
But being stuck in a big land grant school that doesn't prioritize teaching is such a waste. Mrs scr and I are willing to dig deep to get him to a school where he could thrive ...we just neeed to get him off ucsd, ucla, cal or bust
IMHO UC Berkeley is one of the best places on the planet to be exposed to academics. But if you want any guidance or assistance on your journey you'd do better at a smaller school with a better faculty/student ratio and faculty who teach.

Besides, most of the Ivies have better basketball teams.
As a faculty brat and townie I generaly agree. I do think though that there are some unique schools (Chicago, A few of the Ivies, CalTech/MIT, Harvey Mudd) that have compelling approaches that are highly unique experiences for undergrads. I think that Cal may be the best in the world for most grauduate programs.
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badger
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11:53a, 3/22/23
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
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socaltownie
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In reply to badger • 12:01p, 3/22/23
badger said:
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
But these are knocks on nearly EVERY top 30 R1. As my father would say "The university would be great except for the undergrads getting in the way")

The real question in higher ed (and it is a really interesting one) is why elite R1s have such high application interest. The experiences that you note is common in many - from Michigan to UTA, to the top 3 UCs. Edcuation is impersonal, teaching is "meh" and there is very little institutional interest (or need) to focus on "student success". As I have noted elsewhere, those R1s are in some sense outliers - as the rest of the industry struggles with enrollment, has a laser focus on student success and is starting (slowy but starting) to reward teaching in promotion and tenure.

One key - and it is a key - is "peer learning". What may set Cal apart from say Chico State is NOT the quality of the classroom or even university experience. *It is that the peers you are surrounded by are also ridiculously smart and that this environment is what is really valuable. It is the special sauce that higher ed innovators in, for example, the on-line space haven't recreated or why many "lower tier" universities push hard for on-campus living and housing.

WHere I will agree is that Big elite R1s have a challenge recruiting D1 athelets. THe experience is mpersonal. The demands on time outside the class room are intense. The student support that one will get at many other institutions is not there. It is an offer that is "meh" and is one of the reasons why I think that it is important that Cal lean into being a REGIONAL university for Revenue D1 athletes - for whom admission rates is irrelevent and who will have offers of student life that are pretty compelling.
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CaliforniaEternal
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In reply to badger • 12:39p, 3/22/23
Not that it's always the most personal environment, but I recall most faculty teaching undergraduate courses. I had Jennifer Doudna for part of an upper division biochemistry class. I went to her office hours and she was very accessible. Then we had Carolyn Bertozzi, who unfortunately left for furd. Randy Schekman taught Bio 1B, one of the prerequisite lower division bio classes with 500 students. This was before they won Nobels, but to have had classes with multiple Nobel winners is pretty astounding. I don't think I could have had that experience anywhere else in the world.
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BearGoggles
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In reply to badger • 12:48p, 3/22/23
badger said:
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
If this is your view, it's a bit odd you sent your child to Cal.

I agree most other schools have a lot more coddling/guidance/support resources. No different today then year's past. A notable exception to that is the D-1 athletes who do have a lot of career and academic support. So I don't think you final paragraph is on point.

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GoCal80
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In reply to badger • 12:52p, 3/22/23
Jennifer Doudna teaches introductory biology, Bio1A, the gateway course for all undergraduate students enrolled in life sciences at Cal. This course is taught twice a year and if a student takes it the other semester, they get a different Nobel laureate, Randy Schekman, as their prof. Lots of undergrads find it very inspirational to have a Nobel laureate give these lectures to them. Currently Doudna has 8 Cal undergrads working in her research lab. She thinks highly enough of the education offered by Cal to have sent her only child, a junior in EECS, to Cal. Doudna also attends Berkeley High science fairs. She is really dedicated to teaching and inspiring young people to pursue careers in science. She also takes her role as a model and inspiration for young females interested in science very seriously. (Doudna and Schekman are good friends of mine so what I report above comes from up-close observations and direct knowledge/observation).


P.S. Not to beat a dead horse, but Schekman's daughter attended Cal. His son is a professional classical musician who attended a music-oriented college.
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BeachedBear
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In reply to BearGoggles • 12:58p, 3/22/23
BearGoggles said:
badger said:
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
If this is your view, it's a bit odd you sent your child to Cal.

I agree most other schools have a lot more coddling/guidance/support resources. No different today then year's past. A notable exception to that is the D-1 athletes who do have a lot of career and academic support. So I don't think you final paragraph is on point.

Not sure what your parenting experience was like, but I was not able to send any of my kids anywhere It was a discussion among adults. Some (like me) with obviously more years and money - but it just wasn't up to me. Oh - and none of my kids were able to get into Cal with 4.1 GPAs

Go State!!!

And I was blown away at the level of coddling at the state schools - compared to my experience at Cal in the 80s. My experience was similar to badger's kid 40 years ago - so at least Cal is consistent.
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HearstMining
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In reply to BigDaddyBear • 1:18p, 3/22/23
BigDaddyBear said:
As has been said ad nauseum, Cal isn't for everyone. I loved my experience as an undergrad being challenged without any handholding and having to make my own way. I went to a small private college for grad school and was surprised and sometimes embarrassed at the coddling and hand holding that took place. Our son who is a sophomore at Cal Poly SLO got admitted to CAL with the "change maker" program where he would have lived at Mills College for the first year, but didn't want to do that. I think SLO's a better fit for him, but Cal was a better fit for me.
I'll bet your son is having a good experience. People who consider the CSUs to be some sort of advanced vocational schools are mistaken - kids are taught plenty of theory there - at least at the top CSUs. My two kids went to CP-SLO, one majoring in Industrial Technology and the other Materials Engineering. They were smarter than average kids with strong grades, but not geniuses and not obsessed with their GPAs. Consequently, I figured Cal might not be for them. They got accepted to UCSB and UCLA but chose SLO and it worked out great. I didn't want them to be "coddled", but I wanted them to learn useful stuff in college - not just struggle to survive for four years. One kid now works at Apple and the other has worked at Tesla and then a couple of start-ups. I'm happy I went to Cal but if I'd understood my learning style at age 18, I probably would have been better off at a place like SLO.
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stu
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In reply to HearstMining • 1:39p, 3/22/23
I think CP-SLO is probably the best in the entire CSU system. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

Long ago I took some grad classes at SFSU and more recently my daughter got her masters from SJSU. Both of us had some good teachers but felt we were really held back by the level of the other students.
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BearGoggles
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In reply to BeachedBear • 1:44p, 3/22/23
BeachedBear said:
BearGoggles said:
badger said:
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
If this is your view, it's a bit odd you sent your child to Cal.

I agree most other schools have a lot more coddling/guidance/support resources. No different today then year's past. A notable exception to that is the D-1 athletes who do have a lot of career and academic support. So I don't think you final paragraph is on point.

Not sure what your parenting experience was like, but I was not able to send any of my kids anywhere It was a discussion among adults. Some (like me) with obviously more years and money - but it just wasn't up to me. Oh - and none of my kids were able to get into Cal with 4.1 GPAs

Go State!!!

And I was blown away at the level of coddling at the state schools - compared to my experience at Cal in the 80s. My experience was similar to badger's kid 40 years ago - so at least Cal is consistent.
Of course it was a discussion, but if I pooped on one of the potential schools, that would be a pretty strong influence. I actually have two children and they have very different personalities. One would have done well at Cal (he went elsewhere). The other would not (even though he's bright enough) and didn't even apply.

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BearGoggles
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In reply to stu • 1:45p, 3/22/23
stu said:
I think CP-SLO is probably the best in the entire CSU system. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

Long ago I took some grad classes at SFSU and more recently my daughter got her masters from SJSU. Both of us had some good teachers but felt we were really held back by the level of the other students.
SLO is fantastic and hard to get into because: (i) it is so affordable (comparatively speaking); and (ii) you have to apply to your specific major, with many of them being impacted.
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socaltownie
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In reply to BearGoggles • 1:49p, 3/22/23
BearGoggles said:
stu said:
I think CP-SLO is probably the best in the entire CSU system. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

Long ago I took some grad classes at SFSU and more recently my daughter got her masters from SJSU. Both of us had some good teachers but felt we were really held back by the level of the other students.
SLO is fantastic and hard to get into because: (i) it is so affordable (comparatively speaking); and (ii) you have to apply to your specific major, with many of them being impacted.
Main issue wtih SLO is lack of diversity. It is the least diverse CSU/UC and one of the least diverse in the country.
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stu
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In reply to BearGoggles • 1:59p, 3/22/23
BearGoggles said:
Of course it was a discussion, but if I pooped on one of the potential schools, that would be a pretty strong influence...
With my daughter, if one of her peers said something negative about a school that was a strong influence. If one of her peers had never heard of a school it was no longer under consideration.
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BeachedBear
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In reply to BearGoggles • 2:02p, 3/22/23
BearGoggles said:
BeachedBear said:
BearGoggles said:
badger said:
While socaltownie may think little of me, allow me to contextualize some things. I am a tenured Professor of Higher Education at small public universty, sit on a D1 athletic board, and have a child at Cal.

I sat listening to Christ at Cal day last year and thought, this woman is completely out of touch with the realities of todays higher ed

Yes Jeniffer Doudna is a genius and an amazing scholar, but if you think she has any contact with any undergrads you are mistaken. She supervises PhD students who work in her lab. I doubt there are more than a very small handfull of power 5 level footbal and basketball recruits who have heard of her or care.

This universty is over capacity for the physical and human resources required to support student success

My point is , many on this board boast about elite status, low admison rates and the like, thinking that Cal is some wonderland, it is not. If you are an alum, should you be proud, of course!

Is Cal fatally flawed? No, but it is not what many believe it to be.

Most recruits and thier families want to know that they will be supported for success on and off the field. Can Cal do that, yes, but not in its current state with its current leadership
If this is your view, it's a bit odd you sent your child to Cal.

I agree most other schools have a lot more coddling/guidance/support resources. No different today then year's past. A notable exception to that is the D-1 athletes who do have a lot of career and academic support. So I don't think you final paragraph is on point.

Not sure what your parenting experience was like, but I was not able to send any of my kids anywhere It was a discussion among adults. Some (like me) with obviously more years and money - but it just wasn't up to me. Oh - and none of my kids were able to get into Cal with 4.1 GPAs

Go State!!!

And I was blown away at the level of coddling at the state schools - compared to my experience at Cal in the 80s. My experience was similar to badger's kid 40 years ago - so at least Cal is consistent.
Of course it was a discussion, but if I pooped on one of the potential schools, that would be a pretty strong influence. I actually have two children and they have very different personalities. One would have done well at Cal (he went elsewhere). The other would not (even though he's bright enough) and didn't even apply.

Love it! I did have to pull the "Sure, you can go there, but I'm not helping with tuition" line; at least once for each of my three kids. Similarly, "You should go to Tulane or LSU, because I'd love to visit you in New Orleans" didn't work at all.

So far, none are in jail and generally seem to be relatively upright citizens, so there's that.
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parentswerebears
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In reply to stu • 2:51p, 3/22/23
stu said:
I think CP-SLO is probably the best in the entire CSU system. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

Long ago I took some grad classes at SFSU and more recently my daughter got her masters from SJSU. Both of us had some good teachers but felt we were really held back by the level of the other students.


I loved Chico, but academically, it was hit or miss. The history dept really cared. Others were weak.
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GoCal80
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3:44p, 3/22/23
Teaching is part of the DNA of the faculty at Cal. That does not mean that all Cal faculty are great teachers. That certainly is not the case. However, there are enough high-profile faculty who value teaching greatly that they not only inspire students, but their example inspires young faculty recruits to place a high priority on being the best teachers they can be. (On top of that, you cannot rise up the pay scale at Cal quickly without good teaching evaluations from students, which also incentivizes taking teaching seriously).

Nobel laureate Randy Schekman is one of those inspirational faculty members who values teaching greatly. Not only does he teach entry-level biology lectures in front of around 500 students, but he also teaches intimate freshman and sophomore seminars to classes of 20-30 undergraduates, which is a purely voluntary activity. Schekman talks about why teaching is important to him here and in numerous online videos.
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MoragaBear
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In reply to GoCal80 • 3:54p, 3/22/23
Staff
GoCal80 said:
Nobel laureate Randy Schekman is one of those inspirational faculty members who values teaching greatly. Not only does he teach entry-level biology lectures in front of around 500 students, but he also teaches intimate freshman and sophomore seminars to classes of 20-30 undergraduates, which is a purely voluntary activity. Schekman talks about why teaching is important to him here and in numerous online videos.
There goes the narrative that our Nobel Prize-winning professors are locked in their ivory towers
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BearGoggles
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In reply to socaltownie • 4:39p, 3/22/23
socaltownie said:
BearGoggles said:
stu said:
I think CP-SLO is probably the best in the entire CSU system. I've heard nothing but good things about it.

Long ago I took some grad classes at SFSU and more recently my daughter got her masters from SJSU. Both of us had some good teachers but felt we were really held back by the level of the other students.
SLO is fantastic and hard to get into because: (i) it is so affordable (comparatively speaking); and (ii) you have to apply to your specific major, with many of them being impacted.
Main issue wtih SLO is lack of diversity. It is the least diverse CSU/UC and one of the least diverse in the country.

I guess it depends on how one defines/measures diversity and/or the extent to which those aspects of diversity are important.

From a strictly racial perspective, SLO is probably the most white campus in the UC/CSU system (?) with around 50% of the total enrollment being white from what I can tell. Do we compare that to the US population (75% white) or the CA population (35% white). Are whites over represented or under? Or maybe not all whites think alike?

Meanwhile, Asians at Cal are vastly over represented (speaking statistically vis-a-vis overall CA and US population) and the African American enrollment is like 3-4% (vastly under represented).

And this doesn't even begin to consider sex, class/socio economic diversity or viewpoint diversity.

This is a rabbit hole. SLO is a great school - as is Cal.
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OneTopOneChickenApple
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In reply to wraptor347 • 4:41p, 3/22/23
wraptor347 said:


Let's try to recover this hijacked thread.
Great to have Jaylen giving his input. If there is one non-California player's opinion about Cal basketball and academics I'd like to hear, it would be from him. One of my all-time favorite Bears for what he's done since he left. I hope he returns for his degree.
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annarborbear
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4:53p, 3/22/23
I had a great experience at Cal as a graduate student with a small peer group and great student-faculty ratios. Undergrad was really impersonal, and I cannot even remember the name of my so-called adviser. I always tell students who want to go to Cal that the most important thing will be to join various student groups and to create your own sense of community. Although you would probably have to do that at any large school. Fortunately, athletes can do that with their other team members.
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stu
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In reply to annarborbear • 5:23p, 3/22/23
I made some lifelong friends in the dorm. As less-than-fully-motivated undergrads we didn't help each other with academics and I never made any connection with anyone in my major. My fault but at a smaller school that would not have happened. At least I also failed to make any connections with druggies.

I tried several majors and remember the name of only my last advisor. But I certainly remember one piece of advice he gave me: "Take Math 104A, it will be good for your soul." I did and he was right.
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calumnus
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In reply to stu • 5:41p, 3/22/23
stu said:
BearGoggles said:
Of course it was a discussion, but if I pooped on one of the potential schools, that would be a pretty strong influence...
With my daughter, if one of her peers said something negative about a school that was a strong influence. If one of her peers had never heard of a school it was no longer under consideration.


Right? My daughter was offered an unsolicited scholarship to Tufts, but it was not one of the schools her hyper-competitive classmates (Mission San Jose in Fremont) had heard of, and the name "like tufts of hair?" people laughed at. I tried to convince her it was a great school (it would have been a really good fit) and we should at least fly to Boston to look, but the need to have the school approved by her peers was too much.

Cal was her dream school and she loved hanging out in Berkeley with her friends. She ended up getting into UCSD on appeal and as many of her classmates were going there she was happy. Instead of a lifelong love of the Bears (who she grew up rooting for, going to all the games) she has a lifelong love of surfing.

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stu
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In reply to calumnus • 5:52p, 3/22/23
calumnus said:
stu said:
BearGoggles said:
Of course it was a discussion, but if I pooped on one of the potential schools, that would be a pretty strong influence...
With my daughter, if one of her peers said something negative about a school that was a strong influence. If one of her peers had never heard of a school it was no longer under consideration.


Right? My daughter was offered an unsolicited scholarship to Tufts, but it was not one of the schools her hyper-competitive classmates (Mission San Jose in Fremont) had heard of, and the name "like tufts of hair?" people laughed at. I tried to convince her it was a great school (it would have been a really good fit) and we should at least fly to Boston to look, but the need to have the school approved by her peers was too much.

Cal was her dream school and she loved hanging out in Berkeley with her friends. She ended up getting into UCSD on appeal and as many of her classmates were going there she was happy. Instead of a lifelong love of the Bears (who she grew up rooting for, going to all the games) she has a lifelong love of surfing.
Safety first. You're more likely to drown in whatever you have to drink to get through a Cal basketball game than to drown while surfing.
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SFCityBear
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In reply to calumnus • 5:55p, 3/22/23
calumnus said:
Cal_79 said:
BearSD said:
socaltownie said:
AAR is definately a high risk/high reward kind of candidate. Kenn State acceptance rate is 83%. Similar to Boise (and Penn state for your next trivia night) it started as a 2 year CC and then about 20 years ago moved to a 4 year status.

I can not stress enough to any donor with juice just how DIFFERENT that is than Cal. I mean fundamentally different. While like a LOT of American Higher education (really Cal is the outlier), Kennesaw and Cal are fundamentally different places.

Now we think that because HIS BROTHER Graduated a dozen years ago with a Cal BS AAR might know Cal. That is unknown.

I understand (and approve of) the idea of trying to find an African American Coach given the lack of diversity in the Pac-12 coaching ranks. AAR could be a home run. But this is absolutely my marker to say "I told you so" if coach comes to cal and finds it ain't like running a sports program in the deep south at a school with an 83% acceptance rate.
Yes, if Cal hires AAR, I will root for him to succeed. But it would be an extremely risky move for a program that cannot afford this hire to end in a third consecutive dumpster fire.

One significant difference from the last two coaches, if it is AAR, is that AAR seems to actually be able to coach basketball.


One scary coincidence: both Mark Fox and Amir Abdur-Rahim started their college playing careers at Garden City Community College.
Where Abdur-Rahim started his college playing career is not scary at all. And must you continue to ridicule Mark Fox, now that he has been fired, to everyone's relief? Kicking a guy when he is down? You've spent at least 4 years trashing this guy on a daily basis. You won. We won. Let him go, please. You are much better than that. You are very good at analyzing styles of play, games, and metrics.

You've mentioned several times before that Mark Fox played his basketball at "Gardner Community College and Eastern New Mexico University", to ridicule Fox's playing career, I guess. At least now you are getting the name of the school right, "Garden City Community College" not "Gardner".

Garden City Community College has had a number of notable basketball personalities besides Fox and Abdul-Rahim play some of their basketball there:

1. Gene Keady played basketball, football, track and baseball. He went on to become a Basketball Hall of Fame Coach, with 25 years at Purdue, which included six Big 10 championships, 7 x Big 10 Coach of the Year, and 17 trips to the NCAA Tourney. Also important as the coach and mentor of our own Cunozo Martin, who brought some tough defense and decent recruiting to Cal basketball.

2. Darrin Hancock, Parade and McD All-American was named national Junior College Player of the Year. He then went on to Kansas and was a starter on their 1993 NCAA Final Four squad, and later played in the NBA.

3. Keith Smart, went on to play at Indiana, where he hit the game winning shot to defeat Syracuse in the 1987 NCCA Final, and was named Tournament MVP. Assistant Coach with several NBA teams, head coach of the Warriors for a season, and is now an assistant for Mussellman at Arkansas, I believe.

4. George Ackles, who went on to have a good career at UNLV, drafted by the NBA, and then played 11 years in various overseas pro leagues

5. Eric Griffin, also played 11 years overseas, now playing in the Israeli Premier League.

6. Geron Johnson, top 100 recruit, won a high school state title, transferred to Memphis, and now plays for a pro team in Lebanon.

7. John Keller won a gold medal at the 1952 Olympic Games, as a member of the USA basketball team.

Garden City also sent at least 10 players to the NFL. This is no chopped liver school as far as athletics is concerned.

You also mentioned Eastern New Mexico University several times in your critique of Mark Fox. Well, you don't have to go any farther away than the PAC12 to find an excellent coach who played his college basketball at a Junior College, and then transferred to Eastern New Mexico University, just like Mark Fox. And that would be Dana Altman, the Oregon Head Coach, who played for Fairsbury Junior College in Nebraska, before transferring to Eastern New Mexico to play basketball and get his degree.

This all goes to prove that the schools where you play your college basketball don't mean squat when it comes to learning the game and how to coach it. What is important is who your coaches were, who taught you the game, how to play it, and how to coach it.






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