The Worst Team In Power Conference History

7,913 Views | 52 Replies | Last: 5 yr ago by calbear80
calbear80
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CM was not a very good coach, but still:

CM >>> this guy.

. CM has won an average of over 10 conference games throughout his career as HC.

. This guy has won an average of one conference games in his career as HC.

. CM has won three conference games in a very tough SEC this year. Not good.

. This guy has won ZERO conference games in an extremely weak Pac-12 this year. Horrible.

Go Bears!
PtownBear1
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bearister said:

PtownBear1 said:

I don't get why so many people are blaming Martin for the current state of Cal basketball. It's 95% on the administration as far as I can see.

Martin went 62-39 at Cal and got us our highest NCAA seed in history. He got his job done. Meanwhile the Cal administration terminated Martin's assistant over unfounded allegations and subjected Martin to the same witch-hunt. Who wouldn't have left their employer after that for a $20 million offer elsewhere?

It's not Martin's fault the Cal admins didn't give a **** and didn't plan for contingencies when it was rumored Martin was leaving for weeks. It's also not Martin's fault that the Cal admins hired a completely unqualified replacement. Or that a 5 year contract was given to a high risk candidate.


Cuonzo is going to need your help on the Missouri Board after they terminate him and write him a fat payout check.
Ha, I don't care about the guy whatsoever. In fact, I love seeing job hoppers fail. I'm just saying I don't see him as the appropriate target of our anger over the current state of affairs.
calbear80
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calbear80
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bearister said:

Nice try. Cuonzo will crash and burn wherever he goes. We coached up my son's CYO team better than he coached the Bears.


Maybe true.
SFCityBear
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calbear80 said:

CM was not a very good coach, but still:

CM >>> this guy.

. CM has won an average of over 10 conference games throughout his career as HC.

. This guy has won an average of one conference games in his career as HC.

. CM has won three conference games in a very tough SEC this year. Not good.

. This guy has won ZERO conference games in an extremely weak Pac-12 this year. Horrible.

Go Bears!
I don't disagree, but your standard for what is good is very narrow, very selective. "Just win, baby" That is all it is for you

CM inherited much more and much better talent from Mike Montgomery than "This guy" inherited from CM. Wallace, Bird, Mathews, Kravish, Rooks, Singer. And Cal lost a really good shooter when Mathews transferred because of CM.

Montgomery did what you try do do when you retire and have some loyalty to your bosses and the school's fans - you try to leave the incoming coach with something to begin with for the future. Cuonzo left "this guy" with an average center, a slightly above average PF, and Don Coleman, who as a player was a time bomb ticking. It spelled disaster, and CM had to know it. CM had to know that "this guy's" rotation would have no CM players on it in year 2, and the disaster that ensued would not taint CM in any way.

"This guy" >>>>CM when it comes to being loyal to Cal and faithful to one's contract.

"This guy" has been faithful to his contract, and loyal to Cal. Except for the way he handled Winston and McCullough, he has been loyal to his players.

CM shafted his team. when he left for Missouri, shafted Cal fans, and shafted "This guy".

Take another tack. This one has flaws.

SFCityBear
Alkiadt
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calbear80 said:

CM was not a very good coach, but still:

CM >>> this guy.

. CM has won an average of over 10 conference games throughout his career as HC.

. This guy has won an average of one conference games in his career as HC.

. CM has won three conference games in a very tough SEC this year. Not good.

. This guy has won ZERO conference games in an extremely weak Pac-12 this year. Horrible.

Go Bears!


We all know that.
We also know that CM left Cal for $$$ Cal can't/wont pay.
So what's your point?

Write a check.
calbear80
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SFCityBear said:

calbear80 said:

CM was not a very good coach, but still:

CM >>> this guy.

. CM has won an average of over 10 conference games throughout his career as HC.

. This guy has won an average of one conference games in his career as HC.

. CM has won three conference games in a very tough SEC this year. Not good.

. This guy has won ZERO conference games in an extremely weak Pac-12 this year. Horrible.

Go Bears!
I don't disagree, but your standard for what is good is very narrow, very selective. "Just win, baby" That is all it is for you

CM inherited much more and much better talent from Mike Montgomery than "This guy" inherited from CM. Wallace, Bird, Mathews, Kravish, Rooks, Singer. And Cal lost a really good shooter when Mathews transferred because of CM.

Montgomery did what you try do do when you retire and have some loyalty to your bosses and the school's fans - you try to leave the incoming coach with something to begin with for the future. Cuonzo left "this guy" with an average center, a slightly above average PF, and Don Coleman, who as a player was a time bomb ticking. It spelled disaster, and CM had to know it. CM had to know that "this guy's" rotation would have no CM players on it in year 2, and the disaster that ensued would not taint CM in any way.

"This guy" >>>>CM when it comes to being loyal to Cal and faithful to one's contract.

"This guy" has been faithful to his contract, and loyal to Cal. Except for the way he handled Winston and McCullough, he has been loyal to his players.

CM shafted his team. when he left for Missouri, shafted Cal fans, and shafted "This guy".

Take another tack. This one has flaws.




0-14 this year and 22 consecutive loses to conference opponents (in the weakest major conference).

And counting.

Worst ever in the history of College BB according many national publication.

What other evidence do you need?

Go Bears!
HoopDreams
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how did this team end up with zero seniors on the roster?
i don't even think we have a senior walk-on

besides transfer Paris, we also only have 1 junior

so how did we get here?

Coleman would have been a senior if he didn't transfer, but that's probably addition by subtraction
Rabb and Brown would have been a seniors

Moore would had been a junior if he didn't transfer

One of my frustrations with CM was he could never 'cash in' on the Rabb/Brown class. We got a 4 seed, but with two veteran starters out the week/day of the NCAA we exited without a single win, and success in the NCAA is basically the only metric that matters

CM would continue to swing for the fences, and miss on questionable high recruits, rather than sign the quality recruits. That left us with imbalance

The good recruits that CM did sign (Moore and Baker) moved to different high profile teams

WK couldn't keep those two at Cal when the elite programs knocked, so we were left to scramble with grad transfers that could have worked, but fell apart with the winston/austin fiasco

This year would have been the perfect year to bring in a transfer. They could have joined the team as a junior or senior next year, restoring some class balance. We had the schollie space, but because the fiasco above, they were freed up too late

so here we are
calbear80
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If we had a good coach, we would not be in the current situation.
calbear80
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MiZery said:

CM has been sucking at Missouri this year too.

He has won three conference games. That is three more than us.

Go Bears!
SFCityBear
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calbear80 said:

If we had a good coach, we would not be in the current situation.
I think we probably would. It takes 3 years to turn a program around. Mike Montgomery said that. Most coaches who take over a new coaching job inherit a roster of with kid from each of the four classes. There are 13 scholarship players allowed. In a perfect situation, that might mean 3 seniors, 3 juniors, 3 sophs, and 3 freshmen, and maybe an open scholarship. That, on paper, is something to build on. Jones inherited 2 seniors, one junior, and 3 freshmen commits, including one who decommitted. He was one senior, 2 juniors, 3 sophs, and one freshman short of a full complement to have a halfway-decent first year from that perspective. Jones did a good job to retain Sueing and Anticevich, sign McNeill and point guard transfer who had to sit out a year, but lost Baker, and wasted two scholarships on Winston and McCullogh. It was a mixed bag, but most coaches don't land any recruits ion their first year, and Jones did.

With 13 scholarships most new coaches would inherit players distributed between the positions something like this: 4 Bigs, 5 Wiings, ,and 2 PGs, and two open scholarships. Wyking Jones inherited 2 Bigs, one wing, and no PGs.

No coach I know of ever inherited less, in sheer numbers, with less balance between positions and and less balance between classes than did Wyking Jones. Maybe there have been some who have, but I've not heard of them. .

I think Cuonzo knew that if he had stayed, he would have had the same roster deficiencies, and he was probably ready to jump at the chance to leave town rather than face a disastrous year with that roster. Oh, he might have retained Baker, which would have helped a bit. Maybe he could have talked Moore into staying, but I doubt it. Maybe even Rooks, but he would not have been of much help. And he would have left after one year. There were NO SOPHS, TWO FROSH, ONE JUNIOR, and TWO SENIORS on the roster, so for the second season there would be only Anticevich, Sueing, and Coleman inherited from Cuonzo, and then Coleman transferred, leaving an even bigger hole for Wyking than the first year. It just isn't realistic to think Jones or any other available coach could turn this program around in only 3 years. I think it will take 4 maybe 5 years to do it, when you are starting almost from scratch, and nearly all the players from day one will be your coach's own recruits. And that would be true for a veteran coach, who knows how to coach and maybe how to turn around a weak team. We don't know if Wyking knows how to do either.
SFCityBear
Bear19
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We'll finish with a very bad record, but perhaps it's time to revise the title of this thread?
Civil Bear
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Bear19 said:

We'll finish with a very bad record, but perhaps it's time to revise the title of this thread?

Agreed. By the eyeball test, that honor should be turned over to the Cougs.
Bearprof
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Cougs beat us once this year, beat Arizona and Arizona State in Arizona, and were minus three rotation players yesterday. They are not good, though they have performed better than we have. It was an enjoyable win, but those who think we are suddenly much better based on that need to see what happens in the next two games (and, if a miracle happens, beyond). Beating Washington state was something we always had a reasonable chance to do. On the other hand, beating Washington was the real treat/surprise! But on any given night in college basketball, flukey things happen, so let's not overinterpret a surprise win followed by one that was always attainable and was moreso on our home court with the competition hobbled by injuries.

Also, worth pointing out that If those two wins had happened in the first week, followed by 16 losses, I think the negativity would be huge. The narrative today is that we are improving, but I think we should base that evaluation on game performance analysis and not on the statistically weak premise that we've won a couple at the end of the season. And that game evaluation should take the competition into account.

As an example, the game yesterday featured McNeil driving successfully on numerous occasions, finishing while contested, something we've not seen much of earlier in the season. Has he suddenly improved in that respect, or was Wazzu's rim protection crappy? Someone with a keener eye than I should comment on that.


RedlessWardrobe
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Bearprof, you're right. McNeil with better finishes, Bradley with some really solid assists, Vanover better shot selection, even JHD more control on the offensive end.

These are the little things that happen when young guys get a little more experience, gain some confidence, and learn to play within themselves.

Thus I ask. Before these improvements, was their early play in reality what made WJ such a "bad coach?" Not sure, but you certainly have to wonder about it.
socaltownie
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bearister said:

PtownBear1 said:

I don't get why so many people are blaming Martin for the current state of Cal basketball. It's 95% on the administration as far as I can see.

Martin went 62-39 at Cal and got us our highest NCAA seed in history. He got his job done. Meanwhile the Cal administration terminated Martin's assistant over unfounded allegations and subjected Martin to the same witch-hunt. Who wouldn't have left their employer after that for a $20 million offer elsewhere?

It's not Martin's fault the Cal admins didn't give a **** and didn't plan for contingencies when it was rumored Martin was leaving for weeks. It's also not Martin's fault that the Cal admins hired a completely unqualified replacement. Or that a 5 year contract was given to a high risk candidate.


Cuonzo is going to need your help on the Missouri Board after they terminate him and write him a fat payout check.
Help in carrying the wheel barrel full of Mizzu's loot? Martin is doing JUST FINE by himself. What I haven't followed is whether there are injuries or circumstances impacting the record.

In other news, the anteaters (25-5) and montana (21-7) are both in first place in their conferences. Either Travis or Turner would make for a SIGNIFICANT upgrade and I sincerely believe that either of them would be well positioned to minimize transfers and could significant up recruiting.
Bearprof
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socaltownie said:

bearister said:

PtownBear1 said:

I don't get why so many people are blaming Martin for the current state of Cal basketball. It's 95% on the administration as far as I can see.

Martin went 62-39 at Cal and got us our highest NCAA seed in history. He got his job done. Meanwhile the Cal administration terminated Martin's assistant over unfounded allegations and subjected Martin to the same witch-hunt. Who wouldn't have left their employer after that for a $20 million offer elsewhere?

It's not Martin's fault the Cal admins didn't give a **** and didn't plan for contingencies when it was rumored Martin was leaving for weeks. It's also not Martin's fault that the Cal admins hired a completely unqualified replacement. Or that a 5 year contract was given to a high risk candidate.


Cuonzo is going to need your help on the Missouri Board after they terminate him and write him a fat payout check.
Help in carrying the wheel barrel full of Mizzu's loot? Martin is doing JUST FINE by himself. What I haven't followed is whether there are injuries or circumstances impacting the record.

In other news, the anteaters (25-5) and montana (21-7) are both in first place in their conferences. Either Travis or Turner would make for a SIGNIFICANT upgrade and I sincerely believe that either of them would be well positioned to minimize transfers and could significant up recruiting.
I agree with you on those coaching alternatives.
Cal8285
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Two wins really does mean we are not the worst power conference team in history. We're not even the worst of this century. Because of how we have played, quality of the conference, and a pretty horrific OOC season, we probably defeat the 17-18 team for worst team in Cal history unless we can pull off at least another win. But the good news is, now that we're at worst 2-16 and not 0-18, with a victory over the conference champs, we're not the worst power conference team in history. So let's shoot for at least one more win, if not two. Or 7.
calbear80
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Stadium Basketball Insider just named hiring this guy

One of the Worst Badketball Hired Of This Decade.

Go Bears!
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