Anarchistbear said:

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bearister said:

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Draymond Green is a dirty player and LeBron James is afraid of him.

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He dared to stop the King from dunking.

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It takes no skill to stop a dunk in that situation....as we all witnessed. This is how you block one:

You had to like the Oakland jerseys, no?

concordtom said:

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sycasey said:

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Warriors should have won that game, but got too sloppy after halftime and let the Lakers back into the game. Some rough calls against them at the end, but you have to expect that with the Lakers at home and not put yourselves in that position.

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Curry has had many moments of sloppy ball handling all year. It was frustrating and costly vs Lakers, but in truth not surprising.

I suppose if he focused on taking better care of the ball he also wouldn't have so many amazing buckets that he scores.

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Curry is getting double-teamed all the time, so some hurried turnovers are to be expected. I think Draymond's turnovers were more damaging in that third quarter.

concordtom said:

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The way defenses have hounded Curry this year is reminiscent of a hs or college team with one guy who is far deadlier than everyone else and coach doubles and face guards him all game.

What other pros have been treated similarly?

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Well, I think that's partly because Curry is BY FAR the best player on the Warriors. He might not get the same treatment if he was on a team with more talent.

As for a guy who got double teamed no matter what team he played on look to none other than Shaquille O'Neal. You could not just straight up play him one on one without fouling.

dimitrig said:

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concordtom said:

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The way defenses have hounded Curry this year is reminiscent of a hs or college team with one guy who is far deadlier than everyone else and coach doubles and face guards him all game.

What other pros have been treated similarly?

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Well, I think that's partly because Curry is BY FAR the best player on the Warriors. He might not get the same treatment if he was on a team with more talent.

As for a guy who got double teamed no matter what team he played on look to none other than Shaquille O'Neal. You could not just straight up play him one on one without fouling.

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Especially when the refs back then allowed him to pivot with his elbows out wide and clear a path to the hoop by clearing out your face.





I think when Shaq came into the league, that move had not really been seen/exploited yet.
But Shaq brought about those conversations and by the time Embiid came in, it was called a flagrant.

All that said, I agree with you - Shaq was a monster. A triple teamed monster.


I always am thinking up who would be on my top 8 alltime fantasy team, playing in today's rules.
Shaq might not get the calls today.
Shaq would miss FTs.
Shaq couldn't cover perimeter centers.

If you put Shaq on the floor with 4 3-pt shooters, the other team would just foul him, and his team would get 1 point per possession. I'm not sure how that would play out on the scoreboard and the foul tallies by the defending team, but who wants to see Shaq go 100 of 200 from the FT line?

Let's see what this guy says.

concordtom said:

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dimitrig said:

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concordtom said:

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The way defenses have hounded Curry this year is reminiscent of a hs or college team with one guy who is far deadlier than everyone else and coach doubles and face guards him all game.

What other pros have been treated similarly?

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Well, I think that's partly because Curry is BY FAR the best player on the Warriors. He might not get the same treatment if he was on a team with more talent.

As for a guy who got double teamed no matter what team he played on look to none other than Shaquille O'Neal. You could not just straight up play him one on one without fouling.

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Especially when the refs back then allowed him to pivot with his elbows out wide and clear a path to the hoop by clearing out your face.





I think when Shaq came into the league, that move had not really been seen/exploited yet.
But Shaq brought about those conversations and by the time Embiid came in, it was called a flagrant.

All that said, I agree with you - Shaq was a monster. A triple teamed monster.


I always am thinking up who would be on my top 8 alltime fantasy team, playing in today's rules.
Shaq might not get the calls today.
Shaq would miss FTs.
Shaq couldn't cover perimeter centers.

If you put Shaq on the floor with 4 3-pt shooters, the other team would just foul him, and his team would get 1 point per possession. I'm not sure how that would play out on the scoreboard and the foul tallies by the defending team, but who wants to see Shaq go 100 of 200 from the FT line?

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You only get so many fouls. Part of why Shaq was so great is that he got other players into foul trouble and his own team into the penalty so they got free throws even for non-shooting fouls.

concordtom said:

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You had to like the Oakland jerseys, no?

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Yeah, right. Nice fake placating move by a guy that has to have his financial obligations to Oakland dragged out of him by arbitrators, trial courts and appellate courts. F him and his jerseys.....and his combover (get a Bill Shatner toupee).....and his wife, how about getting that expensive face out of the phone and watching the game?



"He [Lacob] boasted that the Warriors are playing in a far more sophisticated fashion than the rest of the league. "We've crushed them on the basketball court, and we're going to for years because of the way we've built this team," he said. But what really set the franchise apart, he said, was the way it operated as a business. "We're light-years ahead of probably every other team in structure, in planning, in how we're going to go about things," he said. "We're going to be a handful for the rest of the N.B.A. to deal with for a long time."
-What Happened When Venture Capitalists Took Over the Golden State Warriors By Bruce Schoenfeld, NY Times, March 30, 2016

Warriors getting outshot from arc 43% to 29%.

bearister said:

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Warriors getting outshot from arc 43% to 29%.

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Tough time to have your worst shooting game of the year. No one besides Curry can make a three.

The San Francisco Warriors....with the Oakland center court decal and jerseys. SF fans bailing early. Nice.

Heh, well at least they were two very entertaining losses.

And I should give credit to Jordan Poole for being able to make shots too.

This team was too short-handed to make a deep run this year, but should be an interesting contender next year, assuming Klay is anything like his old self.

I think the W's definitely will need more than Klay. We are vastly understaffed inside and Wiseman doesn't project to be the guy in year2.

Draymond.... uhg!

I haven't yet looked at the box, but I think we needed more Poole and Wiggins down the stretch. They deferred a bit too much to Dray and Steph running the show. Steph was overly defended all game and Dray will provide scant points.

Interesting that Bazemore was on the bench in favor of JTA. Rather, it was JTA in favor of Looney, and Poole in favor of Bazemore.

With any luck, the Minnesota pick conveys this year and the warriors get some help with the #4/5 pick.

I expect oubre is gone, but poole and jta made huge leaps this season.

Roster I'd like to see next year

STARTERS:
Curry
Klay
Wiggins
Draymond
Vet center pickup

BENCH ORDER:
Poole
Wiseman
Rookie
Looney

DEPTH:
Paschal
Bazemore
JTA
Lee
Rookie

Dropped: Mannion, Smiley, Mulder, Bell, Payton Jr.

I realize there's no trading Draymond, but if he got injured, I'd be interested in seeing what they could do with his spot. Would require another free agent pickup.

I dunno... I'm not seeing a quick fix. But maybe Klay will be the key.

Tankathon simulator shows we should not expect any high draft pick.

concordtom said:

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I think the W's definitely will need more than Klay. We are vastly understaffed inside and Wiseman doesn't project to be the guy in year2.

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If Wiseman develops he could be a contributor next season, and it's also likely they get another decent draft pick (around 7), unless Minnesota gets lucky in the lottery.

And Klay means a ton. Just one guy the defense fears opposite Steph clears out a lot of space on offense.

Draymond and Wiggins were dog****, Curry was average ( for him). Everyone else non factors. The fact they were in this game with all those turnovers basically says Memphis squandered what should have been a 10 point win

wraptor347 said:

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With any luck, the Minnesota pick conveys this year and the warriors get some help with the #4/5 pick.

I expect oubre is gone, but poole and jta made huge leaps this season.

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I expect Oubre to be gone, but I expect them to try and do a sign and trade so they can keep his salary slot (trade exception). The only way they can do that is if they can sign and trade for draft pick compensation. Can't take back any players or they will be hard capped. It'll be tricky.

sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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I think the W's definitely will need more than Klay. We are vastly understaffed inside and Wiseman doesn't project to be the guy in year2.

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If Wiseman develops he could be a contributor next season, and it's also likely they get another decent draft pick (around 7), unless Minnesota gets lucky in the lottery.

And Klay means a ton. Just one guy the defense fears opposite Steph clears out a lot of space on offense.

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The sad truth is that the W's would have been a 5 or 6 seed had they not F'd around the first part of the season trying to tutor Wiseman.

It'll be interesting to see if he can get up to speed quickly. I fear not, while recognizing he could be great.

Klay could be great, too. Or become an immobile liability. Knee and Achilles? On the shelf for two years? It's asking a lot!

philbert said:

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wraptor347 said:

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With any luck, the Minnesota pick conveys this year and the warriors get some help with the #4/5 pick.

I expect oubre is gone, but poole and jta made huge leaps this season.

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I expect Oubre to be gone, but I expect them to try and do a sign and trade so they can keep his salary slot (trade exception). The only way they can do that is if they can sign and trade for draft pick compensation. Can't take back any players or they will be hard capped. It'll be tricky.

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Good call
I knew I was missing someone.
Yeah, Oubre is very gone. They simply cannot afford him. Great athlete, love his defense, and he was coming along with the offensive flow, but he otherwise didn't fit the pace and the shooting that the Warriors need.

concordtom said:

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sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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I think the W's definitely will need more than Klay. We are vastly understaffed inside and Wiseman doesn't project to be the guy in year2.

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If Wiseman develops he could be a contributor next season, and it's also likely they get another decent draft pick (around 7), unless Minnesota gets lucky in the lottery.

And Klay means a ton. Just one guy the defense fears opposite Steph clears out a lot of space on offense.

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The sad truth is that the W's would have been a 5 or 6 seed had they not F'd around the first part of the season trying to tutor Wiseman.

It'll be interesting to see if he can get up to speed quickly. I fear not, while recognizing he could be great.

Klay could be great, too. Or become an immobile liability. Knee and Achilles? On the shelf for two years? It's asking a lot!

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If Klay is bad then they're not a contender. If he's something close to what he used to be, they probably are. He doesn't even have to be amazing, just a legitimately scary shooter to take the pressure off Steph. Assuming he's physically healthy enough, I'm not worried about the missed time. He's been around and knows what to do.

Set shooting should be unaffected. But he'll need his wheels to defend. (Klay)

Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

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and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

Did anyone else see Wiggins standing there, just waiting to be the hero?

At another moment or three, Poole could have hit big shots - yet hesitated because everyone knows this is Curry's time.

These things are not just on Green and Curry - they are also an indictment on Kerr, who in other games has given those players the green light. In this ultimate test, however, the old guys stuck with their championship pedigree, and went down in flames. I hope that's not a harbinger to come for next year. The Warriors need some new athletic kid to do the paint slashing - let Curry and Thompson relax outside, and let Green man the bench in crunch time when a basket is needed, because that man can't shoot.

concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

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and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

Did anyone else see Wiggins standing there, just waiting to be the hero?

At another moment or three, Poole could have hit big shots - yet hesitated because everyone knows this is Curry's time.

These things are not just on Green and Curry - they are also an indictment on Kerr, who in other games has given those players the green light. In this ultimate test, however, the old guys stuck with their championship pedigree, and went down in flames. I hope that's not a harbinger to come for next year. The Warriors need some new athletic kid to do the paint slashing - let Curry and Thompson relax outside, and let Green man the bench in crunch time when a basket is needed, because that man can't shoot.

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Kerr taking a three from the bench would be a better chance than Green or Wiggins

concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

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and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

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I don't think there was enough time for Green to make that pass and for Wiggins to shoot it.

sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

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and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

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I don't think there was enough time for Green to make that pass and for Wiggins to shoot it.

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Yeah, it woulda been tight. Tough to see him since his head is turned to catch the ball from Steph.

pic.twitter.com/rzzCguapc4

— Ralph Wiggum (@RalphWStats) May 22, 2021

philbert said:

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sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

---

and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

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I don't think there was enough time for Green to make that pass and for Wiggins to shoot it.

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Yeah, it woulda been tight. Tough to see him since his head is turned to catch the ball from Steph.

pic.twitter.com/rzzCguapc4

— Ralph Wiggum (@RalphWStats) May 22, 2021

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Looked like Green had time to set up a screen to free Curry from the double team.

sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

---

and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

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I don't think there was enough time for Green to make that pass and for Wiggins to shoot it.

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There was.
But upon watching this replay, I see that Wiggins' defender didn't crash as hard to Draymond off Wiggins as I had initially thought. Wiggins would have had a hand in his face for sure.
Still, this place was poorly executed.
And, in Draymond's defense, he was calling for the ball from Curry a lot sooner, which would have given him more time to make a play.
Instead, he seemed to panic and put up a crappy shot.
So, I feel a little less judgmental toward him. Still, he blew it big time. Oh well - it's better off for the warriors to have lost, rest up, get a pick 3 places higher in the draft. They weren't going to go far in these playoffs, and the flame out will force the management to make better decisions in the offseason rather than think ONLY KLAY is all that's needed.

Stanford Jonah said:

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concordtom said:

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I think the W's definitely will need more than Klay. We are vastly understaffed inside and Wiseman doesn't project to be the guy in year2.

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That guy is gonna make you look so stupid. And you really don't need any more help on that end.

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It would be great to be wrong here.

concordtom said:

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sycasey said:

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concordtom said:

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Just read this

Quote:

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For the last decade, the Warriors have seemed to always have the goods to figure it out. But Friday evening felt different. The Warriors were gassed down the stretch and couldn't simply turn to a Death Lineup or a Hamptons 5 to blow away the opponent in a late-game situation. Instead, it was Memphis's young core who had all the answers. Morant, all of 21 years old, was the one hitting timely contested shots with the game on the line, while Green, one of the league's smartest players, airballed a layup that would've won the game.

---

and it reminded me that on that last drive of Green's - rather than putting up that lamely missed shot that looked like some uncertain high school kid driving the lane for the first time, he should have simply pivoted around to his left and given the ball to Wiggins at the 3 for the game winner.

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I don't think there was enough time for Green to make that pass and for Wiggins to shoot it.

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There was.
But upon watching this replay, I see that Wiggins' defender didn't crash as hard to Draymond off Wiggins as I had initially thought. Wiggins would have had a hand in his face for sure.
Still, this place was poorly executed.
And, in Draymond's defense, he was calling for the ball from Curry a lot sooner, which would have given him more time to make a play.
Instead, he seemed to panic and put up a crappy shot.
So, I feel a little less judgmental toward him. Still, he blew it big time. Oh well - it's better off for the warriors to have lost, rest up, get a pick 3 places higher in the draft. They weren't going to go far in these playoffs, and the flame out will force the management to make better decisions in the offseason rather than think ONLY KLAY is all that's needed.

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Yeah, the replay also shows that the perimeter defenders are not crashing on Draymond. They are staying connected to the outside shooters because they know Dray is not a scorer. If anything his best option might have been to bull into the defender under the basket and try to make a layup or draw a foul.

Curry took too long to get the play going, too.