Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination.

I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak). And of course the numerous other relevant data points regarding Putin's views about an independent Ukraine, his corruption and control of the puppet Yanukovytch government, his installation of other neighboring puppet governments etc. Only an incredibly naive person would fall for Putin88's ridiculous posture toward Putin and Russia, and you aren't even close to that naive. You just hate to agree with the obvious correct position.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? That is why you argue against peace? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

---

Odd, because I thought I saw it when I was deleting words from a reply quote and I have only been talking to you. I stand by everything else I have said. There are no lengths you won't go to to support what you think is the right side. You are a lying snake. "Who like you is Pro-Putin or questioning who to support." Crap like that is why I avoided your paragraphs of lies. Partisan jerk.

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

---

Odd, because I thought I saw it when I was deleting words from a reply quote and I have only been talking to you. I stand by everything else I have said. There are no lengths you won't go to to support what you think is the right side. You are a lying snake. "Who like you is Pro-Putin or questioning who to support." Crap like that is why I avoided your paragraphs of lies. Partisan jerk.

---

"Stop the personal attacks. I won't respond to your poor behavior. You can disagree with someone without behaving like this."

World would be a better place if you put me on ignore and didn't respond to my posts because it would mean fewer posts by you and especially fewer posts where you bizarrely and repeatedly accuse me of saying things that someone else said which I never even read or responded to.

Unit2Sucks said:

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oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

---

Odd, because I thought I saw it when I was deleting words from a reply quote and I have only been talking to you. I stand by everything else I have said. There are no lengths you won't go to to support what you think is the right side. You are a lying snake. "Who like you is Pro-Putin or questioning who to support." Crap like that is why I avoided your paragraphs of lies. Partisan jerk.

---

"Stop the personal attacks. I won't respond to your poor behavior. You can disagree with someone without behaving like this."

World would be a better place if you put me on ignore and didn't respond to my posts because it would mean fewer posts by you and especially fewer posts where you bizarrely and repeatedly accuse me of saying things that someone else said which I never even read or responded to.

---

Your writing is a personal attack. You spend paragraphs putting people down and labeling someone a certain way because you disagree with them. Get some self awareness. "The world would be a better place if you put me on ignore." You are a Jerk.

oski003 said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

---

Odd, because I thought I saw it when I was deleting words from a reply quote and I have only been talking to you. I stand by everything else I have said. There are no lengths you won't go to to support what you think is the right side. You are a lying snake. "Who like you is Pro-Putin or questioning who to support." Crap like that is why I avoided your paragraphs of lies. Partisan jerk.

---

"Stop the personal attacks. I won't respond to your poor behavior. You can disagree with someone without behaving like this."

World would be a better place if you put me on ignore and didn't respond to my posts because it would mean fewer posts by you and especially fewer posts where you bizarrely and repeatedly accuse me of saying things that someone else said which I never even read or responded to.

---

Your writing is a personal attack. You spend paragraphs putting people down and labeling someone a certain way because you disagree with them. Get some self awareness. "The world would be a better place if you put me on ignore." You are a Jerk.

---

Watching you pull the snowflake act over and over again is somewhat amusing but it's getting rather repetitive. It's a grown up world and people are going to disagree with you.

Unit2Sucks said:

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oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

movielover said:

---

And what happens to the Ukrainian birth rate when this finally ends? Does the Church have to allow bigamy to build back their population?

---

Not that you seem to have any compassion for anyone, but Russia has been abducting Ukrainian children (the ones that it hasn't killed through indiscriminate shelling) to help offset it's massive demographic problems. In addition to Russia's low birth rate due to it being a sh(thole country with a deteriorating economy and a fascist government, Russia has experienced incredible brain drain, both before and after their heinous invasion. There have been plenty of stories about both the child abductions and Russia's demographic problems but you may not be familiar due to your reliance on a combination of pro-Russian media, shills and outright fake news.

Of course, Ukraine also has demographic problems including a low birth rate and brain drain. The continued corruptin and meddling from Russia over the decades has taken its toll, even if it hasn't delivered the results that Putin and Manafort (Donald Trump's felon former campaign manager and Reagan disciple) were hoping for.

I don't expect any of this information to change your views on anything, to help you learn anything or to getnerate any sort of compassion for the many victims of the war that you increasingly cheerlead for, but it is what it is.

Do you ever share your views with your fellow aggies or do you save your love of fascist driven war for us?

---

To be fair, he, like others, is advocating for the war to end. You, the warmonger, seem to be the one with no compassion for others. Your childlike response, is "It is Putin's fault there is no peace. There is no culpability on Ukraine or Nato's part to concede anything and make peace because Putin could just stop invading!". Of course it is more nuanced than that, but you consistently spout childlike black or white, us or them views. Life is more complicated. If everyone here could wave a magic wand and Russia immediately retreats, everyone here would.

---

It's incredibly naive to pretend that someone arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms is somehow more in favor of peace than someone arguing that Ukraine is entitled to its sovereignty.

---

Since I don't see anyone here arguing for the war to end on Putin's terms, I didn't read the rest of your post. It would be a waste of time since you are already being disingenuous in the first sentence. I did catch the phrase knuckle-draggers when deleting your reply from my quote. Nice imagery. What are Putin's terms, anyway? Aren't you the person who said Putin will not stop until he controls Ukraine?

---

I didn't use the phrase knuckle draggers, but I'm not surprised to see you swinging at windmills. Although your perspective here isn't as bad as the pro-Putin shills, your faux objectivist contrarian schtick doesn't seem to impart any helpful perspective or insight. You are a generic content free contrarian.

As for Putin's terms for peace, I've never claimed there are any. I don't believe he has any interest in a peace treaty nor does he have any interest in allowing Ukraine to remain independent. He might have an interest in a temporary cease fire to lick his wounds, but he's not looking for a permanent peace with Ukraine as a peer sovereign nation. He's made it pretty clear that he doesn't think the Ukrainian people have a right to exist, let alone a right to self-determination. I am merely acknowledging the simple default position and would suggest that anyone who thinks that Putin is a "reasonable" person who is willing to live and let live would have to answer to the fact that he turned down Biden's offer off appeasement (for which conservatives criticized ide. For being weak).

---

But you just said you were arguing with people advocating for the war to end on Putin's terms. Now it seems you are saying peace is Putin's terms because he will just use peace to regroup? Mean what you say and say what you mean. Stop talking in tongues. By the way, I clearly saw the word knuckle-draggers in your reply, and I posted such. You are the one swinging at windmills.

---

Show us the quote you are referring to. As for the rest of your response, it's not that complicated. Putin has no interest in a lasting peace with an independent Ukraine. He might agree to a temporary one to lick his wounds before attacking again with the same goal he has now - to eliminate the state of Ukraine.

You obviously are struggling to understand what's going on in this thread so maybe you can find someone to explain everything to you.

---

"from knuckle-draggers in the dark recesses of the Kremlin". Control F is your friend. You obviously are struggling to understand what is going on, so I am glad I can help you recollect something you typed / pasted today.

---

Thank you for specifically referring to the quote so that I could search for it. Since I knew it wasn't from me, i never had a doubt that you were mistaken. The quote you are referring to is from another misguided poster in this thread who like you is pro-Putin or at least questioning who to support.

Thank you for once again confirming you aren't on the level and even when given multiple opportunities to correct the yourself still find time to remain wrong and defiantly so.

It's nice to see you continuing to self-own so spectacularly even while engaged in your low energy trolling and repetitive reflexive "jerk store" level comebacks. You are always good for a laugh.

---

Odd, because I thought I saw it when I was deleting words from a reply quote and I have only been talking to you. I stand by everything else I have said. There are no lengths you won't go to to support what you think is the right side. You are a lying snake. "Who like you is Pro-Putin or questioning who to support." Crap like that is why I avoided your paragraphs of lies. Partisan jerk.

---

"Stop the personal attacks. I won't respond to your poor behavior. You can disagree with someone without behaving like this."

World would be a better place if you put me on ignore and didn't respond to my posts because it would mean fewer posts by you and especially fewer posts where you bizarrely and repeatedly accuse me of saying things that someone else said which I never even read or responded to.

---

Your writing is a personal attack. You spend paragraphs putting people down and labeling someone a certain way because you disagree with them. Get some self awareness. "The world would be a better place if you put me on ignore." You are a Jerk.

---

"Stop the personal attacks. I won't respond to your poor behavior. You can disagree with someone without behaving like this."

I'm finally taking my own advice and putting you on ignore everywhere as opposed to just ignoring your antivax thread. You aren't entertaining or thought provoking enough to earn my attention.

---

That is certainly your prerogative. I may still reply to you when you passive aggressively rip on people you disagree with. It is tough to sit idly when you post with such hatred.

Do they have an assigned peace negotiator?

Russia - Yes
Ukraine - the individual was assassinated
America / NATO - No

The neocons aren’t going to be happy until we’re in WWIII. https://t.co/l4eGo7tuww

— Catturd ™ (@catturd2) January 28, 2023

That map above is about right, this is where this conflict is headed, although the conquest of Nikolayev and Odessa will be more of a challenge given that Russia doesn`t have a foothold on the right bank of the Dniepr.

Russia will start making big territorial gains once they apply their numeric advantage, which is steadily increasing given the ongoing 8 to 1 loss rate advantage they have been enjoying in this war of attrition. The current Ukrainian total casualty figure is around 450,000 KIA, MIA and wounded. As this total grows into the high 6 figures, two things will happen, the Zelensky regime will start fraying, and the Ukrainian army will no longer be able to hold back Russian advances.

This is why this war is so futile and destructive, there is no military solution for Ukraine.

The other aspect that this tweet misses is that Ukrainian industry already is in the hands of local oligarchs, who amassed their conglomerate of state-owned assets by strong-arming boards, local authorities and rival gangs using far-right militias. You should look into the background of people like Kolomoisky, Dnipro oligarch who launched the political career of comedian Vladimir Zelensky.

Quote:

---

Before becoming part of Ukraine's armed forces, who funded Azov?

The unit received backing from Ukraine's interior minister in 2014, as the government had recognised its own military was too weak to fight off the pro-Russian separatists and relied on paramilitary volunteer forces.

These forces were privately funded by oligarchs the most known being Igor Kolomoisky, an energy magnate billionaire and then-governor of the Dnipropetrovska region.
In addition to Azov, Kolomoisky funded other volunteer battalions such as the Dnipro 1 and Dnipro 2, Aidar and Donbas units.

Azov received early funding and assistance from another oligarch: Serhiy Taruta, the billionaire governor of Donetsk region.

---

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/1/who-are-the-azov-regiment

Quote:

---

It's never good news for the rule of law when an oligarch sends armed men in combat fatigues to occupy a state-owned oil company. That's what just happened in Ukraine, where billionaire oligarch Igor Kolomoisky appears to have sent members of his private army last week to temporarily take over the offices of oil company UkrTransNafta in order to protect his financial interests in the company.

The situation may be even more frightening than it sounds.

Kolomoisky funds and directs a large private militia that has been helping the Kiev government fight against the pro-Russian separatists in eastern Ukraine. Militias like his and there are dozens of them are a source of deep concern to analysts who believe they could threaten Ukraine's long-term stability.

Are these private armies willing to follow Kiev's orders without question? Or will they go their own way when their own interests are at stake? Kolomoisky's antics at the oil company's offices, in which he appears to have used his private army to protect his personal financial interests, look an awful lot like the latter.

---

Quote:

---

Adrian Karatnycky, a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council, warned during an interview in February that simply by existing, those private armies could be "creating enough of an implicit threat that the government can't move against, say, corrupt schemes." The events in Ukraine last week suggest his concerns were well-placed.

---

https://www.vox.com/2015/3/23/8279397/kolomoisky-oligarch-ukraine-militia

It`s amazing how the MSM pre-war coverage was more accurate, pieces like this paragraph in that Vox articles on Ukrainian militia atrocities agianst the people of the Donbass would NEVER get published today:

Quote:

---

These groups pose a serious threat to Ukrainian civilians, as well. In December, pro-Kiev militias blocked humanitarian aid from reaching rebel-held areas of eastern Ukraine. Amnesty International researcher Denis Krivosheev said the militias were using starvation of civilians as a weapon, and called the tactic a war crime.

Another militia, the Aydar Battalion, has kidnapped and tortured civilians on dozens of occasions, according to Amnesty. Local police told the human rights group they had registered more than 38 criminal cases against Aydar members but lacked the power to take any further action against the fighters a worrying sign of the militias' power.

As time goes on, the things that made the militias useful for Ukraine will also make them dangerous. Their strength and autonomy in eastern Ukraine, particularly compared with the relatively weak government, could potentially give them tremendous power there. These are the conditions for warlordism for militias turning their pieces of territory into little fiefdoms that they or their wealthy patrons would be free to govern, or exploit, as they wished.

---

This passage gives you the real picture of the civil war that has been raging in the Donbass since 2014, and why the local rebellion, which has mobilized the local population against the Kiev militias has been so strong.

For a newcomer, it's complicated. But clearly, many saw the redline of Ukraine joining NATO - going back decades. But they couldn't help themselves.

How did ethnic Russians in the Donbas survive? I gather local militias.

Colonel Douglass McGregor believes we've lost the institutional knowledge of what war is, and how ghastly it is. The hubris of the West / US / NATO to not even have a designated negotiator.

BTW, Lloyd Austin worked for ... Raytheon ($2.7 Million compensation). And why does a General have a (useless) MBA and an education background. Wikipedia: "He also operates a consulting firm and has been a partner at Pine Island Capital, an investment company with which Secretary of State Antony Blinken and Michle Flournoy are affiliated." He sometimes refers to himself in the third person.

"Russian propagandist" Scott Ritter says Ryssia will now have over 300,000 troops ready, plus an overall war machine of 600,000 now ready to go.

Where do you get your 8-to-1 ratio? (Source?)

It's really so predictable. Unit2 or someone makes a telling point about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and very quickly Cal88 responds with several LONG wall of text posts that seems intended to push the telling point way up thread where it'll be less noticed.

Eastern Oregon Bear said:

---

It's really so predictable. Unit2 or someone makes a telling point about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and very quickly Cal88 responds with several LONG wall of text posts that seems intended to push the telling point way up thread where it'll be less noticed.

---

Bingo.

Eastern Oregon Bear said:

---

It's really so predictable. Unit2 or someone makes a telling point about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and very quickly Cal88 responds with several LONG wall of text posts that seems intended to push the telling point way up thread where it'll be less noticed.

---

Better to just ignore, as I do. I wasn't surprised by your message because it is 100% consistent with the Russian "firehose of falsehood" propaganda model.

Here's a primer. Nothing particularly earth shattering here, but just wanted to share that it's not unique to our little watering hole. What we have are either devoted propagandists or people who are useful idiots advancing the agenda exactly the way Putin and the Kremlin would prefer.

Quote:

---

We characterize the contemporary Russian model for propaganda as "the firehose of falsehood" because of two of its distinctive features: high numbers of channels and messages and a shameless willingness to disseminate partial truths or outright fictions. In the words of one observer, "[N]ew Russian propaganda entertains, confuses and overwhelms the audience."

Contemporary Russian propaganda has at least two other distinctive features. It is also rapid, continuous, and repetitive, and it lacks commitment to consistency.

Interestingly, several of these features run directly counter to the conventional wisdom on effective influence and communication from government or defense sources, which traditionally emphasize the importance of truth, credibility, and the avoidance of contradiction. Despite ignoring these traditional principles, Russia seems to have enjoyed some success under its contemporary propaganda model, either through more direct persuasion and influence or by engaging in obfuscation, confusion, and the disruption or diminution of truthful reporting and messaging.

---

Eastern Oregon Bear said:

---

It's really so predictable. Unit2 or someone makes a telling point about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and very quickly Cal88 responds with several LONG wall of text posts that seems intended to push the telling point way up thread where it'll be less noticed.

---

Love the sour grapes, you`re just too much.

U2Sucks claims that Russia intends to take over Ukraine`s economy putting oligarchs in control, introducing oligarchy into Ukraine, which is kind of a ridiculous statement because Ukraine already has the worst kind of kingpin-warlord oligarchy in Europe, for many decades now, far worse than in present day Russia, which used to be similar in the type of corruption they had in the 1990s before Putin ended the reign of the oligarchs in the 00s, reclaiming and nationalizing most natural resources.

I could have made a short statement to that effect, but that post would have been panned and derided as "Kremlin propaganda", so I backed my argument with two credible sources (Vox and Aljazeera) showing the extent of oligarchal corruption in Ukraine (and btw that corruption was homegrown Ukraine, not supported by Russia).

And now you throw your arms up in a collective pout saying my posts are too long! That is really pathetic.

The truth is that you are rather poorly informed on so many aspects about Ukraine, from its culture of corruption, to the brand of supremacist nationalism that has prevailed there the last decade, to just about anything related to the history and course of the conflict.

I don`t think you guys even knew who Bandera even was, if it weren`t for my presentations. In the gullible space you occupy, Ukraine has only 9,000 deaths (official Ukrainian figures they were trotting only a month ago) and not 150,000+ KIA/MIAs, and men in Ukraine are lining up to volunteer, Russia is failing badly. Ukraine has captured 5,000 Russian tanks (but need a couple hundred more from Germany to chase down the Russian into Crimea and beyond).

Sorry to pop your bubble on all these points. And the reason you can`t refute my arguments is not about the length of my posts, because I am vastly outnumbered here by the Zelensky fans, yet still managed to hold my ground. It is because your knowledge of the situation is pretty limited, and your sources amount mostly to wartime propaganda that you have a hard time filtering out, and that are easy for me to refute.

So put up or shut up, the whining is pathetic.

Cal88 said:

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Eastern Oregon Bear said:

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It's really so predictable. Unit2 or someone makes a telling point about Russia's invasion of Ukraine and very quickly Cal88 responds with several LONG wall of text posts that seems intended to push the telling point way up thread where it'll be less noticed.

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Love the sour grapes, you`re just too much.

U2Sucks claims that Russia intends to take over Ukraine`s economy putting oligarchs in control, introducing oligarchy into Ukraine, which is kind of a ridiculous statement because Ukraine already has the worst kind of kingpin-warlord oligarchy in Europe, for many decades now, far worse than in present day Russia, which used to be similar in the type of corruption they had in the 1990s before Putin ended the reign of the oligarchs in the 00s, reclaiming and nationalizing most natural resources.

I could have made a short statement to that effect, but that post would have been panned and derided as "Kremlin propaganda", so I backed my argument with two credible sources (Vox and Aljazeera) showing the extent of oligarchal corruption in Ukraine (and btw that corruption was homegrown Ukraine, not supported by Russia).

And now you throw your arms up in a collective pout saying my posts are too long! That is really pathetic.

The truth is that you are rather poorly informed on so many aspects about Ukraine, from its culture of corruption, to the brand of supremacist nationalism that has prevailed there the last decade, to just about anything related to the history and course of the conflict.

I don`t think you guys even knew who Bandera even was, if it weren`t for my presentations. In the gullible space you occupy, Ukraine has only 9,000 deaths (official Ukrainian figures they were trotting only a month ago) and not 150,000+ KIA/MIAs, and men in Ukraine are lining up to volunteer, Russia is failing badly. Ukraine has captured 5,000 Russian tanks (but need a couple hundred more from Germany to chase down the Russian into Crimea and beyond).

Sorry to pop your bubble on all these points. And the reason you can`t refute my arguments is not about the length of my posts, because I am vastly outnumbered here by the Zelensky fans, yet still managed to hold my ground. It is because your knowledge of the situation is pretty limited, and your sources amount mostly to wartime propaganda that you have a hard time filtering out, and that are easy for me to refute.

So put up or shut up, the whining is pathetic.

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What I got from your wall of text (the previous wall of text, not the wall of text I'm replying to here) is that you're OK with the Ukrainian economy being controlled and run for the benefit of oligarchs as long as they are Russian oligarchs and not Ukrainian oligarchs. Sorry, but I don't find that a compelling reason for supporting a war. I don't have much love for either the Ukrainian or the Russian governments, but the Russians are clearly the ones behaving the worst in this situation.

WSJ admits Bahkmut almost cut off. Only one supply route open. Germany says B lost. Despite US telling Ukraine to pull out, it fights on.



[Propagandist]

Big C said:

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This war -- heck, this thread -- is a good case study on how to look at information from both sides, identify what is largely propaganda and try and search for the truth. I am clearly on Ukraine's side in this, but if you look at every war the US has been in in my lifetime (Cold War, Vietnam, Kuwait, Afghanistan, Iraq and now this), there has always been pro-war propaganda, which we want to believe because we want to believe in our country.

Same for the Rooskies living in Russia, which is why many of them probably support Putin and the war (strongly doubt it is anything close to 80%). Their propaganda is often just more obvious and ham-handed (maybe not so much when they try and interfere with our elections).

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There is every reason to be skeptical of the official accounts coming from Russia, Ukraine and the US. They are all done with a purpose.

However, there is an absolute concerted attempt by the pro-Russian faction to go above and beyond even Kremlin propaganda to present a counterfactual view of the war. Rather than listening to those pro-Kremlin outsiders, you might, for example, choose to listen to what someone in the know in Russia might think.

Today, Rutzkoy (long-retired former Russia VP) dropped a pretty interesting interview on the world.

Aleksandr Rutskoy, ex vice-president of Russia, Major General of aviation, said he doesn't see a military victory for the Russian army.

He said that the army was led by incompetent people. pic.twitter.com/5msL5D5uDN

— Anton Gerashchenko (@Gerashchenko_en) January 30, 2023

In it, he criticized the Russian military, the "special military operation", and Putin among others. I'm sure someone here will decry him as a RINO (Russian In Name Only) or some sort of disgruntled former politician or what have you but why would you choose to believe them over him? Here's a partial transcript. Much of this is obviously verifiable. Think back on how many times the pro-Kremlin crowd spewed the ridiculous agitprop pretending that this war had something to do with denazification and yet also claiming that this war was a result of NATO encroachment, no wait it's actually a result of a violation of Minsk, no wait it's actually because Zelensky is corrupt, no wait it's actually some other made up reason. It's all a bunch of contradictory nonsense because the only thing tying it together is Russia's desire to deceive.

It's actually quite simple. Acknowledging that Putin is wrong is a litmus test, just as acknowledging Hitler was wrong was a litmus test for WWII. Sure, Putin may not be as bad as Hitler, but he's uniquely responsible for this war and we have no reason to pretend like there is a reasonable conversation to have with people who disagree. It's really that simple.

Quote:

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You need a proper army to conduct this kind of military operation. If your army is unable to conduct strategic offensive, it's better not to get into it. Especially in another country.

They even invented these definitions: denazification and demilitarization, about which they've already forgotten now.

Everything that happens today is explained by the fact that our armed forces are unable to conduct strategic offensives. For the past 22 years our armed forces have been headed by people who didn't serve in the army. Again, for almost a quarter of a century the armed forces have been headed by absolutely incompetent people.

What can happen in this case?

Here is the result. How many top senior MOD officials can I name with a classic military education? Zero, not a single person. Our Minister of Defense did not serve in the army, he has no military education. Five of his deputies did not serve at all. What kind of MOD is that?

So what can be said about this military operation? It's a tragedy for our country. It's a tragedy because people are dying. For no reason. Sure, there are signs everywhere: "We are defending Russia!" WHERE are they defending Russia? In whose name are they dying? When people are dying aimlessly, it's a tragedy. Can you find me a single army unit today without killed or wounded? How many of whose wounded would become permanently disabled? And those are young guys with their whole life ahead of them. Why were fathers taken from children? Why were sons taken from mothers and fathers? No one had the right to do so.

That is the result of thoughtlessness and incompetence."

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So we can spend our time quibbling over minor inconsistencies or hyperbole from people who are invested in defending sovereignty or we can allow the ghouls who cheerlead for Putin to take over the conversation by engaging with their disingenuous bad-faith propaganda. I choose to focus on having a conversation in good faith with those who are willing and to continue to ignore anyone who supports Putin. Full stop. No one, and I mean no one, has ever presented a position which supports what Putin is doing. I skiied with a Russian buddy this weekend and we had a good laugh about all of the ridiculous claims that Putin apologists have made. This is a pretty simple one - Putin is bad, everyone else is less bad. It's really not that different from WWII in that respect. There were a lot of axxholes on all sides, but Hitler was the worst. Anyone who was defending Hitler back then in any respect was wrong and anyone defending Putin now is wrong. It's okay to acknowledge that and ignore them entirely.

Wall Street Journal: Russia Tightens Grip Around Bakhmut as Ukraine Awaits Western Tanks

"Ukrainian troops say Russia has numerical advantage as its invasion forces try to surround eastern city"

CNN: 321 new tanks committed to Ukraine. (Their General asked for 300 tanks in his seminal Economist interview.)

Unit2Sucks & Cohort - take note of an adult, non-snark post. It is possible.

Long day at work, but just wanted to share a good article I came across early this morning:

Wasted tanks, wasted time in Ukraine
Inept NATO planning will get more Ukrainians killed and risk a wider war between Russia and the West

https://asiatimes.com/2023/01/wasted-tanks-wasted-time-in-ukraine/

excerpt:

After almost a year of pleading with their North Atlantic Treaty Organization allies for advanced main battle tanks (MBTs), the alliance is finally giving in to the Ukrainians.

This comes as the Russian invasion, which had ground to a halt after the unsuccessful attempt to capture Kiev, ended in the retreat of Russian forces back to Russian-held territories in eastern Ukraine and the Crimean Peninsula.

After the Russians had retreated, rather than use their victory in the Battle of Kiev as leverage to get a negotiated settlement from Moscow, the Ukrainians took their forces on the offensive.

Once the war shifted from a defensive war into an offensive one in territory that the Russians had held at least since 2014, things changed for the Ukrainians.

Now, Russia has fully mobilized and has deployed anywhere from 300,000 to 350,000 troops and is readying for a massive counterattack against the strained Ukrainian lines. To prevent a total rout, the NATO alliance is stepping in at the eleventh hour to send in a hodgepodge of MBTs.

Western analysts, abandoning their sense of reason and probity, have become little more than cheerleaders for this decision (and other escalatory actions).

But when one looks at the timelines involved, the brittleness of the NATO supply chains into Ukraine and the way that the strained and drained Ukrainian defensive lines are already buckling under what is still-limited Russian pressure, one cannot help but wonder if these actions by NATO are wrong, dangerous and even futile.

They will not help Ukraine; they will get more Ukrainians killed and risk a wider war with the West.

..The reason Ukraine was able to deflect the Russian invasion last year was sheer numbers and geography: The Russians invaded their country with a paltry force of 160,000 troops who did not have the means or leadership to march on Kiev the way President Vladimir Putin thought they could.

This has all changed. The Russians are massing across from the Ukrainians in such a way that their offensive will be plodding and gruesome but ultimately will break through the tired Ukrainian resistance all while Ukraine sends a few companies of NATO tanks into the chaos and gets chewed up for the quixotic attempt.

Logistics, geography and arithmetic still count in warfare.

Sadly for Kiev, these timeless factors are now working against it. Warfare is an inherently political act. The strategic objectives should have been the preservation of the Ukrainian core in the western portion of the country and the speediest end to the invasion as possible an end that could not come through force of arms alone.

Because of Kiev's inability to see this, coupled with the fantastical (almost childlike) notions of its NATO backers, Ukraine is about to be crushed over the next six months by the onslaught of a totally mobilized Russia.

NATO will have depleted its own weapons stockpiles and treasury and it will have brought the world to the brink of another great power global conflict all for nothing.

https://asiatimes.com/2023/01/wasted-tanks-wasted-time-in-ukraine/

Wanted to share a couple of stories that I doubt have been in this thread yet.

First, another awful story about Russian military misconduct. This time a Russian TV propagandist was raped by the nephew of the Chechen leader. Of course, this information will be suppressed in Russia because sharing anything negative about their military is punishable by 15 years in jail - provided that you are even fortunate enough to face their corrupt formal criminal system and don't get extra-judicially disappeared. I highly doubt that this will be a "scandal" because very few Russians will find out about it and those who do will be afraid to talk about it.

This is the same sort of criminal behavior that Ukrainian citizens have been subjected to on a widespread basis with the knowledge and support of the Russian military commanders. Unfortunately there is no hope for improvement so this is just another senseless crime committed by the Russian military with Putin's green light.

Major scandal in Russia.

The TV presenter Olga Zenkova from NTV was sent to occupied Melitopol to record a propaganda piece.

While visiting a restaurant, Kadyrov’s nephew Hasan Ibrahimov and men from his unit walked up to her, beat up her camera man and then raped her. pic.twitter.com/csNvw1kaEi

— Visegrád 24 (@visegrad24) January 30, 2023

In Melitopol, Kadyrovites raped a Russian propagandist from NTV and beat up a cameraman. The authors of the channel noted that this topic was prohibited to cover in the news in order not to "discredit the army". https://t.co/Dg08nC0slQ pic.twitter.com/1HNOdo7HWj

— Dénes Törteli 🇪🇺🇭🇺🇺🇦 (@DenesTorteli) January 30, 2023

Also, CNN posted an article about the Wagner merc who defected to Oslo. He talks about Wagner forces absolute lack of any tactical strategy (which is consistent with Russia's actual armed forces) and utter brutality and reckless disregard for their own forces. For anyone paying attention, his story is consistent with what a lot of informed people have been saying, although obviously counter to the pro-Putin propagandists engaged in the firehose of falsehoods. Given that Putin/Prigozhin value the lives of Russians at close to $0, they are perfectly happy to throw more into the meat grinder in hopes they will take out some Ukrainians on their way down. The only value to the Russian military is that they have to replace dead meat with new recruits which means Prigozhin has to visit more prisons.

Quote:

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Wagner fighters were often sent into battle with little direction, and the company's treatment of reluctant recruits was ruthless, Andrei Medvedev told CNN's Anderson Cooper from Norway's capital Oslo, where he is seeking asylum after crossing that country's arctic border from Russia.

"They would round up those who did not want to fight and shoot them in front of newcomers," he alleges. "They brought two prisoners who refused to go fight and they shot them in front of everyone and buried them right in the trenches that were dug by the trainees."

CNN has not been able to independently verify his account and Wagner has not replied to a request for comment.

The 26-year-old, who says he previously served in the Russian military, joined Wagner as a volunteer. He crossed into Ukraine less than 10 days after signing his contract in July 2022, serving near Bakhmut, the frontline city in the Donetsk region. The mercenary group has emerged as a key player in Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

Medvedev said he reported directly to the group's founders, Dmitry Utkin and Russian oligarch Yevgeny Prigozhin.

...
Wagner lacked a tactical strategy, with troops coming up with plans on the fly, Medvedev said.

"There were no real tactics at all. We just got orders about the position of the adversary…There were no definite orders about how we should behave. We just planned how we would go about it, step by step. Who would open fire, what kind of shifts we would have…How it how it how it would turn out that was our problem," he said.
...
He started off with 10 men under his command, a number that grew once prisoners were allowed to join, he said. "There were more dead bodies, and more, and more, people coming in. In the end I had a lot of people under my command," he said. "I couldn't count how many. They were in constant circulation. Dead bodies, more prisoners, more dead bodies, more prisoners."

Advocacy groups say prisoners who enlisted were told their families would receive a pay-out of five million rubles ($71,000) if they died in the war.

But in reality "nobody wanted to pay that kind of money," Medvedev said. He alleged that many Russians who died fighting in Ukraine were "just declared missing."

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Using prisoners in war isn't a new tactic. Some allege Wagner was used to soften up Ukrainian forces, and Russia saved their men, who are now being rotated into battle.

Cal alum Michael Savage and Colonel Douglass McGregor had an interesting chat. There is an allegation that the Ukrainian central commander wanted to pull his men out of the Donbas as it is a no win / high attrition battle (and his troops are running thin), but Zelensky (politics) overruled him. It would "look bad" (PR) to retreat. Savage claims similar to Hitler overruling his generals.

- Milly running the show?
- If there were a Putin replacement, it will likely be much worse.
- This war has made Russia stronger.