The Non-Yogi Israel-Palestine war thread

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movielover
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In reply to Lets Go Brandon 25 • 3:21p, 5/7/24
Biden / Obama give Billions to Iran.

Iran funds Hamas & others.

Hamas attacks Israel weeks later.
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AunBear89
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In reply to movielover • 3:41p, 5/7/24
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -- (maybe) Benjamin Disraeli, popularized by Mark Twain
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oski003
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In reply to AunBear89 • 3:43p, 5/7/24
AunBear89 said:


Is that why you never try?
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AunBear89
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In reply to oski003 • 3:48p, 5/7/24
Is that supposed to be some kind of burn? Because, like many things in your life, it failed.

I'm sure it sounded super cool and witty in your brain, but that's because you aren't very smart.

Here's a helpful hint: you aren't one tenth as clever as you think you are.
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -- (maybe) Benjamin Disraeli, popularized by Mark Twain
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oski003
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In reply to AunBear89 • 4:06p, 5/7/24
AunBear89 said:
Is that supposed to be some kind of burn? Because, like many things in your life, it failed.

I'm sure it sounded super cool and witty in your brain, but that's because you aren't very smart.

Here's a helpful hint: you aren't one tenth as clever as you think you are.


Even if you repeat this same attack dog drivel over and over again, it ain't going to change a thing. It is boring and repetitive. Your schtick sucks.
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Genocide Joe 2
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In reply to Unit2Sucks • 4:09p, 5/7/24
Unit2Sucks said:

Not sure anyone reported on the fake ceasefire that Hamas "agreed" to and which was parroted by credulous US news sources.
Apparently it does fool credulous rubes like U2Sucks


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Cal88
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6:11p, 5/7/24










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Zippergate
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6:12p, 5/7/24
um...yeah. Gotta give them credit, very on-brand.

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movielover
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11:40a, 5/8/24
Two minutes, the nuclear threat.

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Cal88
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2:51p, 5/8/24
Hypocritical neocons, the Hong Kong campus protests were far more violent:

HK Polytechnic U. 2019

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The Ghoul
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11:01p, 5/8/24

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bearister
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1:23p, 5/9/24


Well, Anti anti tRumpers now have more collateral damage to deal with seating tRump on the throne to teach moderate Dems a lesson. In his court house pressie he opened with saying that no Jew should vote for Biden because he just betrayed Israel. That can only mean tRump is all on board shipping the bombs to Israel and that he is a genocide cheer boy. Oops.

*What you have to realize is that tRump's supporters' hatred of the American system supersedes all policy considerations. tRump can do a 180 degree on every one of his stated beliefs and they would support him with even more fervor.
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CaliforniaEternal
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4:47p, 5/9/24
What is Joe Biden doing to release the 5 American hostages held by Hamas? Does he think a weapons embargo on Israel is going to help release them?

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Cal88
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4:48p, 5/9/24
^London says, up yours, Donald!







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CaliforniaEternal
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5:33p, 5/9/24
The overwhelming majority of Jews (90%+ according to all surveys) worldwide are Zionists and support the state of Israel. That's not surprising given that Judaism and the land of Israel are inseparable. Do not tokenize us with some fringe elements that side with those that would love to destroy us. That didn't work in WW2 and it won't work now.
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Cal88
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In reply to CaliforniaEternal • 6:03p, 5/9/24
CaliforniaEternal said:
The overwhelming majority of Jews (90%+ according to all surveys) worldwide are Zionists and support the state of Israel. That's not surprising given that Judaism and the land of Israel are inseparable. Do not tokenize us with some fringe elements that side with those that would love to destroy us. That didn't work in WW2 and it won't work now.

58%, not 90%, of American Jews "feel very/somewhat attached to Israel" according to this Pew Research poll, and that was before the ongoing genocide in Gaza. That number now is definitely lower, and certainly a lot lower among younger Jews.

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2021/05/21/u-s-jews-have-widely-differing-views-on-israel/ft_21-05-20_usjews_israel_land-png/
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The Ghoul
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In reply to CaliforniaEternal • 11:50p, 5/9/24

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bearister
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9:27a, 5/10/24
Blinken report expected to criticize Israel, but say it isn't breaking weapons terms


https://www.axios.com/2024/05/10/israel-gaza-us-weapons-congress-report-blinken
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The Ghoul
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2:44p, 5/10/24


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CaliforniaEternal
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3:05p, 5/10/24
The Hamas cheerleaders and ceasefire pimpers sure don't seem to be outraged when rockets fall on playgrounds in Israel.

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Big C
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5:25p, 5/10/24

^ Eff Hamas. Maybe these protestors on college campuses would have a little more credibility if they'd join me in saying that, as a starting point for further discussions.
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Cal88
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6:23p, 5/10/24




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The Ghoul
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In reply to CaliforniaEternal • 11:50p, 5/10/24


https://media1.tenor.com/m/ca0S_LjritkAAAAC/shoshanna-laughing.gif
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bearister
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8:29a, 5/11/24
Bill Maher's panel discussions every Friday evening about Gaza are laughable. Total circle jerk sessions with pom poms.
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Big C
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In reply to bearister • 3:38p, 5/11/24
bearister said:
Bill Maher's panel discussions every Friday evening about Gaza are laughable. Total circle jerk sessions with pom poms.

Lately, he definitely seems like he is out to sway public opinion back to pro-Israel. I'm halfway on board with that, but I think he's taking it too far. The Netanyahu govt. has been way too blunt and disproportionate in their response and deserves harsh criticism. However, some of the protestors do sound ignorant of the history and when it crosses over the line to sound anti-Semitic / pro-Hamas, they've completely lost me.
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bearister
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In reply to The Ghoul • 7:14p, 5/11/24
The Ghoul said:



The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear. Here is what they are doing with regard to your most pressing issue: the genocide in Gaza:



"House Foreign Affairs Committee Chair Rep. Michael McCaul (R-Texas) and House Armed Services Chair Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Ala.) said in a joint statement Wednesday they were "appalled that the administration paused crucial arms shipments to Israel," accusing Biden of weakening Israeli security."

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4652577-biden-gop-wrath-pause-bombs-israel/amp/

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Big C
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In reply to bearister • 10:31p, 5/11/24
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:



The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear. Here is what they are doing with regard to your most pressing issue: the genocide in Gaza:



"House Foreign Affairs Committee Chair Rep. Michael McCaul (R-Texas) and House Armed Services Chair Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Ala.) said in a joint statement Wednesday they were "appalled that the administration paused crucial arms shipments to Israel," accusing Biden of weakening Israeli security."

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4652577-biden-gop-wrath-pause-bombs-israel/amp/


Imagine how much that would suck: You're Israel and you just wanna level a few dozen city blocks in Gaza -- because that's what you do -- but you're starting to run low on US-supplied guns and ammo! Doesn't seem fair...
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The Ghoul
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In reply to bearister • 12:22a, 5/12/24
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:
The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear.

(rest of your boring fear porn snipped)
I love how your anger about this is steadily growing as you're starting to realize that your imaginary scenario (where Trump cheats and steals the election) is being replaced by the growing horror that you realize that the odds of him legitimately winning the election are growing every day. And the fact that you're taking this anger out on me by trying the same bull**** voter shaming tactics that the Democrats have been doing since forever and stupidly thinking that anyone that's not going to vote for Biden gives two ****s about any of it just makes it that much more delicious.

See, unlike what you think, I held my nose and voted for that corrupt callous cow in 2016 because despite her being evil and every last bit the narcissist that Trump is, I absolutely didn't want him to be President. And despite the various fictions that bitter people tried to sell about Bernie voters or Jill Stein voters or Russia or James Comey being responsible, the truth it was all her. She ran a horrible campaign and blew the biggest layup in history. She is for all time the bigger loser in the history of Presidential politics and that's how she will be remembered.



But the other piece of it is that all the horrible nihilistic predictions that people had for a Trump presidency never came to pass. At the end of the day, regardless of how stupid or narcissistic or immoral he is, the end result of his Administration was pretty much just a typical Republican presidency and people remember that. Whereas this country is now in two wars they don't need to be in, everything costs twice as much as it prior to 2021 if not more,and too many people are working multiple jobs and barely getting by if they are even getting by at all. Nobody gives a **** about Democrat fear porn right now because things are awful now.

And most importantly, people HATE Biden. As they should.

Yeah, there's a big chunk of pissed off Muslims (and ironically now Israelis and Jews who think that Biden hasn't given them enough support LOLOLOLOL), recent college graduates with tons of debt and **** for job prospects, people who are still waiting for the $600 that Democrats reneged on, anti-war people, and people who were dumb enough to think Biden was ever actually going to do something for them and have buyer's remorse that are going to make moderate Democrats like you eat **** in November.

I can't wait.

https://media1.tenor.com/m/ca0S_LjritkAAAAC/shoshanna-laughing.gif
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bearister
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In reply to The Ghoul • 7:27a, 5/12/24
The Ghoul said:
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:
The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear.

(rest of your boring fear porn snipped)


1.
 And the fact that you're taking this anger out on me
.


2
At the end of the day, regardless of how stupid or narcissistic or immoral he is, the end result of his Administration was pretty much just a typical Republican presidency


3
Whereas this country is now in two wars they don't need to be in
.

4
everything costs twice as much as it prior to 2021 if not more,and too many people are working multiple jobs and barely getting by if they are even getting by at all.



5
. recent college graduates with tons of debt and **** for job prospects



1. I have no anger towards you. I am trying to point out that the Lesser of Two Evils Theory has viability in this election and I know that you are not ever going to agree with that. You make a repeated point of Biden's failures in Gaza and with student protests yet by his own words at rallies, tRump is even more pro Bibi and anti student protestor;

2. I don't really disagree with you here, but I don't feel as comfortable presuming that tRump Redux will be another typical Republican presidency because:

a) Memos have been released indicating tRump is going "No more Mr. Nice guy" this next round (Inside Trump '25: A radical plan for Trump's second term:https://www.axios.com/2022/07/22/trump-2025-radical-plan-second-term).

b) I have no confidence that anyone remotely competent is willing to work for him anymore. He wants strictly Stephen Miller loyalists. There will be no one to talk him off the ledge;

c) Like Biden, tRump has mentally degraded even further than what his shaky baseline was during his 1st administration. The problem is that I don't think tRump is completely a figurehead POTUS, like Biden is, and Reagan was, especially in his 2nd term. The prospect of tRump having any substantive input in governing in his current mental state is horrifying;

d) tRump's presidency certainly didn't end like a typical Republican presidency with his attempt to overturn the election and his fomenting of an insurrection, resulting in hundreds of his supporters serving prison time for felonies that they either pled to or were convicted of by juries. Is it unreasonable for me to fear that tRump intends to be as radical at the beginning of his new reign as he was in closing out his prior one?

3. We disagree on Ukraine but are fairly close on the Gaza invasion. I did agree with Maher's comment Friday night when he said candidates that say this or that world event would not have happened if I was POTUS are full of sh@t. Putin and Bibi would both be happier today if tRump was president;

4. Well, I guess that will be a good thing if tRump changes this for the better. We are going to have an opportunity to see;

5. See 4. above. I thought tRump was against student loan forgiveness.

Finally, I hope you are right about tRump Redux conducting just another typical Republican Administration. I don't want America damaged just so I have bragging rights. I do think the possibility exists of the military taking sides if things get too weird, but I am not sure whose side they would take.
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AunBear89
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In reply to bearister • 7:52a, 5/12/24
WAAAAAAAAAY too many facts and well reasoned statements in this post for Yogi to process.

Probably because he is so unfamiliar with such things, and has never used them himself.
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." -- (maybe) Benjamin Disraeli, popularized by Mark Twain
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sycasey
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In reply to bearister • 8:54a, 5/12/24
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:
The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear.

(rest of your boring fear porn snipped)


1.
 And the fact that you're taking this anger out on me
.


2
At the end of the day, regardless of how stupid or narcissistic or immoral he is, the end result of his Administration was pretty much just a typical Republican presidency


3
Whereas this country is now in two wars they don't need to be in
.

4
everything costs twice as much as it prior to 2021 if not more,and too many people are working multiple jobs and barely getting by if they are even getting by at all.



5
. recent college graduates with tons of debt and **** for job prospects



1. I have no anger towards you. I am trying to point out that the Lesser of Two Evils Theory has viability in this election and I know that you are not ever going to agree with that. You make a repeated point of Biden's failures in Gaza and with student protests yet by his own words at rallies, tRump is even more pro Bibi and anti student protestor;

2. I don't really disagree with you here, but I don't feel as comfortable presuming that tRump Redux will be another typical Republican presidency because:

a) Memos have been released indicating tRump is going "No more Mr. Nice guy" this next round (Inside Trump '25: A radical plan for Trump's second term:https://www.axios.com/2022/07/22/trump-2025-radical-plan-second-term).

b) I have no confidence that anyone remotely competent is willing to work for him anymore. He wants strictly Stephen Miller loyalists. There will be no one to talk him off the ledge;

c) Like Biden, tRump has mentally degraded even further than what his shaky baseline was during his 1st administration. The problem is that I don't think tRump is completely a figurehead POTUS, like Biden is, and Reagan was, especially in his 2nd term. The prospect of tRump having any substantive input in governing in his current mental state is horrifying;

d) tRump's presidency certainly didn't end like a typical Republican presidency with his attempt to overturn the election and his fomenting of an insurrection, resulting in hundreds of his supporters serving prison time for felonies that they either pled to or were convicted of by juries. Is it unreasonable for me to fear that tRump intends to be as radical at the beginning of his new reign as he was in closing out his prior one?

3. We disagree on Ukraine but are fairly close on the Gaza invasion. I did agree with Maher's comment Friday night when he said candidates that say this or that world event would not have happened if I was POTUS are full of sh@t. Putin and Bibi would both be happier today if tRump was president;

4. Well, I guess that will be a good thing if tRump changes this for the better. We are going to have an opportunity to see;

5. See 4. above. I thought tRump was against student loan forgiveness.

Finally, I hope you are right about tRump Redux conducting just another typical Republican Administration. I don't want America damaged just so I have bragging rights. I do think the possibility exists of the military taking sides if things get too weird, but I am not sure whose side they would take.
On some things, "typical Republican Administration" is bad enough already. How are abortion rights going? Will health care survive another round? Republicans only failed to strip it last time because of John McCain's last stand.

Also, the US is not "in" two wars. Our troops are not fighting. Sending assistance to another country is not the same thing. (Though I agree that the US should be curtailing Israel aid significantly, something that seems to finally be happening.)
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Cal88
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In reply to bearister • 9:23a, 5/12/24
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:



The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear. Here is what they are doing with regard to your most pressing issue: the genocide in Gaza:



"House Foreign Affairs Committee Chair Rep. Michael McCaul (R-Texas) and House Armed Services Chair Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Ala.) said in a joint statement Wednesday they were "appalled that the administration paused crucial arms shipments to Israel," accusing Biden of weakening Israeli security."

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4652577-biden-gop-wrath-pause-bombs-israel/amp/

I agree about Trump being no better than Biden on Gaza, and even, potentially worse (see Kushner talking about seaside condos in Gaza...)

Trump's main donors like the Adelsons (hardcore zionists) are more important to him than his right wing antiwar base. Trump is first and foremost an opportunist.
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dajo9
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In reply to Cal88 • 10:19a, 5/12/24
Cal88 said:
bearister said:
The Ghoul said:



The collateral damage of teaching moderate Democrats a lesson by undermining Biden and reseating tRump on the throne continues to pile up. I told you that tRump and the Republicans would piss on, sh@it on and set afire everything you hold near and dear. Here is what they are doing with regard to your most pressing issue: the genocide in Gaza:



"House Foreign Affairs Committee Chair Rep. Michael McCaul (R-Texas) and House Armed Services Chair Rep. Mike Rogers (R-Ala.) said in a joint statement Wednesday they were "appalled that the administration paused crucial arms shipments to Israel," accusing Biden of weakening Israeli security."

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/4652577-biden-gop-wrath-pause-bombs-israel/amp/

I agree about Trump being no better than Biden on Gaza, and even, potentially worse (see Kushner talking about seaside condos in Gaza...)

Trump's main donors like the Adelsons (hardcore zionists) are more important to him than his right wing antiwar base. Trump is first and foremost an opportunist.


Traitor Trump doesn't have a right wing antiwar base. His base is opportunistic. They'll support any pro war or anti war message he sends. They'll attack his opponents on a pro war or anti war basis. Whatever works.
"The rules were that you were not going to fact check"
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sycasey
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In reply to dajo9 • 11:33a, 5/12/24
There is some evidence that Trump's base is isolationist, but that is not the same as anti-war.
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Cal88
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11:54a, 5/12/24
"Isolationist", as in we would have been better off spending the $8 trillion wasted on neocon forever wars since 2001 on domestic programs, yes.

That base has been present way back, represented by people like Pat Buchanan. It has grown a lot ever since due to the ongoing industrial decline in the US.
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