Livestream: Kyle Kyle Rittenhouse trial opening statements

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dajo9
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BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

Right wing media will find a politically beneficial way to frame this tragedy

In the state of Wisconsin, a man plows through a Christmas parade with vehicle killing 5 people & injuring 40 and is a career criminal and was out on bail for $1000. In a sperate incident, a teenager kills two people who attacked him in self defense and had a $2 million bail and 2 months in prison. Guess which one is white and which one is black?


You are conflating different bails with different crimes. You are dishonest.

have fun:

https://thefederalist.com/2021/11/22/waukesha-parade-suspect-with-released-on-bail-just-days-before-deadly-tragedy/#.YZvR0sAYuds.twitter




I am aware of the facts. I know the tweet you originally posted used slang to make it seem like he got $1,000 bail after murder. I know you changed a key word in your post to be factually correct while intentionally conflating the $1,000 bail with the murder. I know you think you are being clever but you're just being dishonest and stupid.

I provided the link so you can see the perp's rap sheet, there's no need for faux outrage.


Stop being stupid and dishonest
BearForce2
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dajo9 said:

BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:

Right wing media will find a politically beneficial way to frame this tragedy

In the state of Wisconsin, a man plows through a Christmas parade with vehicle killing 5 people & injuring 40 and is a career criminal and was out on bail for $1000. In a sperate incident, a teenager kills two people who attacked him in self defense and had a $2 million bail and 2 months in prison. Guess which one is white and which one is black?


You are conflating different bails with different crimes. You are dishonest.

have fun:

https://thefederalist.com/2021/11/22/waukesha-parade-suspect-with-released-on-bail-just-days-before-deadly-tragedy/#.YZvR0sAYuds.twitter




I am aware of the facts. I know the tweet you originally posted used slang to make it seem like he got $1,000 bail after murder. I know you changed a key word in your post to be factually correct while intentionally conflating the $1,000 bail with the murder. I know you think you are being clever but you're just being dishonest and stupid.

I provided the link so you can see the perp's rap sheet, there's no need for faux outrage.


Stop being stupid and dishonest
BearForce2
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dajo9 said:


Stop being stupid and dishonest

Biden and the media were stupid and dishonest from Day 1.

MinotStateBeav
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BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:


Stop being stupid and dishonest

Biden and the media were stupid and dishonest from Day 1.


Gandalf and Pippen discuss the Rittenhouse trial.
BearGoggles
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sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.


BearForce2
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going4roses
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Kyle your people are proud of you
https://vm.tiktok.com/TTPd2PbGYc/
dajo9
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BearForce2 said:

dajo9 said:


Stop being stupid and dishonest

Biden and the media were stupid and dishonest from Day 1.




Ahh, day 1.

Like when the Trump Administration spent day one lying about crowd sizes. What small people.
Unit2Sucks
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Maybe Rittenhouse is intern material - he's already in the right wing grift machine.


sycasey
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BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
Unit2Sucks
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sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:


This was a baseless disingenuous attack on Biden. He tweeted a video that included photos/videos over a voiceover of a question that Chris Wallace asked Trump during their presidential debate, days after Kenosha.

This was the question:

Quote:

WALLACE: But are you willing, tonight, to condemn white supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities as we saw in Kenosha
and as we've seen in Portland? Are you prepared to specifically do that?


The video showed a picture of Rittenhouse only during the moment that Wallace uttered the word "Kenosha".

There is no story here, this is just a bunch of garbage from people trying to distract from the fact that they supported a person so horrible he wouldn't even explicitly disown white supremacists during a presidential debate.
BearForce2
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Unit2Sucks said:


There is no story here, this is just a bunch of garbage from people trying to distract from the fact that they supported a person so horrible he wouldn't even explicitly disown white supremacists during a presidential debate.


President Trump didn't have to answer Chris scumbag Wallace's ridiculous question when he already did.

New York Times front page right now: Waukesha? Nope. Charlotesville
BearGoggles
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sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
bearister
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The more the Left and Right a$$h@les kill each other off, the better off the rest of us will be. They are all looking for trouble. I hope they all find it, equally, with each other.





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sycasey
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BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
Anarchistbear
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Brooks is a white supremacist. Rittenhouse is BLM.

The Brooks, anti Chappelle trannie, black lesbian and white pervert Rosenbaum fifth column was burning down Kenosha, destroying black homes and businesse and destabilizing BLM. Rittenhouse rid the street of this scum and purified it.
BearForce2
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Rittenhouse is BLM but he shot and killed 3 black people due to self-defense. BLM leaders blame gun violence.
going4roses
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Lol

Notice he can't even say BLACK LIVES MATTER

GTFOH
How (are) you gonna win when you ain’t right within…
BearGoggles
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sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue. If I said "Pedophiles are bad' and posted a picture of only you (because you occasionally hang out with children), you would be outraged - and rightfully so.

You are clinging to some Clintoneque technicality when, as snopes pointed out, the unequivocal suggestion and implication from Biden was that Rittenhouse was a white supremacist.

If point 2 is your true position, then why even assert that Rittenhouse "worked" with Militia groups? What is the relevance other than to make a connection between he and the far right groups? What is your point in making that connection if you don't mean to imply anything by it? And more importantly, what connection was BIDEN seeking to make/imply?

Bottom line - defending the Biden tweet/statements as technically true is awful.
dajo9
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue. If I said "Pedophiles are bad' and posted a picture of only you (because you occasionally hang out with children), you would be outraged - and rightfully so.

You are clinging to some Clintoneque technicality when, as snopes pointed out, the unequivocal suggestion and implication from Biden was that Rittenhouse was a white supremacist.

If point 2 is your true position, then why even assert that Rittenhouse "worked" with Militia groups? What is the relevance other than to make a connection between he and the far right groups? What is your point in making that connection if you don't mean to imply anything by it? And more importantly, what connection was BIDEN seeking to make/imply?

Bottom line - defending the Biden tweet/statements as technically true is awful.
Beargoggles, I hope you are right about Biden's ad because that would mean that Democrats are starting to play hardball on a level that Republicans are playing
sycasey
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue. If I said "Pedophiles are bad' and posted a picture of only you (because you occasionally hang out with children), you would be outraged - and rightfully so.

You are clinging to some Clintoneque technicality when, as snopes pointed out, the unequivocal suggestion and implication from Biden was that Rittenhouse was a white supremacist.

If point 2 is your true position, then why even assert that Rittenhouse "worked" with Militia groups? What is the relevance other than to make a connection between he and the far right groups? What is your point in making that connection if you don't mean to imply anything by it? And more importantly, what connection was BIDEN seeking to make/imply?

Bottom line - defending the Biden tweet/statements as technically true is awful.

So let me get your position straight as well:

-When it comes to Biden political ads, the proper thing to do is to interpret them in an uncharitable light, so as to determine the real meaning behind what they're doing. Focusing on what they literally say is dishonest.

-When it comes to Kyle Rittenhouse being part of a militia, it's dishonest and "tortured" to use context clues and other evidence to determine whether or not he ever worked with one in Kenosha. The only thing to care about is the most literal interpretation of that statement, which means that he has to have been an official member of a militia for that statement to be true.

Looks like there's plenty of hypocrisy to go around.

By the way, I didn't "defend" the Biden ad. I said it was misleading (I also said that a lot of political ads are misleading and are not held to the same standard as real news reports). In making that claim I was responding to a post that said the ad was explicit in its message, which is why I started discussing the literal statements made in it. That's what "explicit" means. Try to follow the flow of discussion.
Unit2Sucks
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BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.
Please share this tweet. I think you have been misled and that the tweet you were referring to showed a video.

Some people, including Snopes, showed a screenshot during the very short portion of the video where Rittenhouse's still was played. But that's not what was actually tweeted as would be obvious if you actually looked at the tweet and watched the video. This just makes me think your entire argument has come from misinformation and failure to actually watch the 30 second video.

You should correct your statement if you are wrong. If Biden did what you alleged (tweet just a still photo of Rittenhouse), I will eagerly agree with you that it was wrong. It would have been wrong for him to have done so. But I don't think that's the case at all because I'm careful and I actually watched the video and it is as I have described it multiple times in this thread.
going4roses
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https://vm.tiktok.com/TTPd2sweS9/

Is he right?
How (are) you gonna win when you ain’t right within…
sycasey
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Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.
Please share this tweet. I think you have been misled and that the tweet you were referring to showed a video.

Some people, including Snopes, showed a screenshot during the very short portion of the video where Rittenhouse's still was played. But that's not what was actually tweeted as would be obvious if you actually looked at the tweet and watched the video. This just makes me think your entire argument has come from misinformation and failure to actually watch the 30 second video.

You should correct your statement if you are wrong. If Biden did what you alleged (tweet just a still photo of Rittenhouse), I will eagerly agree with you that it was wrong. It would have been wrong for him to have done so. But I don't think that's the case at all because I'm careful and I actually watched the video and it is as I have described it multiple times in this thread.
Yes, this is a point I thought about as well. There was no still image in the Biden tweet. Some screencaptures have frozen it on the image of Rittenhouse, but really that's one brief image in a longer video. The video does not focus on Rittenhouse. It's entirely a political attack on Trump, as one would expect from a politician running a campaign against Trump.
BearGoggles
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Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.
Please share this tweet. I think you have been misled and that the tweet you were referring to showed a video.

Some people, including Snopes, showed a screenshot during the very short portion of the video where Rittenhouse's still was played. But that's not what was actually tweeted as would be obvious if you actually looked at the tweet and watched the video. This just makes me think your entire argument has come from misinformation and failure to actually watch the 30 second video.

You should correct your statement if you are wrong. If Biden did what you alleged (tweet just a still photo of Rittenhouse), I will eagerly agree with you that it was wrong. It would have been wrong for him to have done so. But I don't think that's the case at all because I'm careful and I actually watched the video and it is as I have described it multiple times in this thread.
I am looking at the tweet in the Snopes article I linked to above. If that is only a portion of a video, please post the link and I will review it and let you know if that changes my view - which it might.
sycasey
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Here's more evidence of Rittenhouse working with a militia on the night he shot those three guys. The SPLC has the archive of the Facebook post of one Ryan Balch, a self-described Boogaloo Boy who testified to having walked around with Rittenhouse on the night of the shooting.

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2020/08/30/wisconsin-man-who-says-he-marched-rittenhouse-kenosha-was-immersed-white-supremacist

Balch's post: https://archive.li/Ipz3Y

Quote:

Yesterday at 6pm i joined a contingent of militia along with two unaligned observers headed to Kenosha Wisconsin to protect citizens, their property and their livelihoods.

After infiltrating in Kenosha we found a group of militia made up mostly of males in their early 20's and late teens. Realizing that they were undermanned and had no leadership on ground at all. We joined them and I inserted myself into a tactical advisement role.
Quote:

We quickly setup an aid station in the building we were protecting. Kyle did most of that. We started leaving MHT and going into NML to retrieve wounded BLM and Antifa members providing them with first aid and helping them get to the hospital.
Quote:

The protesters went back and forth with KPD several times KPD up and down Sheridan. When KPD saw we were running an aid station they gassed us. So bad that I required medical care. As Kyle escorted me into the aid station they tossed us water and mockingly said they appreciated what we were doing.
There's also video available of Rittenhouse talking about what his "job" was while standing guard.



So yes, between all of that and his lawyer's statements it appears Kyle Rittenhouse was working with a militia group that night, even if he hadn't ever been a militia member prior to that.

So just to be clear, we' re now judging people by who they happen to meet or interact with at a riot/protest? Just want to make sure, because I'm pretty sure there are some pretty unsavory people at Kenosha on all sides. And I'm pretty sure the peaceful BLM protestors wouldn't want to be grouped in with (or ascribed the views of) the people on their "team" committing violence/property damage, but by your logic they would be. And that is exactly what the SPLC article does focusing entirely on the ugly views of some guy who Rittenhouse didn't even know prior to the night in question.

The video discussing his "job" doesn't suggest his "job" was part of his role in a "militia."

There is no evidence that Rittenhouse ever belonged to a "militia' before or after this incident or, for that matter, came to the protest with a militia or with the intent of meeting up with militia members. No doubt, Rittenhouse thought he would be protecting property and rendering aid - as he said. That doesn't make you part of a militia even if militia members come to the protest/riot with the intention of doing a similar thing. That seems obvious, yet you're wanting to conflate those things.

From Wikipedia:

"Kyle Rittenhouse was a resident of Antioch, Illinois, about 20 miles from Kenosha by road.[18][6][51] Prior to the Kenosha unrest, he had participated in local police cadet programs and expressed support on social media for the Blue Lives Matter movement and law enforcement.[52][6][53] On August 24, he drove to Kenosha to stay with his friend Dominick Black,[54][55] who kept a rifle he purchased for Rittenhouse four months earlier at his Kenosha home.[55][56] The following day, August 25, Rittenhouse helped clean graffiti off a school.[57] Later, together with Black, he arrived at Car Source.[58][59] Accounts differ as to whether Rittenhouse and Black's help was requested by Car Source. The dealership owner's sons denied that gunmen had been asked to defend the business,[60][61] but several witnesses testified that armed individuals had been directly sought out by the business to protect their property.[60]

In the hours leading up to the shooting, Rittenhouse appeared in multiple videos taken by protesters and bystanders and was interviewed twice: first by a livestreamer at the car dealership where he and a number of other armed men had stationed themselves, second by Richie McGinniss, a reporter for The Daily Caller.[13] Rittenhouse was seen talking with police officers,[13][62] and offering medical aid to those who were injured.[13] When McGinniss asked Rittenhouse why he was at the car dealership, he responded: "So, people are getting injured, and our job is to protect this business. Part of my job is also to help people. If there is somebody hurt, I'm running into harm's way. That's why I have my rifle, because I have to protect myself, obviously. I also have my med kit." At some point, Rittenhouse left the dealership, was prevented by police from returning,[13] and then headed to the Car Source lot farthest to the South."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenosha_unrest_shooting#Before_the_shooting

Search the entire Wiki article. There is no link showing he was part of a militia and google searches produce the same result.
Okay, let's recap here:

1. Yes, I have already acknowledged that Rittenhouse was not an official card-carrying member of a militia group.

2. These kinds of "militia" groups are often not organized enough to have official members anyway, so to ask for that standard of proof would rule out a lot of people who in most people's minds would qualify as modern American militia. Like, are Boogaloo Boys militia? They are loosely organized so it would be hard to find any official roster of members. But I think most people would consider them a militia when they show up wearing military fatigues with weapons strapped to them.

3. My contention with Rittenhouse is not that he was officially part of a militia or that he claimed to be. It's that the evidence from the scene indicates that he was effectively working as part of one. A man who testified at Rittenhouse's trial described himself and Kyle as having worked with a kind of loosely-organized militia that night. Rittenhouse's own lawyer used "militia" as part of his defense.

4. Given all of that, I think it's fair for Joe Biden's campaign ads or anyone else to reference an image of Rittenhouse when describing "militia" presence in Kenosha during the protests/riots. No, none of these militia were well organized. But most people would describe them as militia and it seems clear Rittenhouse worked with these groups once he was there.

Does that make sense? If you want to claim victory on the point that Kyle Rittenhouse was never an "official" militia member, then okay, congratulations. That's not really what I'm talking about.
I understand the distinction you're making. Its tortured, but ok.

And by the way, even snopes agrees that Biden wrongfully called Rittenhouse a white supremacist.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kyle-rittenhouse-biden/

Since you adopted the "you're judged by the people you hang out with" approach, I'm wondering what conclusions you have drawn about Darrell Brooks affiliation and BLM?

And on a related note, it is 100% clear Brooks had abhorrent racial views. 100% more evidence than the Rittenhouse white supremacy claims. Looking forward to you and others in this thread assuming the attack on the parade was racially motivated and decrying the "obvious" racism.

https://nypost.com/2021/11/24/darrell-brooks-called-for-violence-against-white-people/

And for the record, I don't think we know Brook's motive or even if it was intentional (though there is some evidence for both). But if you make that unfounded assumption with Rittenhouse, then you have to make the same leap with Brooks.
1. Snopes agrees with me. Their article says that the Biden ad is misleading in that it associates Rittenhouse with white supremacists, but it does not EXPLICITLY call him a white supremacist. That's exactly what I said in my reply to oski003, when I disagreed with his claim that this was evidence of Biden "explicitly" calling Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Go read it.

2. At no point did I judge Rittenhouse for having worked with militia groups while on the scene in Kenosha, I have merely claimed that he DID work with militia groups there. Not sure why you're bringing up Darrell Brooks here, but based on his social media posts it looks like he's a nutjob and a racist and/or antisemite. I would no more assign his beliefs to BLM as a whole than I would assign all right-wing militia politics to Rittenhouse. Indeed, the Tucker Carlson interview seems to suggest that Kyle Rittenhouse's political positions are all over the place.

Do you actually read what I write or are you just responding to the version in your head?
It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.
Please share this tweet. I think you have been misled and that the tweet you were referring to showed a video.

Some people, including Snopes, showed a screenshot during the very short portion of the video where Rittenhouse's still was played. But that's not what was actually tweeted as would be obvious if you actually looked at the tweet and watched the video. This just makes me think your entire argument has come from misinformation and failure to actually watch the 30 second video.

You should correct your statement if you are wrong. If Biden did what you alleged (tweet just a still photo of Rittenhouse), I will eagerly agree with you that it was wrong. It would have been wrong for him to have done so. But I don't think that's the case at all because I'm careful and I actually watched the video and it is as I have described it multiple times in this thread.
I am looking at the tweet in the Snopes article I linked to above. If that is only a portion of a video, please post the link and I will review it and let you know if that changes my view - which it might.
LOL. The Biden video was posted right here in this thread. It's what kicked off this whole round of trying to interpret what it was actually saying.

I guess you've pretty well confirmed that you don't actually read the posts you respond to.
Unit2Sucks
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Exhibit Q on why Glenn Greenwald is no more trustworthy than the "mainstream media" he loves to rail against:







No, he never provided an answer to the main question ("Which US outlets reported that Rittenhouse's victims were Black?"). Greenwald criticizes the liberal media for pushing falsehoods that further a favored narrative by . . . pushing a falsehood that furthers his favored narrative. He's not any better.
Its fairly obvious. When killings are reported as caused by "white supremacy" or a "white supremacist" the implication is that the people who died were non-white. In the united states a great many people incorrectly believe that and the foreign press is making that same mistake in some cases.
Some people BELIEVE that, but where is the evidence that this was REPORTED by mainstream US outlets?

Remember, Greenwald said he would provide this evidence.
I think that's fair - they didn't explicitly report it. However, if they are calling the incident white supremacism or Rittenhouse a supremacist, what is being implied? Many mainstream media did (and continue to do) that. The narrative carries the implication that the victims where not white.

There are other arguments that can be made about that, but don't you think it is the clear (albeit incorrect) inference? What is the point of calling a shooter a "white supremacist" if the shooting is unrelated to white supremacist beliefs?

And for the record, notwithstanding the rhetoric of some, showing up to protest against and perhaps try to prevent rioting/looting does not make you a white supremacist, nor does saying "blue lives matter". Not saying that was a good choice for a 17 year old (particularly with the weapon) - it wasn't. But that does not make you a white supremacist.

Yes, if any outlet explicitly called Rittenhouse a white supremacist then that would be an unfair characterization and an example of jumping to conclusions. There isn't good evidence that this motivated his actions.

My point is that Greenwald is making the same mistake he accuses others of doing: because he FEELS like the liberal media told a lie about the race of the shooting victims, then it must have been true. Just like how some people FEEL like Rittenhouse must be an example of white supremacy even if the evidence doesn't support that. You don't make arguments against media inaccuracy and bias by also being inaccurate and biased.


This is Twitter and the President of the United States of America:

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html

Biden criticizes Rittenhouse for not condemning white supremists in a tweet of a video with a picture of Rittenhouse. Even those "explicit" is too a high bar, since misleading should qualify, I believe this meets the threshold of explicitly calling Rittenhouse a white supremist.


This is an incredibly disingenuous argument. Biden did mention white supremacists but the video specifically mentioned WS and militia groups. Nowhere in the video or in Biden's tweet was Rittenhouse referred to as a white supremacist. In fact they showed a picture of the kid during the very moment Chris Wallace asked 45 about Kenosha.

I get that you like to play contrarian games, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.



You are peddling bull**** and you know it. The video literally asks if you are willing to condemn white supremist groups and not add to the violence as we saw in Kenosha and then displays an image of Rittenhouse.


I get that you blindly defend liberal causes and then use lawyer speak to justify it, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.
You literally don't know what literally means and are literally misquoting Chris Wallace, which is nothing new for you. The actual question includes a reference to militia groups which is pretty damn relevant to Rittenhouse. Are you incapable of watching and understanding a 50 second video? If you watch it, and have a functioning brain, you would understand how wrong you are.

Here I will make it easier:




The video is attached to Biden's tweet. Whatever DIFFERENT frame of reference you attach to it is irrelevant. Thanks.


Please take a minute, use your brain, and click on the link below.

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html
Lol you can't even post a link so how can we expect you to watch it, let alone absorb it. I guess it's all the more obvious now why you fall prey to so much vaccine misinformation.




??? Thanks for posting what I already posted and then told me what I couldn't post. Man, what is your deal?
You are continuing to lie about the tweet and either failing to understand why or acknowledge it. Your tweet doesn't embed properly in BI because of all of the extra at the end of the string. Mine embeds fine so people don't have to click a link to see the contents of the tweet.

I still don't think you've actually watched the video which is why your repeated assertions are so risible. No one who has seen the video is confused about this. They are either lying about it or they understand the only connection to Rittenhouse is when Chris Wallace mentioned Kenosha specifically right after he mentioned militia groups.

How anti-truth have you become?


Watched it for the third time. Clearly, it shows Rittenhouse right after asking if we are all ready to stand up to white supremacists. While the purpose of the message is to smear Trump (rightfully so), it absolutely strongly equates Rittenhouse to a white supremists. To think otherwise is absolutely insane.
You are truly lost.

Here's the exact quote from Chris Wallace:
Quote:

WALLACE: But are you willing, tonight, to condemn white supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities as we saw in Kenosha and as we've seen in Portland? Are you prepared to specifically do that?
The video places the photo of the kid right when Wallace references Kenosha.

You are a font of misinformation but no one can watch this video and think it labels Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Why aren't you people calling for Fox News and Chris Wallace to be sued? He's the one who referenced Kenosha.

This is just more disingenuous posturing from people who have no interest in engaging in good faith.
Joe Biden and his team produced the video and overdubbed Wallace's question. Joe Biden and his team (not Wallace) put Rittenhouse's picture in juxtaposition to a question about white supremacists and militia groups. Do you truly not understand that or are you just dissembling?

If I tweet "Pedophilia is Bad" and put up a picture of you, would you interpret that to be the suggestion that you're a pedophile? Of course you would.


Here's BG acknowledging there was a video and the contents yet he now claims to never have seen it. Not a good look for BG.



Not real:



I can't say for a fact that pizza Gate moron, white supremacist and anti-Semite Jack POS is the first to mislead people like you into believing that Biden's ad unfairly targeted Rittenhouse, but it certainly seems that his misinformation campaign ultimately found its way to you and influenced your opinion.
BearGoggles
How long do you want to ignore this user?
Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Exhibit Q on why Glenn Greenwald is no more trustworthy than the "mainstream media" he loves to rail against:







No, he never provided an answer to the main question ("Which US outlets reported that Rittenhouse's victims were Black?"). Greenwald criticizes the liberal media for pushing falsehoods that further a favored narrative by . . . pushing a falsehood that furthers his favored narrative. He's not any better.
Its fairly obvious. When killings are reported as caused by "white supremacy" or a "white supremacist" the implication is that the people who died were non-white. In the united states a great many people incorrectly believe that and the foreign press is making that same mistake in some cases.
Some people BELIEVE that, but where is the evidence that this was REPORTED by mainstream US outlets?

Remember, Greenwald said he would provide this evidence.
I think that's fair - they didn't explicitly report it. However, if they are calling the incident white supremacism or Rittenhouse a supremacist, what is being implied? Many mainstream media did (and continue to do) that. The narrative carries the implication that the victims where not white.

There are other arguments that can be made about that, but don't you think it is the clear (albeit incorrect) inference? What is the point of calling a shooter a "white supremacist" if the shooting is unrelated to white supremacist beliefs?

And for the record, notwithstanding the rhetoric of some, showing up to protest against and perhaps try to prevent rioting/looting does not make you a white supremacist, nor does saying "blue lives matter". Not saying that was a good choice for a 17 year old (particularly with the weapon) - it wasn't. But that does not make you a white supremacist.

Yes, if any outlet explicitly called Rittenhouse a white supremacist then that would be an unfair characterization and an example of jumping to conclusions. There isn't good evidence that this motivated his actions.

My point is that Greenwald is making the same mistake he accuses others of doing: because he FEELS like the liberal media told a lie about the race of the shooting victims, then it must have been true. Just like how some people FEEL like Rittenhouse must be an example of white supremacy even if the evidence doesn't support that. You don't make arguments against media inaccuracy and bias by also being inaccurate and biased.


This is Twitter and the President of the United States of America:

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html

Biden criticizes Rittenhouse for not condemning white supremists in a tweet of a video with a picture of Rittenhouse. Even those "explicit" is too a high bar, since misleading should qualify, I believe this meets the threshold of explicitly calling Rittenhouse a white supremist.


This is an incredibly disingenuous argument. Biden did mention white supremacists but the video specifically mentioned WS and militia groups. Nowhere in the video or in Biden's tweet was Rittenhouse referred to as a white supremacist. In fact they showed a picture of the kid during the very moment Chris Wallace asked 45 about Kenosha.

I get that you like to play contrarian games, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.



You are peddling bull**** and you know it. The video literally asks if you are willing to condemn white supremist groups and not add to the violence as we saw in Kenosha and then displays an image of Rittenhouse.


I get that you blindly defend liberal causes and then use lawyer speak to justify it, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.
You literally don't know what literally means and are literally misquoting Chris Wallace, which is nothing new for you. The actual question includes a reference to militia groups which is pretty damn relevant to Rittenhouse. Are you incapable of watching and understanding a 50 second video? If you watch it, and have a functioning brain, you would understand how wrong you are.

Here I will make it easier:




The video is attached to Biden's tweet. Whatever DIFFERENT frame of reference you attach to it is irrelevant. Thanks.


Please take a minute, use your brain, and click on the link below.

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html
Lol you can't even post a link so how can we expect you to watch it, let alone absorb it. I guess it's all the more obvious now why you fall prey to so much vaccine misinformation.




??? Thanks for posting what I already posted and then told me what I couldn't post. Man, what is your deal?
You are continuing to lie about the tweet and either failing to understand why or acknowledge it. Your tweet doesn't embed properly in BI because of all of the extra at the end of the string. Mine embeds fine so people don't have to click a link to see the contents of the tweet.

I still don't think you've actually watched the video which is why your repeated assertions are so risible. No one who has seen the video is confused about this. They are either lying about it or they understand the only connection to Rittenhouse is when Chris Wallace mentioned Kenosha specifically right after he mentioned militia groups.

How anti-truth have you become?


Watched it for the third time. Clearly, it shows Rittenhouse right after asking if we are all ready to stand up to white supremacists. While the purpose of the message is to smear Trump (rightfully so), it absolutely strongly equates Rittenhouse to a white supremists. To think otherwise is absolutely insane.
You are truly lost.

Here's the exact quote from Chris Wallace:
Quote:

WALLACE: But are you willing, tonight, to condemn white supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities as we saw in Kenosha and as we've seen in Portland? Are you prepared to specifically do that?
The video places the photo of the kid right when Wallace references Kenosha.

You are a font of misinformation but no one can watch this video and think it labels Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Why aren't you people calling for Fox News and Chris Wallace to be sued? He's the one who referenced Kenosha.

This is just more disingenuous posturing from people who have no interest in engaging in good faith.
Joe Biden and his team produced the video and overdubbed Wallace's question. Joe Biden and his team (not Wallace) put Rittenhouse's picture in juxtaposition to a question about white supremacists and militia groups. Do you truly not understand that or are you just dissembling?

If I tweet "Pedophilia is Bad" and put up a picture of you, would you interpret that to be the suggestion that you're a pedophile? Of course you would.


Here's BG acknowledging there was a video and the contents yet he now claims to never have seen it. Not a good look for BG.



Not real:



I can't say for a fact that pizza Gate moron, white supremacist and anti-Semite Jack POS is the first to mislead people like you into believing that Biden's ad unfairly targeted Rittenhouse, but it certainly seems that his misinformation campaign ultimately found its way to you and influenced your opinion.

I was wrong in claiming that Rittenhouse picture was tweeted alone. I was correct in stating that he essentially called Rittenhouse a white supremacist - even snopes agrees.
Unit2Sucks
How long do you want to ignore this user?
BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Exhibit Q on why Glenn Greenwald is no more trustworthy than the "mainstream media" he loves to rail against:







No, he never provided an answer to the main question ("Which US outlets reported that Rittenhouse's victims were Black?"). Greenwald criticizes the liberal media for pushing falsehoods that further a favored narrative by . . . pushing a falsehood that furthers his favored narrative. He's not any better.
Its fairly obvious. When killings are reported as caused by "white supremacy" or a "white supremacist" the implication is that the people who died were non-white. In the united states a great many people incorrectly believe that and the foreign press is making that same mistake in some cases.
Some people BELIEVE that, but where is the evidence that this was REPORTED by mainstream US outlets?

Remember, Greenwald said he would provide this evidence.
I think that's fair - they didn't explicitly report it. However, if they are calling the incident white supremacism or Rittenhouse a supremacist, what is being implied? Many mainstream media did (and continue to do) that. The narrative carries the implication that the victims where not white.

There are other arguments that can be made about that, but don't you think it is the clear (albeit incorrect) inference? What is the point of calling a shooter a "white supremacist" if the shooting is unrelated to white supremacist beliefs?

And for the record, notwithstanding the rhetoric of some, showing up to protest against and perhaps try to prevent rioting/looting does not make you a white supremacist, nor does saying "blue lives matter". Not saying that was a good choice for a 17 year old (particularly with the weapon) - it wasn't. But that does not make you a white supremacist.

Yes, if any outlet explicitly called Rittenhouse a white supremacist then that would be an unfair characterization and an example of jumping to conclusions. There isn't good evidence that this motivated his actions.

My point is that Greenwald is making the same mistake he accuses others of doing: because he FEELS like the liberal media told a lie about the race of the shooting victims, then it must have been true. Just like how some people FEEL like Rittenhouse must be an example of white supremacy even if the evidence doesn't support that. You don't make arguments against media inaccuracy and bias by also being inaccurate and biased.


This is Twitter and the President of the United States of America:

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html

Biden criticizes Rittenhouse for not condemning white supremists in a tweet of a video with a picture of Rittenhouse. Even those "explicit" is too a high bar, since misleading should qualify, I believe this meets the threshold of explicitly calling Rittenhouse a white supremist.


This is an incredibly disingenuous argument. Biden did mention white supremacists but the video specifically mentioned WS and militia groups. Nowhere in the video or in Biden's tweet was Rittenhouse referred to as a white supremacist. In fact they showed a picture of the kid during the very moment Chris Wallace asked 45 about Kenosha.

I get that you like to play contrarian games, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.



You are peddling bull**** and you know it. The video literally asks if you are willing to condemn white supremist groups and not add to the violence as we saw in Kenosha and then displays an image of Rittenhouse.


I get that you blindly defend liberal causes and then use lawyer speak to justify it, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.
You literally don't know what literally means and are literally misquoting Chris Wallace, which is nothing new for you. The actual question includes a reference to militia groups which is pretty damn relevant to Rittenhouse. Are you incapable of watching and understanding a 50 second video? If you watch it, and have a functioning brain, you would understand how wrong you are.

Here I will make it easier:




The video is attached to Biden's tweet. Whatever DIFFERENT frame of reference you attach to it is irrelevant. Thanks.


Please take a minute, use your brain, and click on the link below.

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html
Lol you can't even post a link so how can we expect you to watch it, let alone absorb it. I guess it's all the more obvious now why you fall prey to so much vaccine misinformation.




??? Thanks for posting what I already posted and then told me what I couldn't post. Man, what is your deal?
You are continuing to lie about the tweet and either failing to understand why or acknowledge it. Your tweet doesn't embed properly in BI because of all of the extra at the end of the string. Mine embeds fine so people don't have to click a link to see the contents of the tweet.

I still don't think you've actually watched the video which is why your repeated assertions are so risible. No one who has seen the video is confused about this. They are either lying about it or they understand the only connection to Rittenhouse is when Chris Wallace mentioned Kenosha specifically right after he mentioned militia groups.

How anti-truth have you become?


Watched it for the third time. Clearly, it shows Rittenhouse right after asking if we are all ready to stand up to white supremacists. While the purpose of the message is to smear Trump (rightfully so), it absolutely strongly equates Rittenhouse to a white supremists. To think otherwise is absolutely insane.
You are truly lost.

Here's the exact quote from Chris Wallace:
Quote:

WALLACE: But are you willing, tonight, to condemn white supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities as we saw in Kenosha and as we've seen in Portland? Are you prepared to specifically do that?
The video places the photo of the kid right when Wallace references Kenosha.

You are a font of misinformation but no one can watch this video and think it labels Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Why aren't you people calling for Fox News and Chris Wallace to be sued? He's the one who referenced Kenosha.

This is just more disingenuous posturing from people who have no interest in engaging in good faith.
Joe Biden and his team produced the video and overdubbed Wallace's question. Joe Biden and his team (not Wallace) put Rittenhouse's picture in juxtaposition to a question about white supremacists and militia groups. Do you truly not understand that or are you just dissembling?

If I tweet "Pedophilia is Bad" and put up a picture of you, would you interpret that to be the suggestion that you're a pedophile? Of course you would.


Here's BG acknowledging there was a video and the contents yet he now claims to never have seen it. Not a good look for BG.



Not real:



I can't say for a fact that pizza Gate moron, white supremacist and anti-Semite Jack POS is the first to mislead people like you into believing that Biden's ad unfairly targeted Rittenhouse, but it certainly seems that his misinformation campaign ultimately found its way to you and influenced your opinion.

I was wrong in claiming that Rittenhouse picture was tweeted alone. I was correct in stating that he essentially called Rittenhouse a white supremacist - even snopes agrees.


Pathetic argument. Your entire argument was predicated on fake news and fell apart and now you pretend like nothing has changed.

BearGoggles said:

It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.


This was the crux of your argument which you followed up with your (now even obvious to you) hopelessly inapt pedophila hypo. You don't get to "sorry not sorry" after your entire argument falls apart.

Whatever happened to personal responsibility? You lost a lot of credibility when you go on for days accusing Biden of doing something he didn't do because you were influenced by pizza gating morons and couldn't be bothered to watch a few seconds of video while arguing vociferously against a common sense interpretation of the original source which people like Sycasey and I explained in excruciating detail.

This is like punting on third down down by a TD late in a game. Sorry not sorry is just weak move here. You should just own up to it now thst you've been caught with your pants down. Oops, I hope I didn't just give you an idea for your next weak sauce pedo argument.
oski003
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Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

BearGoggles said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

Unit2Sucks said:

oski003 said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

BearGoggles said:

sycasey said:

Exhibit Q on why Glenn Greenwald is no more trustworthy than the "mainstream media" he loves to rail against:







No, he never provided an answer to the main question ("Which US outlets reported that Rittenhouse's victims were Black?"). Greenwald criticizes the liberal media for pushing falsehoods that further a favored narrative by . . . pushing a falsehood that furthers his favored narrative. He's not any better.
Its fairly obvious. When killings are reported as caused by "white supremacy" or a "white supremacist" the implication is that the people who died were non-white. In the united states a great many people incorrectly believe that and the foreign press is making that same mistake in some cases.
Some people BELIEVE that, but where is the evidence that this was REPORTED by mainstream US outlets?

Remember, Greenwald said he would provide this evidence.
I think that's fair - they didn't explicitly report it. However, if they are calling the incident white supremacism or Rittenhouse a supremacist, what is being implied? Many mainstream media did (and continue to do) that. The narrative carries the implication that the victims where not white.

There are other arguments that can be made about that, but don't you think it is the clear (albeit incorrect) inference? What is the point of calling a shooter a "white supremacist" if the shooting is unrelated to white supremacist beliefs?

And for the record, notwithstanding the rhetoric of some, showing up to protest against and perhaps try to prevent rioting/looting does not make you a white supremacist, nor does saying "blue lives matter". Not saying that was a good choice for a 17 year old (particularly with the weapon) - it wasn't. But that does not make you a white supremacist.

Yes, if any outlet explicitly called Rittenhouse a white supremacist then that would be an unfair characterization and an example of jumping to conclusions. There isn't good evidence that this motivated his actions.

My point is that Greenwald is making the same mistake he accuses others of doing: because he FEELS like the liberal media told a lie about the race of the shooting victims, then it must have been true. Just like how some people FEEL like Rittenhouse must be an example of white supremacy even if the evidence doesn't support that. You don't make arguments against media inaccuracy and bias by also being inaccurate and biased.


This is Twitter and the President of the United States of America:

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html

Biden criticizes Rittenhouse for not condemning white supremists in a tweet of a video with a picture of Rittenhouse. Even those "explicit" is too a high bar, since misleading should qualify, I believe this meets the threshold of explicitly calling Rittenhouse a white supremist.


This is an incredibly disingenuous argument. Biden did mention white supremacists but the video specifically mentioned WS and militia groups. Nowhere in the video or in Biden's tweet was Rittenhouse referred to as a white supremacist. In fact they showed a picture of the kid during the very moment Chris Wallace asked 45 about Kenosha.

I get that you like to play contrarian games, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.



You are peddling bull**** and you know it. The video literally asks if you are willing to condemn white supremist groups and not add to the violence as we saw in Kenosha and then displays an image of Rittenhouse.


I get that you blindly defend liberal causes and then use lawyer speak to justify it, but you can't possibly be daft enough to believe what you wrote.
You literally don't know what literally means and are literally misquoting Chris Wallace, which is nothing new for you. The actual question includes a reference to militia groups which is pretty damn relevant to Rittenhouse. Are you incapable of watching and understanding a 50 second video? If you watch it, and have a functioning brain, you would understand how wrong you are.

Here I will make it easier:




The video is attached to Biden's tweet. Whatever DIFFERENT frame of reference you attach to it is irrelevant. Thanks.


Please take a minute, use your brain, and click on the link below.

https://twitter.com/JoeBiden/status/1311268302950260737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1311268302950260737%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-19558365972812242231.ampproject.net%2F2111060251009%2Fframe.html
Lol you can't even post a link so how can we expect you to watch it, let alone absorb it. I guess it's all the more obvious now why you fall prey to so much vaccine misinformation.




??? Thanks for posting what I already posted and then told me what I couldn't post. Man, what is your deal?
You are continuing to lie about the tweet and either failing to understand why or acknowledge it. Your tweet doesn't embed properly in BI because of all of the extra at the end of the string. Mine embeds fine so people don't have to click a link to see the contents of the tweet.

I still don't think you've actually watched the video which is why your repeated assertions are so risible. No one who has seen the video is confused about this. They are either lying about it or they understand the only connection to Rittenhouse is when Chris Wallace mentioned Kenosha specifically right after he mentioned militia groups.

How anti-truth have you become?


Watched it for the third time. Clearly, it shows Rittenhouse right after asking if we are all ready to stand up to white supremacists. While the purpose of the message is to smear Trump (rightfully so), it absolutely strongly equates Rittenhouse to a white supremists. To think otherwise is absolutely insane.
You are truly lost.

Here's the exact quote from Chris Wallace:
Quote:

WALLACE: But are you willing, tonight, to condemn white supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence in a number of these cities as we saw in Kenosha and as we've seen in Portland? Are you prepared to specifically do that?
The video places the photo of the kid right when Wallace references Kenosha.

You are a font of misinformation but no one can watch this video and think it labels Rittenhouse a white supremacist. Why aren't you people calling for Fox News and Chris Wallace to be sued? He's the one who referenced Kenosha.

This is just more disingenuous posturing from people who have no interest in engaging in good faith.
Joe Biden and his team produced the video and overdubbed Wallace's question. Joe Biden and his team (not Wallace) put Rittenhouse's picture in juxtaposition to a question about white supremacists and militia groups. Do you truly not understand that or are you just dissembling?

If I tweet "Pedophilia is Bad" and put up a picture of you, would you interpret that to be the suggestion that you're a pedophile? Of course you would.


Here's BG acknowledging there was a video and the contents yet he now claims to never have seen it. Not a good look for BG.



Not real:



I can't say for a fact that pizza Gate moron, white supremacist and anti-Semite Jack POS is the first to mislead people like you into believing that Biden's ad unfairly targeted Rittenhouse, but it certainly seems that his misinformation campaign ultimately found its way to you and influenced your opinion.

I was wrong in claiming that Rittenhouse picture was tweeted alone. I was correct in stating that he essentially called Rittenhouse a white supremacist - even snopes agrees.


Pathetic argument. Your entire argument was predicated on fake news and fell apart and now you pretend like nothing has changed.

BearGoggles said:

It was a suggestion, not a mere association. Biden personally tweeted that Trump "refused to disavow" white supremacists" and posted a picture of Rittenhouse - and ONLY Rittenhoue.


This was the crux of your argument which you followed up with your (now even obvious to you) hopelessly inapt pedophila hypo. You don't get to "sorry not sorry" after your entire argument falls apart.

Whatever happened to personal responsibility? You lost a lot of credibility when you go on for days accusing Biden of doing something he didn't do because you were influenced by pizza gating morons and couldn't be bothered to watch a few seconds of video while arguing vociferously against a common sense interpretation of the original source which people like Sycasey and I explained in excruciating detail.

This is like punting on third down down by a TD late in a game. Sorry not sorry is just weak move here. You should just own up to it now thst you've been caught with your pants down. Oops, I hope I didn't just give you an idea for your next weak sauce pedo argument.


I agree with BearGoggles here and am glad he corrected himself as far as the still shot. The tweet effectively and wrongly calls Rittenhouse a White Supremacist.
going4roses
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Unit2Sucks
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Who could have seen this coming.


BearForce2
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Meanwhile, they are many out there who still believe Rittenhouse shot and killed 3 black people.
Unit2Sucks
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just more evidence that Rittenhouse is a disingenuous POS.

Unit2Sucks
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Look at who can't give up his 15 minutes of fame.
Kill a few dudes and now he is demanding face time with POTUS. Who does he think he is, Kid Rock?



They really did develop a warped sense of what our country stands for and what our Presidents are supposed to do.
 
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