movielover said:

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Haloski said:

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Putin's still a really good person and Russia is a beacon of freedom, correct? I just want to make sure I'm keeping up with reality.

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I haven't seen anybody here say Putin was a good or moral person.

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Please don't tell Cal88 about this. They'll be crestfallen. We can keep it to ourselves.

movielover said:

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Haloski said:

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Putin's still a really good person and Russia is a beacon of freedom, correct? I just want to make sure I'm keeping up with reality.

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I haven't seen anybody here say Putin was a good or moral person. Many acknowledge that NATO in Ukraine was an existential threat to Russia - even Barry knew this, some academics knew this. See the Cuban Missile Crisis for reference.

Putin saw a weak Biden / Obama, saw Nuland and our CIA cavorting, got tired of the Civil war, and acted. He saw our stupidity in Afghanistan and knew we were impotent. He moved, but with only 200K military, the idea he was going to invade Poland / Europe is hysterical.

Two months in the framework of a peace deal was put together. Zelensky the non-Ukranian speaker ran on peace. Biden Obama sent Boris Johnson to nix the
deal; Austin said he wanted to "weaken" Russia. The rest is history. Russia is now pushing a 1 million man army, has battle-hardened troops, drones from Iran and stronger ties to North Korea and China, along with 20% of Ukraine. Meanwhile, the western powers can't produce ammunition, and every time they lose face someone is talking about nukes.

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Agree we never should've talked about / thought about Ukraine in NATO.
Agree Putin never intended to go into Poland and points westward.

Disagree: Putin "saw our stupidity in Afghanistan and knew we were impotent". Instead, he thought he was looking at Russia in the late 20th century.
Disagree: Russia might be stronger militarily now, only in the sense that they got a chance to see how screwed up they were. LOL, Russia is running out of young men and citizens who would want to do this again.
Disagree: We are stronger for having gotten a good look at what Russia can do and what non-nuclear war is evolving into.
Disagree: If we are so motivated, we can make plenty of ammunition

Putin has such a low opinion of the intellect of the average American that he is probably selling his claim that he prefers that Biden wins in 2024.

*"Putin "saw our stupidity in Afghanistan and knew we were impotent"…..especially when compared and contrasted with the Russian rocket scientist game plan for invading Afghanistan which contributed significantly to the collapse of the Soviet Union.

Haloski said:

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movielover said:

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Haloski said:

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Putin's still a really good person and Russia is a beacon of freedom, correct? I just want to make sure I'm keeping up with reality.

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I haven't seen anybody here say Putin was a good or moral person.

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Please don't tell Cal88 about this. They'll be crestfallen. We can keep it to ourselves.

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"They"?? lol

A war of lies - one common aspect about all US wars in our lifetime (Vietnam, Iraq, Libya etc) is that they were based on lies. Ukraine as a proxy war is no different.

A WAR OF LIES

The war in Ukraine is based on lies — lies about how it started, how it’s going, and how it will end.

We are told that Ukraine is winning when in fact it is losing. We are told that the war makes NATO stronger when in fact it is depleting it. We are told that…

— David Sacks (@DavidSacks) February 17, 2024

"The war in Ukraine is based on lies lies about how it started, how it's going, and how it will end.

We are told that Ukraine is winning when in fact it is losing. We are told that the war makes NATO stronger when in fact it is depleting it. We are told that Ukraine's biggest problem is a lack of funds from the U.S. Congress when in fact the West can't produce enough ammunition a problem that will take years to fix. We are told that Russia is suffering greater casualties when in fact Ukraine is running out of soldiers another problem money can't fix.

We are told that the world is with us when in fact the Global Majority believes U.S. policy is the height of folly. We are told that there is no opportunity to make peace when in fact we have rejected multiple opportunities for a negotiated settlement. We are told that if Ukraine keeps fighting, it will improve its negotiating position when in fact the terms will only get much worse than what was already available and rejected.

Nevertheless the lies will succeed in dragging out the war. Congress will appropriate more funds. Russia will take more territory. Ukraine will mobilize more young men and women to feed into the meat grinder. Discontent will mount. Eventually there will be a crisis in Kiev and the Zelensky government will be toppled.

And then, when the war is finally lost, when the whole country lays in smoldering ruins on a funeral pyre of their own making, the liars will say "well we tried." Having prevented any alternative, having smeared anyone who told the truth as puppets for the enemy, the liars will say "We did our best. We stood up to Putin."

In fact, they will claim, we would have succeeded but for the fifth column of Putin apologists who stabbed the Ukrainians in the back. Then, having shifted blame and patted themselves on the back, they will blithely move on to the next war, as they moved onto Ukraine after their disasters in Afghanistan and Iraq.

The lies are comprehensive but they will work."

Ukraine lost.
The CIA lost.

click me..

pic.twitter.com/9T6MNneA8E

— mike luckovich (@mluckovichajc) February 21, 2024

smh said:

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click me..

pic.twitter.com/9T6MNneA8E

— mike luckovich (@mluckovichajc) February 21, 2024

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Let's take a trip down the memory hole of all the people who lied to us and told us Ukraine was winning or going to win the war.

“Ukraine will win.” pic.twitter.com/QxH8wBl8a3

— Matt Orfalea (@0rf) February 24, 2024

And a quick 2 minute summary of the war for those who don't just accept U.S. war propaganda

THE UKRAINE WAR IN 2 MINUTES@aaronjmate | @AJUpFront pic.twitter.com/FxHVbCNcOT

— Filipe Neves 🇵🇹 🇵🇸 (@_FilipeNeves) February 23, 2024

Genocide Joe said:

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Let's take a trip down the memory hole of all the people who lied to us and told us Ukraine was winning or going to win the war.

“Ukraine will win.” pic.twitter.com/QxH8wBl8a3

— Matt Orfalea (@0rf) February 24, 2024

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^Sean Penn and Malcolm Nance, lulz. At least we knew these two are clowns, but the gallery of cable news MIC-sponsored experts from DC is something else.

Anderson Cooper, on the other hand, seemed to have consistently maintained a skeptical expression on his face.

"unprovoked" Russian invasion of Ukraine

https://freedomfirstnetwork.com/2024/02/bombshell-report-cia-built-12-secret-spy-bases-in-ukraine-and-waged-shadow-war-for-last-decade

"This means that with the disclosure of the longtime "closely guarded secret" the world just got a big step closer to WW3, given it means the CIA is largely responsible for the effectiveness of the recent spate of attacks which have included direct drone hits on key oil refineries and energy infrastructure."

What could possibly go wrong?

Did You Know:

According to the NY Times, during the Maidan coup, an unmarked US plane carrying the head of the CIA landed in Kiev

His role was to fuse the CIA and new Ukraine intel services into a regime to wage shadow war on Russia

That man's name?

John Brennan

— Jack Poso 🇺🇸 (@JackPosobiec) February 26, 2024

Are we allowed to ask if the CIA building 12 secret bases on the Ukraine border with Russia still means the Russian invasion was unprovoked?

— Jack Poso 🇺🇸 (@JackPosobiec) February 26, 2024

THE CIA SHADOW WAR AGAINST RUSSIA

THE CIA BUILT 12 SHADOW BASES ACROSS UKRAINE ON THE BORDER WITH RUSSIA DURING THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION

WHILE HUNTER BIDEN WAS ON THE BOARD OF BURISMA

The startling new revelations have some strategy, I'm guessing partly a desire to get another $100 Billion - with no Inspector General - flowing into the MIC.

movielover said:

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The startling new revelations have some strategy, I'm guessing partly a desire to get another $100 Billion - with no Inspector General - flowing into the MIC.

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The new strategy is to shift from a conventional war, where Russia can never be defeated, to an asymetric insurgency/terror war on Russia using drones. That's the domain of intel agencies and covert operations, and that's why the NYT is now running stories on secret bases in Ukraine.

It's not going to work though, because terror attacks inside Russia galvanize their public opinion, and also because the Russians have very good human and signal intel capabilities in Ukraine and domestically.

Russia has as many engineers as we have w less than half the population. They'll adapt, and at the same time inflict more pain and death. But now our deeds are in the open.

Do you see it? Don't these images look familiar? Deja vu from the protests in the US. https://t.co/vvyDO2Wvkt

— DrKathrynPhD- typer of typos (@KathMLee1) February 27, 2024

"A Ukrainian court recently ruled that the snipers firing on Maidan protestors primarily operated from Hotel Ukraina, a location controlled by U.S.-backed extremists."

Zippergate said:

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Do you see it? Don't these images look familiar? Deja vu from the protests in the US. https://t.co/vvyDO2Wvkt

— DrKathrynPhD- typer of typos (@KathMLee1) February 27, 2024

"A Ukrainian court recently ruled that the snipers firing on Maidan protestors primarily operated from Hotel Ukraina, a location controlled by U.S.-backed extremists."

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Same thing happened in the Odessa massacre of May 2014, where around 50 Russophone locals were burned alive by Ukrainian nationalist extremists, many unarmed protestors were shot by these Azov types, who were working with the local police:

Colonel Douglass McGregor says Russia is prioritizing destroying Ukraine's military; NATO / US are concentrating on taking land, partly for political reasons - PR to get more military $$$.

Russia links space-based satellites with strike systems. Integrated air defense. They see everything. If we sent in our air force, we'd be taken out, too.

Ukraine is being slaughtered. New evidence of 120,000 New Ukranian graves. Their army is broken (not defeated).



I've heard several reports where 'struggling' Russia outproduces Western NATO ammo production by a 7-to-1 ratio. Russia is running 12 hour shifts, has expanded current facilities, and is building brand new facilities.

movielover said:

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Colonel Douglass McGregor says Russia is prioritizing destroying Ukraine's military; NATO / US are concentrating on taking land, partly for political reasons - PR to get more military $$$.

Russia links space-based satellites with strike systems. Integrated air defense. They see everything. If we sent in our air force, we'd be taken out, too.

Ukraine is being slaughtered. New evidence of 120,000 New Ukranian graves. Their army is broken (not defeated).



I've heard several reports where 'struggling' Russia outproduces Western NATO ammo production by a 7-to-1 ratio. Russia is running 12 hour shifts, has expanded current facilities, and is building brand new facilities.

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"Russia links space-based satellites with strike systems. Integrated air defense."

Doesn't Ukraine have the same thing with the help of its NATO allies?

Propaganda is only part of Russia's solution, suppression of free speech is also critical.

this is the regime Tucker Carlson prefers to our democratically elected government https://t.co/MGiYCxmGmB

— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) February 27, 2024

If you can't criticize the Kremlin, it's hard to report on the war. People in Russia won't realize how their "state of the art" fighters do when up against NATO's obsolete weaponry.

💥 Ukraine shot down two more Russian Su-34 striker bomber jets today. https://t.co/f7fgeReyKA pic.twitter.com/czrzxRhfWh

— Igor Sushko (@igorsushko) February 27, 2024

And Russia appreciates that it's shills in the west help amplify their ridiculous propaganda. Much of it paid, but you obviously have unpaid useful idiots as well.

Russian propagandist Simonyan thanks the Russian network of undercover propagandists who work in the West. pic.twitter.com/38RFnf7hEL

— Anton Gerashchenko (@Gerashchenko_en) February 27, 2024

It's time for Biden and his team to stop slow-walking aid. Send more of our obsolete metal to Ukraine, it's more than good enough in the fight against Russia's best.

Defense specialist Stephen Blank note that President Biden is legally entitled "to sell, or gift, US military equipment no longer needed by the armed forces."
The US has 3,700 M1 tanks, 2,000 Bradley IVFs, etc. in storage.
Just do it!https://t.co/tkbBwHGAwd

— Anders Åslund (@anders_aslund) February 27, 2024

Last week Zelenskyy claimed 31,000 Ukrainian troops have been killed and 180,000 Russian troops. Undoubtedly the first number is too low and the second too high.

Before the invasion I wouldn't have purchased a used car from either country. Both are untrustworthy, as are their respective media spinmeisters.

Prigozhin, in control of the Wagner Group until Putin orchestrated a Masters of the Air death for him, said this about Russian troop fatalities back in June, 2023:

" Wagner PMC chief Yevgeny Prigozhin confirmed that his organization had lost over 20,000 troops killed by May 25, 2023. He went on to claim that overall, the Russian military had lost 120,000 dead in Ukraine by late June. He accused the Ministry of Defence of systematically downplaying Russian losses.

"Wagner chief says 20,000 of its troops killed in Bakhmut battle." Al Jazeera. May 25, 2023. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/5/25/wagner-chief-says-20000-of-its-troops-killed-in-bakhmut-battle


"Kunnas: Prigozhin destroys official narrative of Ukraine war in Russia" Eesti Rahvusringhaaling. June 25, 2023.
https://news.err.ee/1609017332/kunnas-prigozhin-destroys-official-narrative-of-ukraine-war-in-russia

*Feel free to explain why Prigozhan was lying and link your source. Also provide links providing support for the argument that your sources for troop deaths are rock solid with no motive for being untruthful.

* If Prigozhan figure of 120,000 as of 6/23 is credible, then adding the Russian troop deaths that have occurred in the last 8 months May bring the totals not so far south of Zelenskyy's 180k figure.

bearister said:

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Last week Zelensky claimed 31,000 Ukrainian troops have been killed and 180,000 Russian troops. Undoubtedly the first number is too low and the second too high.

Before the invasion I wouldn't have purchased a used car from either country. Both are untrustworthy, as are their respective media spinmeisters.

Prigozhin, in control of the Wagner Group, until Putin orchestrated a Masters of the Air death for him, said this about Russian troop fatalities back in June, 2023:

" Wagner PMC chief Yevgeny Prigozhin confirmed that his organization had lost over 20,000 troops killed by May 25, 2023. He went on to claim that overall, the Russian military had lost 120,000 dead in Ukraine by late June. He accused the Ministry of Defence of systematically downplaying Russian losses.

"Wagner chief says 20,000 of its troops killed in Bakhmut battle." Al Jazeera. May 25, 2023. https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/5/25/wagner-chief-says-20000-of-its-troops-killed-in-bakhmut-battle


"Kunnas: Prigozhin destroys official narrative of Ukraine war in Russia" Eesti Rahvusringhaaling. June 25, 2023.
https://news.err.ee/1609017332/kunnas-prigozhin-destroys-official-narrative-of-ukraine-war-in-russia

*Feel free to explain why Prigozhan was lying and link your source. Also provide links providing support for the argument that your sources for troop deaths is rock solid with no motive for being untruthful.

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A prominent pro-Russian propagandist named Murz recently "committed suicide" not long after expressing his disappointment in the number of Russians who died in Avdiivka. People said that his number was likely still low because he was such a committed propagandist, but it was far higher than the shills claim when they make up casualty numbers.

Quote:

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Morozov, who went by the pseudonym Murz on Telegram, was an ultra-nationalist commentator who fought alongside Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine in 2014 and participated in Russia's full-scale invasion in 2022.

On Sunday, Morozov wrote to his 120,000 followers on Telegram that Russia lost 16,000 personnel and 300 pieces of armour during its months-long capture of Avdiivka. The post drew heavy criticism from senior Russian propagandists, who accused the blogger of "slandering the Russian defence ministry".

In Morozov's final messages on Tuesday morning, he announced his suicide and said he was pressured by his superiors to delete the post detailing the number of casualties in Avdiivka. Several people close to Morozov on Tuesday confirmed his death, with some saying that he had shot himself.

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From before his "suicide."

Uhh some painful doomposting from rus volunteer Murz, he found out the numbers of irreversible losses in Avdiivka and it's not making him happy. And he really seems to like Syrsky.

Keep in mind that he is risking his ass by voicing this information, so it must be really getting… pic.twitter.com/qCli94DHpu

— WarTranslated (Dmitri) (@wartranslated) February 18, 2024

Apparently not.

According to Colonel McGregor, the Russians would also pick off American airplanes.

RE: the death numbers, we know from multiple sources that Russia has used massive amounts of artillery in this 'war of attrition', and we've heard figures of from a 3-to-1, to a 7-to-1 ratio in Russias favor.

Ukraine has also been shut out of the sky for basically the last year, and is typically launching 6,000 155 shells per day.Russia 20K, 30K, up to 60K per day. Since Ukraine's air force is now highly limited, they're enlisting uncles, grandpas, and pregnant women - and they have limited ammo - how are they killing large numbers of Russians? Russia has also been coordinating artillery strikes with Wagner & drones. There were previously posted large new cemeteries in Ukraine 18 months ago, now another massive new cemetery, and prosthetics are backordered for years.

bear2034 said:

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Did You Know:

According to the NY Times, during the Maidan coup, an unmarked US plane carrying the head of the CIA landed in Kiev

His role was to fuse the CIA and new Ukraine intel services into a regime to wage shadow war on Russia

That man's name?

John Brennan

— Jack Poso 🇺🇸 (@JackPosobiec) February 26, 2024

Are we allowed to ask if the CIA building 12 secret bases on the Ukraine border with Russia still means the Russian invasion was unprovoked?

— Jack Poso 🇺🇸 (@JackPosobiec) February 26, 2024

THE CIA SHADOW WAR AGAINST RUSSIA

THE CIA BUILT 12 SHADOW BASES ACROSS UKRAINE ON THE BORDER WITH RUSSIA DURING THE OBAMA ADMINISTRATION

WHILE HUNTER BIDEN WAS ON THE BOARD OF BURISMA

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CIA, Ukraine Exchange Pre-Divorce Propaganda:https://t.co/GAA0SvlEqh pic.twitter.com/CIoYhnASFq

— Matt Taibbi (@mtaibbi) February 27, 2024

https://substack.com/inbox/post/142098661

Quote:

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Over the weekend the New York Times published an epic expos. "The Spy War: How the C.I.A. Secretly Helps Ukraine Fight Putin," by Adam Entous and Mitchell Schwirtz, described a decade of CIA-Ukrainian cooperation, featuring details that would never reach public ears under normal circumstances. The opening is worth quoting at length:

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Quote:

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When intelligence sources line up by the hundred to fill newspapers with "secret" details, they're almost always doing one of two things: spreading disinformation, or "pre-bunking" embarrassing future revelations. The lavishly overwritten "secret untold story" that puts advance spin on ugly leaks has become a popular genre across this century's many giant intelligence screwups.

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Quote:

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Meanwhile, on the same day the Times piece came out, aforementioned defense intelligence chief Budanov gave an extraordinary impromptu interview. Asked about the death of Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny, Budanov said, "I may disappoint you, but we know he died from a blood clot. It's more or less confirmed. This is not taken from the Internet."

The comments were a missile up America's messaging backside.

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https://media.tenor.com/uARaKFpSkaMAAAAC/anger-management-jack-nicholson.gif