Will the NRA's grip on the GOP diminish in your lifetime? (Y/N)

BearNIt
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Now comes the Russians to further complicate the issue of gun control in the United States. Anyone who doesn't acknowledge that we are under attack from Russia is a FREAKIN MORON. Saying that the only way to prevent school shootings is to arm the staff is MORONIC! Hiding behind the 2nd Amendment after these mass shootings is COWARDICE. THE NRA SHOULD NOT BE RUNNING OUR GOVERNMENT ESPECIALLY SINCE THEY PROMOTE A PRODUCT THAT IS BEING USED TO KILL CHILDREN WHO ARE JUST TRYING FIGURE OUT WHO THEY ARE GOING TO TAKE TO PROM OR TRYING TO LEARN HISTORY.

https://www.wired.com/story/pro-gun-russian-bots-flood-twitter-after-parkland-shooting/

Yes, I own a gun, one gun not multiple guns. This is not just a mental health problem, it is a problem with people believing that they should be able to own as many guns as possible and carry a gun whenever and wherever they want. Trump says that we have a mental health problem yet his attack on healthcare cuts mental health services for millions of people. ENOUGH WITH THE PRAYERS, HOW ABOUT SOME REAL ACTION TO PREVENT SOMEONE ELSE"S KID FROM BEING BLOWN AWAY WHILE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO DO AN ALGEBRA PROBLEM!

The 2018 midterms can't get here soon enough.
sp4149
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BearNIt said:

Now comes the Russians to further complicate the issue of gun control in the United States. ...

https://www.wired.com/story/pro-gun-russian-bots-flood-twitter-after-parkland-shooting/

...
The 2018 midterms can't get here soon enough.

AS long as the Administration lets Russians interfere in our elections, you expect a different result?
Another Bear
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golden sloth said:

Another Bear said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

I feel that change will only come when some sick person kills a minimum of 500 people (not including himself) in one session, but that new record would have to be a big jump from the previous USA record at the time so that it's not just an incremental increase. It would have to be a minimum of 500 killed and break a previous record that was still under 100. I think in that scenario there's a chance Republicans in Congress would be ready to contribute to a solution.

500 might not be enough. The American public has been desensitized to mass shootings.

The ways I see the collaboration ending are:

a) The GOP die as a party.
b) Mass shooting at a NRA convention. Everyone carrying couldn't stop it. 500 die.
c) Current leadership dies off and there's a vacuum, during another crisis, like the GOP dying.
d) Newer, better, cheaper killing technology emerges.




You forgot (E) Start arming black lives matter and other minority rights groups.

I didn't forget that. But a guy like Bannon or Miller would put that in. Have a nice day.
MinotStateBeav
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The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
B.A. Bearacus
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MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
Minot, I hear you, mental health services and in-school mental health evaluations are needed. Will there be any money left over to pay for these services after the Republican tax scam? I don't believe we should approach this problem from a single dimension. The AR-15 (and bump stocks) need to be BANNED right now. But the AR-15 is so fun! **** that, and **** LaPierre. The difference in killing efficiency between an AR-15 and a handgun is VERY SIGNIFICANT. Each additional potentially saved life matters.
calbear93
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MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
I think it's a combination of factors. Yours was the first reasonable post on this thread. But let's be honest, there hasn't been much of a serious discussion on this thread or by the left in general other than the same folks trying to increase the ante on being unproductively snarky and patting themselves on the back for how anti-gun they are.

Let's get aligned on one point. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever for people to have semi-automatic weapons. We don't allow people to purchase bazooka. Limiting arms is clearly constitutional. I can understand actual hunting rifles, but weapons intended to kill people in great quantity really cannot be justified.

Let's also get aligned on another point. Guns alone are not killing these folks. There is something seriously wrong with the media (regular and social) exposure that's turning these folks into dehumanized killers. We had mass murders before but not to this extent. Hollywood and social media companies and players that the left love so much and will not criticize haven't taken one lick of responsibility. What are people's suggestions on how we limit the negative influences that are warping the minds of the people living here? If we think limiting guns is the only solution needed, we are not thinking any more clearly than the gun waiving fools.
drizzlybears brother
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calbear93 said:

MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
I think it's a combination of factors. Yours was the first reasonable post on this thread. But let's be honest, there hasn't been much of a serious discussion on this thread or by the left in general other than the same folks trying to increase the ante on being unproductively snarky and patting themselves on the back for how anti-gun they are.

Let's get aligned on one point. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever for people to have semi-automatic weapons. We don't allow people to purchase bazooka. Limiting arms is clearly constitutional. I can understand actual hunting rifles, but weapons intended to kill people in great quantity really cannot be justified.

Let's also get aligned on another point. Guns alone are not killing these folks. There is something seriously wrong with the media (regular and social) exposure that's turning these folks into dehumanized killers. We had mass murders before but not to this extent. Hollywood and social media companies and players that the left love so much and will not criticize haven't taken one lick of responsibility. What are people's suggestions on how we limit the negative influences that are warping the minds of the people living here? If we think limiting guns is the only solution needed, we are not thinking any more clearly than the gun waiving fools.
Vote to fund it and you'll be taken more seriously.

Also, I hope you see the irony in your dismissal of snark.
drizzlybears brother
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MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
Your base point that we can do better on care for mental health is fair, but it's the guns that are killing people. It's not the only means to kill people en mass, but it's the easiest.
calbear93
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Never said my response wasn't snarky.

Vote to fund what? Why is extra funding the natural knee-jerk response, as if spending other people's money or voting Democrat (which I did - didn't work) will accomplish anything. I assume the reason there are so many massacres is not because the left is being tight with their money, is it? Not a very reasonable response on your part.
B.A. Bearacus
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sp4149
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MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.
The teenage gunman accused of slaughtering 17 people at a Florida high school on Wednesday had posted a photo of himself wearing one of President Donald Trump's signature red MAGA hats on Instagram, the social media site confirmed.

The photo in question shows 19-year-old Nikolas Cruz wearing a hat that features Trump's "Make America Great Again" campaign slogan and an American-flag-colored bandana that covers the bottom half of his face.



Notably, a white supremacist organization called the Republic of Florida admitted on Thursday that Cruz was associated with the group, according to the Anti-Defamation League. And he had gone on missions with the ROF before his mother died last November, three months ago; he was already part of a new family of domestic terrorists.

Another Bear
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MinotStateBeav said:

The issue imho isn't guns..the issue is that we have pathetically bad mental health system in this country. This kid lost his mother a year ago, his father before that (he was adopted). Lost his girlfriend, then was expelled from HS. His life was falling apart and WE failed him and WE failed his victims. Yes he shouldn't of had a gun..but he shouldn't have wanted to kill other kids in the first place. I get so frustrated that we simply don't care enough to deal with the mental health crisis in this country.

Agree...but you know, if he didn't have easy access to guns, he probably couldn't slaughter 17 people.

So yes, the mental health care in this country is subpar and poor but that doesn't change the reality that guns are very easy to get in the U.S. if you want them.
drizzlybears brother
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calbear93 said:

Never said my response wasn't snarky.

Vote to fund what? Why is extra funding the natural knee-jerk response, as if spending other people's money or voting Democrat (which I did - didn't work) will accomplish anything. I assume the reason there are so many massacres is not because the left is being tight with their money, is it? Not a very reasonable response on your part.
I didn't say you said your response wasn't snarky.

Where do you think mental health resources come from?
prospeCt
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B.A. Bearacus
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calbear93 said:


There is something seriously wrong with the media (regular and social) exposure that's turning these folks into dehumanized killers. We had mass murders before but not to this extent. Hollywood and social media companies and players that the left love so much and will not criticize haven't taken one lick of responsibility. What are people's suggestions on how we limit the negative influences that are warping the minds of the people living here? If we think limiting guns is the only solution needed, we are not thinking any more clearly than the gun waiving fools.

Occam's Razor time. The Assault Weapons Ban was left to expire in 2004. Notice how all these high death toll massacres involve the AR-15, which had been banned prior to 2004? Look to that and not tv.

Other compounding factors: the existence of 357 million fire arms in the US and an NRA-controlled Congress that does everything in its power to do the least anount possible to curb unfettered access to guns.

okaydo
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So, is President Trump going to comfort the victims in Florida as presidents usually do?
B.A. Bearacus
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Republicans in Congress are more concerned about NFL players standing for the national anthem than they are about preventing mass killings from firearms. Anyone think I'm wrong?
okaydo
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NFL players kneeling is the biggest plague to our society.
okaydo
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B.A. Bearacus said:

Republicans in Congress are more concerned about NFL players standing for the national anthem than they are about preventing mass killings from firearms. Anyone think I'm wrong?

September 13, 2017:




10 days later:

iwantwinners
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B) No

Duh. Stupid OP and question
sycasey
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It's the guns.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/07/world/americas/mass-shootings-us-international.html
iwantwinners
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B.A. Bearacus said:

Republicans in Congress are more concerned about NFL players standing for the national anthem than they are about preventing mass killings from firearms. Anyone think I'm wrong?
This kind of emotive virtue signaling only works on morons. They criticize not respecting the anthem, but they don't criticize guns that hurt people when somebody points it at someone and pulls the trigger!

Translation: "anybody who doesn't support my specific views on gun control and what to change about the 2nd amendment and gun policy is not concerned about human life. P.S. That makes me better than you. THE END"

As someone put it, "you like to stand on the graves of dead children to make a political point."
Anarchistbear
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graguna
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wayne lapierre is a terroist. responsible for many more american deaths than bin laden.
bearister
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While Florida has a three-day waiting period for handgun purchases, anyone without a felony record, domestic abuse conviction or a handful of other exceptions can walk into a gun store, wait a few minutes to clear a background check, and walk out with an AR-15-style rifle, magazines and ammunition.
Under federal law, you also must be 21 to buy a handgun from a firearms dealer. But 18-year-olds can buy semiautomatic rifles. Axios
Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
prospeCt
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Anarchistbear
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Unit2Sucks
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I've been reading a lot of conservatives blaming the media and entertainment industries for all the mass shootings. It's an interesting thought and it may very well be true that a reduction in media coverage would reduce these killings similar to the impact on suicides and car chases. On the other hand, how can you ask the fourth estate not to cover things like this?

Obviously the government can't do anything about it because of the first amendment so the question is do we the public ask the media to voluntarily choose to leave money on the table? If we can do that, why not do the same with the gun industry and ask them not to sell certain types of firearms?
going4roses
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Hell no!
B.A. Bearacus
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Trump called out mental illness in his words today. Interesting because a year ago he "quietly signed a bill into law... rolling back an Obama-era regulation that made it harder for people with mental illnesses to purchase a gun." [Source: NBC]

Empty words vs actions (signed in the Oval Office).
going4roses
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It's too late there too many guns
sycasey
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B.A. Bearacus said:

Trump called out mental illness in his words today. Interesting because a year ago he "quietly signed a bill into law... rolling back an Obama-era regulation that made it harder for people with mental illnesses to purchase a gun." [Source: NBC]

Empty words vs actions (signed in the Oval Office).


It's abundantly clear the GOP doesn't give a damn about mental illness. It's just a thing they say so they don't have to talk about guns.
Another Bear
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90% of the media is owned by 6 corporations. Generally, TV/media is lowly regulated, unlike the 60s or even 70s where there was the Fairness Doctrine and Equal-time rule. FD is gone. ET is not enforced today.

Because it's a private industry, "if it bleeds, it leads". News viewership must spike after this kind of crisis. Networks probably won't admit revenues go up.
B.A. Bearacus
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Unit2Sucks said:

I've been reading a lot of conservatives blaming the media and entertainment industries for all the mass shootings. It's an interesting thought and it may very well be true that a reduction in media coverage would reduce these killings similar to the impact on suicides and car chases. On the other hand, how can you ask the fourth estate not to cover things like this?



[Source: Business Insider]
calbear93
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drizzlybears brother said:

calbear93 said:

Never said my response wasn't snarky.

Vote to fund what? Why is extra funding the natural knee-jerk response, as if spending other people's money or voting Democrat (which I did - didn't work) will accomplish anything. I assume the reason there are so many massacres is not because the left is being tight with their money, is it? Not a very reasonable response on your part.
I didn't say you said your response wasn't snarky.

Where do you think mental health resources come from?
Who said anything about mental health? This monster wasn't committed. Unless you have some minority report type of technology and revised constitution that allows people to be committed for for potential crimes, funding mental health resources would have prevented this how? Of course you want to seek a simple singular solution and think that the disengagement from Facebook and from all the sex and violence from Hollywood glamorizing dehumanizing behavior had nothing to do with this desire to be famous for killing people. Funding and big government solves everything.
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