Will the NRA's grip on the GOP diminish in your lifetime? (Y/N)

BearDevil
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AunBear89 said:

Not quite. Pence called a quick closed-door pow-wow of NRA honchos, Cheeto Benito, and himself. All sorted out. Frumpy was only joking.


Love to hear what the NRA mofos said to each other before the meeting. "We spent $30M to elect this moron and he still doesn't get gun grabs?!? We'd be way better off with Pence. Now we have to praise and fluff him and tell him exactly what to say again. We also have to write his tweet for him since he'll forget what we told him within 30 seconds. Left on his own, we'll get pure gibberish filled with weird random capitalizations and misspelled words. Stable genius indeed".
iwantwinners
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AunBear89 said:

My understanding (from a SEAL) is that Kyle was an arrogant SOB who thought he was faultless and untouchable. The very notion of him ever thinking he was in danger from anyone/anything is laughable.

To be sure: a SEAL must have a certain amount of arrogance and bravado to become a SEAL. But it also requires a certain amount of self-awareness and introspection to recognize when to hold back. As part of a team, that includes not jeopardizing the success and safety of the team in an effort to achieve individual glory. Kyle was mostly about the glory - not so much the silent warrior type.
This rings true.
Unit2Sucks
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Would it surprise anyone to learn that the NRA also has shady dealings with Russian politicians looking to influence our elections?

https://www.npr.org/2018/03/01/590076949/depth-of-russian-politicians-cultivation-of-nra-ties-revealed
iwantwinners
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BearDevil said:

AunBear89 said:

Not quite. Pence called a quick closed-door pow-wow of NRA honchos, Cheeto Benito, and himself. All sorted out. Frumpy was only joking.


Love to hear what the NRA mofos said to each other before the meeting. "We spent $30M to elect this moron and he still doesn't get gun grabs?!? We'd be way better off with Pence. Now we have to praise and fluff him and tell him exactly what to say again. We also have to write his tweet for him since he'll forget what we told him within 30 seconds. Left on his own, we'll get pure gibberish filled with weird random capitalizations and misspelled words. Stable genius indeed".
When there's rumblings of gun restrictions, gun sales spike.
Another Bear
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going4roses
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Holy roaches
BearNIt
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Is this the type of teacher that Trump and the NRA want armed in a school?

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/teacher-removed-from-classroom-after-report-she-hosts-a-white-supremacist-podcast/ar-BBJTDZd?ocid=iehp&li=BBnbfcL

What happens when she misses a shooter and hits a kid who may not look like her? Who's going to pick up the tab for that "mistake"?
B.A. Bearacus
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Oregon leading. Good on them.
going4roses
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Does that appt to law enforcement?
BearChemist
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BearChemist said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

Lets see if there's more follow-through on this than the transgender in the military ban.


After the Las Vegas shooting it looked like at least bump stock would be banned. Sorry, that didn't happen. Not sure what would make this shooting different. Mid-term year?
Two weeks ago I doubted this shooting will have any different impact. So what happened during these two week: a CNN town hall that fumbled Marco Rubio, another school shooting by a teacher, the unexpected response from DJT that has silenced many conservatives.

Now the congress comes up with..... a school safety bill!? Let me say it one more time: these people in Capitol are spineless toward NRA and I will believe an effective legislative measure when I see it passes both House and Senate and signed by the Oval Office and not scrapped 5 minutes afterward.
going4roses
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Spineless?

Is the relationship by choice or force?
sycasey
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BearChemist said:

BearChemist said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

Lets see if there's more follow-through on this than the transgender in the military ban.


After the Las Vegas shooting it looked like at least bump stock would be banned. Sorry, that didn't happen. Not sure what would make this shooting different. Mid-term year?
Two weeks ago I doubted this shooting will have any different impact. So what happened during these two week: a CNN town hall that fumbled Marco Rubio, another school shooting by a teacher, the unexpected response from DJT that has silenced many conservatives.

Now the congress comes up with..... a school safety bill!? Let me say it one more time: these people in Capitol are spineless toward NRA and I will believe an effective legislative measure when I see it passes both House and Senate and signed by the Oval Office and not scrapped 5 minutes afterward.
The real proof in the pudding will be if this becomes an electoral issue that can get people elected or tossed out of office. Until now, the NRA has been he only side of the gun debate that has wielded this power. The efforts of these high school kids might actually be tilting things in the other direction.

I don't expect the current Congress to accomplish much of anything; these are the people who were elected by NRA supporters in the first place. They're not suddenly going to change their belief system. They have to be replaced by new representatives who think differently.
Another Bear
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The kids from Parkland HS have stepped up big time to present the case for gun control...and they're winning and they have the big Mo...momentum. I don't think you have to fear that Gen-Z will step up. They already have, and it's great to see.

It's very interesting times generational-wise. The NRA's core are early boomers in their late 60s/early 70s. While the kids from Parkland are teens. We're seeing the future playing out now.
BearChemist
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sycasey said:

BearChemist said:

BearChemist said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

Lets see if there's more follow-through on this than the transgender in the military ban.


After the Las Vegas shooting it looked like at least bump stock would be banned. Sorry, that didn't happen. Not sure what would make this shooting different. Mid-term year?
Two weeks ago I doubted this shooting will have any different impact. So what happened during these two week: a CNN town hall that fumbled Marco Rubio, another school shooting by a teacher, the unexpected response from DJT that has silenced many conservatives.

Now the congress comes up with..... a school safety bill!? Let me say it one more time: these people in Capitol are spineless toward NRA and I will believe an effective legislative measure when I see it passes both House and Senate and signed by the Oval Office and not scrapped 5 minutes afterward.
The real proof in the pudding will be if this becomes an electoral issue that can get people elected or tossed out of office. Until now, the NRA has been he only side of the gun debate that has wielded this power. The efforts of these high school kids might actually be tilting things in the other direction.

I don't expect the current Congress to accomplish much of anything; these are the people who were elected by NRA supporters in the first place. They're not suddenly going to change their belief system. They have to be replaced by new representatives who think differently.
You are absolutely right. The question now is if this movement is enough to tip the political scale that has been in place for 50 years. It might not affect this election cycle that much, but in 10 years when these teens are eligible to vote GOP (at least these people in congress) will be sent to the curb.
sycasey
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BearChemist said:

sycasey said:

BearChemist said:

BearChemist said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

Lets see if there's more follow-through on this than the transgender in the military ban.


After the Las Vegas shooting it looked like at least bump stock would be banned. Sorry, that didn't happen. Not sure what would make this shooting different. Mid-term year?
Two weeks ago I doubted this shooting will have any different impact. So what happened during these two week: a CNN town hall that fumbled Marco Rubio, another school shooting by a teacher, the unexpected response from DJT that has silenced many conservatives.

Now the congress comes up with..... a school safety bill!? Let me say it one more time: these people in Capitol are spineless toward NRA and I will believe an effective legislative measure when I see it passes both House and Senate and signed by the Oval Office and not scrapped 5 minutes afterward.
The real proof in the pudding will be if this becomes an electoral issue that can get people elected or tossed out of office. Until now, the NRA has been he only side of the gun debate that has wielded this power. The efforts of these high school kids might actually be tilting things in the other direction.

I don't expect the current Congress to accomplish much of anything; these are the people who were elected by NRA supporters in the first place. They're not suddenly going to change their belief system. They have to be replaced by new representatives who think differently.
You are absolutely right. The question now is if this movement is enough to tip the political scale that has been in place for 50 years. It might not affect this election cycle that much, but in 10 years when these teens are eligible to vote GOP (at least these people in congress) will be sent to the curb.
Hell, these teens are 16 and 17 right now. They'll be eligible to vote in a year or two.
B.A. Bearacus
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sycasey said:

Hell, these teens are 16 and 17 right now. They'll be eligible to vote in a year or two.

[source]

There will be more young voters, but let's give it about 10-12 years (in combination with other demographic changes) to make a consistent difference. Young people (18-29) voting at a lower rate than older people will always be a thing.
BearNIt
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Exposure to civil action is the result of arming teachers.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/analysis-arming-florida-school-staff-could-expose-them-to-suits-experts/ar-BBK1SHm?li=BBnbcA1

B.A. Bearacus
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Once again at Fox: one is not like the others.

Another Bear
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NRA got the Russkie pee-pee video.
bearister
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Another Bear said:

NRA got the Russkie pee-pee video.


....and Stormy has one that goes something like this:

Cancel my subscription to the Resurrection
Send my credentials to the House of Detention
I got some friends inside
Another Bear
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Stoneman Douglas survivor: 'We're the mass shooting generation'

https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/975519489512083456/video/1

These kids have the momentum, so get behind them. They have identified who they are in generational terms, and I have a feeling their mission in life is to correct that. God speed.
iwantwinners
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Another Bear said:

Stoneman Douglas survivor: 'We're the mass shooting generation'

https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/975519489512083456/video/1

These kids have the momentum, so get behind them. They have identified who they are in generational terms, and I have a feeling their mission in life is to correct that. God speed.

These kids are followers, not leaders. They are being used as pawns to advance a political agenda, using emotion and ignorance rally these misled fools. It's difficult to blame them when they don't have parents who sit them down and kick their arse for putting their virtue signaling before a fully sponsored education. These kids are teenagers. Four years ago they were 12. They don't know sh*t. And they are being called on to be the ambassadors of a political agenda. Pathetic.
golden sloth
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iwantwinners said:

Another Bear said:

Stoneman Douglas survivor: 'We're the mass shooting generation'

https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/975519489512083456/video/1

These kids have the momentum, so get behind them. They have identified who they are in generational terms, and I have a feeling their mission in life is to correct that. God speed.

These kids are followers, not leaders. They are being used as pawns to advance a political agenda, using emotion and ignorance rally these misled fools. It's difficult to blame them when they don't have parents who sit them down and kick their arse for putting their virtue signaling before a fully sponsored education. These kids are teenagers. Four years ago they were 12. They don't know sh*t. And they are being called on to be the ambassadors of a political agenda. Pathetic.
I just want you to know, I think this is a really ****ty thing to say. Like as a human being. These kids had someone enter their school and start shooting at them and their friends, and they don't want that to happen again. Their friends died nearly a month ago and you think they need a 'talking to' because they are doing whatever they can so it does't happen again?!?! What the hell is wrong with you?

You can debate the policy but don't dismiss the victims.
Another Bear
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The irony of stating those kids are followers and not leaders is beyond pale..coming from a conservative in the Era of Trump. The GOP nominated and elected Trump, with a little help from their Russkie friends. The GOP and conservative movement OWN Trump and everything he does. Good luck with that.

And people thought Dubya was going to get kicked in the butt by history...and then Dotard Donnie, friend of Mother Russia got "elected". (Boy Dubya lucked out with Trump.)

Everything out there about Trump is rich source material for future historians. If Trump and his pals are true fascists and authoritarians, they will try and destroy that record. The only thing truth has on its side is Trump's incompetence.
BearChemist
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golden sloth said:

iwantwinners said:

Another Bear said:

Stoneman Douglas survivor: 'We're the mass shooting generation'

https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/975519489512083456/video/1

These kids have the momentum, so get behind them. They have identified who they are in generational terms, and I have a feeling their mission in life is to correct that. God speed.

These kids are followers, not leaders. They are being used as pawns to advance a political agenda, using emotion and ignorance rally these misled fools. It's difficult to blame them when they don't have parents who sit them down and kick their arse for putting their virtue signaling before a fully sponsored education. These kids are teenagers. Four years ago they were 12. They don't know sh*t. And they are being called on to be the ambassadors of a political agenda. Pathetic.
I just want you to know, I think this is a really ****ty thing to say. Like as a human being. These kids had someone enter their school and start shooting at them and their friends, and they don't want that to happen again. Their friends died nearly a month ago and you think they need a 'talking to' because they are doing whatever they can so it does't happen again?!?! What the hell is wrong with you?

You can debate the policy but don't dismiss the victims.
He's in trolling mode long ago.
sycasey
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There is zero evidence that the Stoneman Douglas kids are "pawns" who are being "used" by anyone. It's pathetic to make that argument here or in any other forum. Why is it so hard to believe that some teenagers are simply passionate about an issue, one that they have been forced to face head-on in their recent life experience?

The moral bankruptcy of modern conservatism is really being laid bare on this one, judging by the right wing's conspiracy-theory responses to the pleas of innocent youngsters. It's all cynical power games with no constructive goal in mind.
BearNIt
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iwantwinners said:

Another Bear said:

Stoneman Douglas survivor: 'We're the mass shooting generation'

https://twitter.com/60Minutes/status/975519489512083456/video/1

These kids have the momentum, so get behind them. They have identified who they are in generational terms, and I have a feeling their mission in life is to correct that. God speed.

These kids are followers, not leaders. They are being used as pawns to advance a political agenda, using emotion and ignorance rally these misled fools. It's difficult to blame them when they don't have parents who sit them down and kick their arse for putting their virtue signaling before a fully sponsored education. These kids are teenagers. Four years ago they were 12. They don't know sh*t. And they are being called on to be the ambassadors of a political agenda. Pathetic.
Bahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah! This is an insane thing to say. Wait, I read your next line. Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah! Apparently having a gunman walk into your school with an AR 15, kill 17 people, then wondering why the adults in charge can't protect you or do anything about access to weapons of war, then taking it upon yourself to say enough of this ****, organizing and attempting to hold politicians accountable, makes you a pawn, a follower and not a leader? The world could use more of the so called pawns, followers, and not leaders, then maybe ****e will get done. At some point common sense has to start being used.
sycasey
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Let's also take a moment here to reflect on the fact that "virtue signaling" is now invoked as a criticism whenever people (usually liberals) decide to take up a cause they believe in. It's always a not-so-subtle way to suggest that those people don't REALLY believe in their cause and are only saying these things so they can "look good" and enhance their social standing. In other words, it's pure cynicism. Anyone who says they believe in something must be lying. That's a poisonous attitude for a democratic society, one in which elected officials are supposed to represent their constituents. If they believe their constituents are lying, they won't do that.

Never mind that these Stoneman Douglas kids are doing more than talking on Twitter, they are organizing walkouts and demonstrations, showing up to town halls with their Senator, showing up at the state legislature for key gun-control votes, etc. I fully expect them to move into the actual political arena shortly, either by campaigning for certain candidates who support their positions or (when old enough) running for office themselves. By every outward indication they are dead serious about all of this. But no, the conservative response is that they are "virtue signaling." What nonsense.
Another Bear
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Organizers plan for 500,000 attendees at 'March For Our Lives' gun-control march in Washington


Quote:

Organizers of a rally against mass shootings planned for next month in Washington are expecting up to 500,000 attendees, according to an event permit application.

The application filed this week with the National Park Service indicates the "March for Our Lives" will be March 24, although a location hasn't been determined. The rally, organized by survivors of last week's school massacre in Parkland, Fla., will have "sister marches" in other major cities, organizers said.

Give these kids a stand O.

And this weekend is going to be hell of a ride. March for Our Lives on Sat...Stormy does 60 Minutes on Sunday.
Unit2Sucks
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sycasey said:

Let's also take a moment here to reflect on the fact that "virtue signaling" is now invoked as a criticism whenever people (usually liberals) decide to take up a cause they believe in.
The use of the term "virtue signalling" is in itself a form of "deplorable signalling" by the alt-right. These are people who think that being politically incorrect is a virtue. They applaud when the president calls some other country a ****hole, but heaven forbid anyone criticize any of the things they believe in (guns, whatever). To be clear, people who criticize them don't get to be politically incorrect, they are just labeled as intolerant or virtue signallers.

It all makes sense when you accept that these people aren't genuine.
BearChemist
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Let me predict: iwantwinners will be busy in real life and not able to reply to your comments. But do not be worried, my friends. In about three days he will return, probably in another thread, as if he never made this accusation here.
Anarchistbear
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Actually, conservatives are nothing but virtue signalers-the virtues being Christianity, family values, preserving our way of life, making America great again, flag, patriotism, etc
sycasey
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Anarchistbear said:

Actually, conservatives are nothing but virtue signalers-the virtues being Christianity, family values, preserving our way of life, making America great again, flag, patriotism, etc
Absolutely nobody virtue-signals more than Donald Trump, a man who clearly holds no values or philosophies other than "Give Donald Trump your money" and "Put Donald Trump on TV more." But before people will do that, he has to act like someone who cares about things, so he'll show up for events and make speeches and then later follow up with nothing. He'll cut and run when faced with the slightest resistance. His only real policy accomplishment was cutting taxes for rich people, which (surprise surprise) also benefits him personally. Otherwise he has largely given up on doing anything about health care, immigration, infrastructure, gun violence, and jobs.

And the people who got this man elected want to accuse teenage survivors of a mass shooting of "virtue signaling." Give me a break. Projection at its finest.
dajo9
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Also, nobody has embraced identity politics more than Trump. White identity. It was central to his campaign.
iwantwinners
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golden sloth said:


These kids had someone enter their school and start shooting at them and their friends, and they don't want that to happen again.
Irrelevant. This is a nice tactic. It presupposes there are people out there who want this to happen again or aren't deeply troubled by the act and the loss that has affected the people involved.
Quote:

don't dismiss the victims.
Yeah, I didn't. And I won't.
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