hanky1 said:

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hanky1 said:

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Can't make this shiet up

---

The formula is simple: keep schools shut down so you don't have to work. Meanwhile just wait for Biden to bail you out and subsidize your salary while not working w his trillion dollar bailout.

Why work when you can stay home and still get paid by Biden?

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

Hey, these must be trying times for Mayor Schaaf: Imagine if your best asset was your photogenic face and you had to keep it covered in a mask! She must be beside herself.

In other news, many people are saying I look BETTER in a mask. I get compliments all the time!

going4roses said:

---

---

Purely anecdotal, but it seems like many of the rich-ass people in my community seem to be getting vaccinated regardless of age or occupation. My daughter's classmate's mother was just boasting that she's been vaccinated and so I asked her if she had any tips for me on how to get stuck. i told her that, if it meant becoming a doctor or a nurse (figuring that's probably what she was), that that would take me too long (haha). She said she was a lawyer. Then she said she managed to get their au pair vaccinated, too, because she works in child care. True story.

I'm hoping that, for me, maybe they dip below the age-65 barrier by early April. Kaiser has told me they'll get to me by Presidents Day. i told them that that was two weeks ago. They said, no, Presidents Day is coming up in 50 weeks. Rim shot.

Big C said:

---

going4roses said:

---

---

Purely anecdotal, but it seems like many of the rich-ass people in my community seem to be getting vaccinated regardless of age or occupation. My daughter's classmate's mother was just boasting that she's been vaccinated and so I asked her if she had any tips for me on how to get stuck. i told her that, if it meant becoming a doctor or a nurse (figuring that's probably what she was), that that would take me too long (haha). She said she was a lawyer. Then she said she managed to get their au pair vaccinated, too, because she works in child care. True story.

I'm hoping that, for me, maybe they dip below the age-65 barrier by early April. Kaiser has told me they'll get to me by Presidents Day. i told them that that was two weeks ago. They said there's another one coming up in only 50 weeks. Rim shot.

---

There are a few things going on here:

1. Affluent suburbs tend to have more old people in them, which means more of the population is eligible for the shot.
2. Affluent white people tend to have more time/resources to figure out how to game the system and jump the line. Plus the "system" tends to trust them more.
3. It's been shown in polling that low-income people of color tend to have more hesitancy about taking the vaccine, perhaps in large part because of point 2 above. No trust in the establishment.

going4roses said:

---

---

It could be worse. I was just looking at the vaccination percentages here in Oregon. #1 is a small rural county with an elderly population at 33.3%. #2 is at 16.8%. My county is 35th out of 36 at 8.8%. I just saw my doctor last week who is also the county health officer. Despite being 64 with underlying health conditions, he tells me it may be summer (or at least June) before they have enough vaccine to get to me. Hopefully the arrival of a third vaccine will help. At least our teachers are safe in their Zoom classrooms.

Update: I see now that the state of Oregon now says I'll be eligible for the vaccine "no later than March 29, 2021". I can live with that. My wife (64 with no health conditions)? June 1, 2021. We're not so happy about that.

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

I'm not even talking about the teachers there, I'm talking about the districts getting their buildings and classrooms ready for safer, socially-distanced learning. I can see why this would be harder for some districts than others.

And I'm not even sure if it actually was harder, just describing why I was willing to give them more benefit of the doubt until recently.

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

Very interesting how the conversation has progressed or digressed depending on ones personal perspective.


Has anyone come up with potential solutions or remedies to this issue?

What is the problem?

Then has the problem been thoroughly defined?

Who are the stakeholders ?

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

---

But it certainly appears that they prefer to stay home and teach rather than come in the classroom. Why is that? Do you think they are scared to come to work?

LMK5 said:

---

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

---

But it certainly appears that they prefer to stay home and teach rather than come in the classroom. Why is that? Do you think they are scared to come to work?

---

There is no teacher who prefers remote work. If you think that, you are sadly mistaken.

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

---

But it certainly appears that they prefer to stay home and teach rather than come in the classroom. Why is that? Do you think they are scared to come to work?

---

There is no teacher who prefers remote work. If you think that, you are sadly mistaken.

---

I'm not sure about "no" teacher but I doubt a majority prefers remote work.

Why do you think some unions are still refusing to make a deal even after being prioritized for vaccines?

going4roses said:

---

Very interesting how the conversation has progressed or digressed depending on ones personal perspective.


Has anyone come up with potential solutions or remedies to this issue?

What is the problem?

Then has the problem been thoroughly defined?

Who are the stakeholders ?

---

I mean, the solution is that you reopen schools with the proper safety measures in place, as various public health officials describe. Most school districts and local governments are asking to roughly adhere to those guidelines. Teachers unions are holding out for more. The issue, to me, is that it's been hard to nail down exactly how much more. At first it was vaccines for teachers, but then sometimes it's been different levels of community spread or needing safety measures beyond what the health experts recommend or vaccines for all students (that won't happen for probably another year or so).

Also, maybe it's true that the districts haven't done enough to make the buildings safe. But again, it's been hard to define exactly what would be enough or how you'd measure it. To me the unions have been pretty vague on all of this.

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

You are promoting a narrative that is largely false and, I feel, disrespectful to public school teachers, most of whom would like to return to the classroom.

That said, now that teachers are being vaccinated, they need to get back into the school house. If it's just for elementary and also "hybrid" to start out with, that's fine with me. Then, if the numbers stay down, get all the students back in and work towards full-time. This needs to happen NOW. The academic calendar is zipping by and there isn't time for prolonged negotiations about hand sanitizer dispensers and such.

Some schools in the Bay Area are doing this now, as per the guidance of their county health departments. Why not all of the districts?

If I were leading a teachers union and my district was still 100% remote, I would organize an "anti-strike" for this Friday: Don't appear on remote and instead picket the schools, demanding to be LET IN (under our stated conditions, which would be reasonable and do-able). This puts the onus back on the districts' leadership.

Otherwise, the unions are perpetuating a growing stereotype. They have had my support for decades: Don't let me down. Meanwhile, keep vaccinating the teachers!

L.A. teachers' union slams the reopening plan as "propagating structural racism."

I would expect similar arguments from the union in Oakland. Not sure how much this is real belief and how much this is just a smokescreen for gaining more concessions in negotiations with the district.

IMO them criticizing Newsom over the "science" is pretty rich, given that pretty much all the scientists say that elementary schools should be open for in-person learning. It's also not like the school districts in California cities have any more racial diversity or issues with child poverty than other large urban districts that have reopened schools (like New York).

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

Very interesting how the conversation has progressed or digressed depending on ones personal perspective.


Has anyone come up with potential solutions or remedies to this issue?

What is the problem?

Then has the problem been thoroughly defined?

Who are the stakeholders ?

---

I mean, the solution is that you reopen schools with the proper safety measures in place, as various public health officials describe. Most school districts and local governments are asking to roughly adhere to those guidelines. Teachers unions are holding out for more. The issue, to me, is that it's been hard to nail down exactly how much more. At first it was vaccines for teachers, but then sometimes it's been different levels of community spread or needing safety measures beyond what the health experts recommend or vaccines for all students (that won't happen for probably another year or so).

Also, maybe it's true that the districts haven't done enough to make the buildings safe. But again, it's been hard to define exactly what would be enough or how you'd measure it. To me the unions have been pretty vague on all of this.

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

April 6 is the date here in Vegas for all kids k-12 to return to school keep in mind school ends middle of may.

Just feels like a lot of the right hand having no idea what the left is doing

going4roses said:

---

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

Very interesting how the conversation has progressed or digressed depending on ones personal perspective.


Has anyone come up with potential solutions or remedies to this issue?

What is the problem?

Then has the problem been thoroughly defined?

Who are the stakeholders ?

---

I mean, the solution is that you reopen schools with the proper safety measures in place, as various public health officials describe. Most school districts and local governments are asking to roughly adhere to those guidelines. Teachers unions are holding out for more. The issue, to me, is that it's been hard to nail down exactly how much more. At first it was vaccines for teachers, but then sometimes it's been different levels of community spread or needing safety measures beyond what the health experts recommend or vaccines for all students (that won't happen for probably another year or so).

Also, maybe it's true that the districts haven't done enough to make the buildings safe. But again, it's been hard to define exactly what would be enough or how you'd measure it. To me the unions have been pretty vague on all of this.

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

---

One thing I read is that while COVID infections are not associated with school children, the flu is. There has hardly been a flu season in the US and the fact that kids stayed home may have played a part in this. If we send kids back to school are we going to create the 'twindemic' we were afraid of?

"Between Oct. 1 and Jan. 30, only 155 people in the United States have been hospitalized with the flu.

That's a 98 percent decrease from the same window of time in the 2019-2020 flu season in which 8,633 people were hospitalized with the flu."

"Schools are also high-contact environments, making kids particularly susceptible to catching and transmitting the flu.

"Past evidence suggests kids are the number one source responsible for bringing the flu into households. "

(Source: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/why-the-flu-season-basically-disappeared-this-year)

dimitrig said:

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sycasey said:

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going4roses said:

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If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

---

One thing I read is that while COVID infections are not associated with school children, the flu is. There has hardly been a flu season in the US and the fact that kids stayed home may have played a part in this. If we send kids back to school are we going to create the 'twindemic' we were afraid of?

"Between Oct. 1 and Jan. 30, only 155 people in the United States have been hospitalized with the flu.

That's a 98 percent decrease from the same window of time in the 2019-2020 flu season in which 8,633 people were hospitalized with the flu."

"Schools are also high-contact environments, making kids particularly susceptible to catching and transmitting the flu.

"Past evidence suggests kids are the number one source responsible for bringing the flu into households. "

(Source: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/why-the-flu-season-basically-disappeared-this-year)

---

Yes, kids definitely do transmit the flu.

I'm confused, is the argument that we shouldn't reopen schools because of the flu? The flu has been around for a long time and we never closed schools on its account before.

sycasey said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

---

One thing I read is that while COVID infections are not associated with school children, the flu is. There has hardly been a flu season in the US and the fact that kids stayed home may have played a part in this. If we send kids back to school are we going to create the 'twindemic' we were afraid of?

"Between Oct. 1 and Jan. 30, only 155 people in the United States have been hospitalized with the flu.

That's a 98 percent decrease from the same window of time in the 2019-2020 flu season in which 8,633 people were hospitalized with the flu."

"Schools are also high-contact environments, making kids particularly susceptible to catching and transmitting the flu.

"Past evidence suggests kids are the number one source responsible for bringing the flu into households. "

(Source: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/why-the-flu-season-basically-disappeared-this-year)

---

Yes, kids definitely do transmit the flu.

I'm confused, is the argument that we shouldn't reopen schools because of the flu? The flu has been around for a long time and we never closed schools on its account before.

---

The argument is that with the medical system dealing with COVID-19, do we want to potentially add a bunch of new flu cases at the same time?

dimitrig said:

---

sycasey said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

---

One thing I read is that while COVID infections are not associated with school children, the flu is. There has hardly been a flu season in the US and the fact that kids stayed home may have played a part in this. If we send kids back to school are we going to create the 'twindemic' we were afraid of?

"Between Oct. 1 and Jan. 30, only 155 people in the United States have been hospitalized with the flu.

That's a 98 percent decrease from the same window of time in the 2019-2020 flu season in which 8,633 people were hospitalized with the flu."

"Schools are also high-contact environments, making kids particularly susceptible to catching and transmitting the flu.

"Past evidence suggests kids are the number one source responsible for bringing the flu into households. "

(Source: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/why-the-flu-season-basically-disappeared-this-year)

---

Yes, kids definitely do transmit the flu.

I'm confused, is the argument that we shouldn't reopen schools because of the flu? The flu has been around for a long time and we never closed schools on its account before.

---

The argument is that with the medical system dealing with COVID-19, do we want to potentially add a bunch of new flu cases at the same time?

---

This was a stronger argument during the winter surge in Dec-Jan. Now that we seem to be past that and vaccines are rolling out I don't see the issue here. The experts do recommend temporarily closing schools again if community spread spikes and threatens to overwhelm the hospital system, but only as a last resort.

sycasey said:

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SFBear92 said:

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LMK5 said:

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SFBear92 said:

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LMK5 said:

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sycasey said:

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LMK5 said:

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sycasey said:

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75bear said:

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Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

---

But it certainly appears that they prefer to stay home and teach rather than come in the classroom. Why is that? Do you think they are scared to come to work?

---

There is no teacher who prefers remote work. If you think that, you are sadly mistaken.

---

I'm not sure about "no" teacher but I doubt a majority prefers remote work.

Why do you think some unions are still refusing to make a deal even after being prioritized for vaccines?

---

I don't think they've articulated what else they want publicly.

SFBear92 said:

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sycasey said:

---

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

SFBear92 said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

LMK5 said:

---

sycasey said:

---

75bear said:

---

Libby Schaaf has finally spoken up for school reopening. It only took her 353 days:

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Oakland-school-parents-at-schools-not-15986962.php

---

The group I spoke about put on this rally and probably helped force Schaff to speak up.

---

That's always what it takes. It's amazing how much grease gets applied to the skids when ordinary people--non-professional protestors who vote--vocalize en masse and call the shutdown advocates out for what they are--opportunists.

This could have been accomplished months ago, but sadly, many people went along with it simply because it unified them politically. The problem is that the usual adult mottos of "Suck it up," "What doesn't kill you makes you stronger," "It is what it is," and "Tough times don't last but tough people do" don't fit too well in the psyches of school children. But much damage has been done and I hope that the folks who relentlessly advocated for the lockouts get what's coming to them.

---

Well, there is nuance here. I think schools should have been ready to reopen in September, but logistically I somewhat understand why some of them (particularly the larger ones) weren't; there was still a lot of uncertainty about the course the pandemic was going to take. Then once a bunch of other school districts opened with minimal issues to demonstrate that it was possible, the winter surge hit and no one was going to be in the mood to reopen while case counts were spiking. This moment, as the surge dies down and as vaccines are being administered, seems like the best moment to agitate for it.

---

I see what you're trying to say, but why do the teachers get treatment afforded to no one else when the science shows that they are in a low risk environment, buttressed by the CDC saying that teachers don't even need to be vaccinated to return to schools? No one else gets the "nuance" these folks are getting.

How about private school teachers? Why aren't they dropping like flies? Are grocery workers, Costco employees, Home Depot associates, food processing plant workers, and flight attendants any less worthy than public school teachers? Why is this acceptable to people and why do we give them a pass?

The jig is up. They are staying out of work because they have a great deal and they have the power to prolong it.

---

Teachers have been working the whole duration of the pandemic other than seasonal breaks. This isn't a paid vacation for them.

---

But it certainly appears that they prefer to stay home and teach rather than come in the classroom. Why is that? Do you think they are scared to come to work?

---

There is no teacher who prefers remote work. If you think that, you are sadly mistaken.

---

I'm not sure about "no" teacher but I doubt a majority prefers remote work.

Why do you think some unions are still refusing to make a deal even after being prioritized for vaccines?

---

I don't think they've articulated what else they want publicly.

---

Agreed, and I think that's at least one source of the current frustration.

The continued stalling is getting ridiculous, as the semester ticks away.

SF is supposedly hashing out the difference between the teachers union's "hybrid" plan vs. that of the district. Hey district: Just take the teachers plan for now, get the schools partially open ASAP, then try for more later, if things are going well.



"We need more time to plan this out and get ready!"

Total bs. WTH was going on the past nine months? What was going on last September when COVID numbers were down and a return looked imminent? SOME DISTRICTS IN THE BAY AREA HAVE REOPENED, K-6, HYBRID. You can, too.



Dear teachers unions: Hasn't one of your arguments been that remote learning hasn't been effective and there is tremendous value in having students in classrooms with teachers? I agree! Go get yourselves vaccinated (like my OUSD wife did... it wasn't hard) and get the younger kids back in there!

dimitrig said:

---

sycasey said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

sycasey said:

---

going4roses said:

---

If the kids are not vaccinated nor everyone in their household does it matter if the all of the school staff is vaccinated ?

---

If you read up on the science here, the studies on COVID have shown that child-to-child or child-to-adult transmission is rare. So that's why there is minimal worry of kids carrying COVID from school back to their households or from their households back to the school. Kids are also much less likely to get seriously ill from catching COVID; that risk goes way up as you get older. If you are vaccinating people, you need to vaccinate the adults because they are the carriers and they are more at risk.

---

One thing I read is that while COVID infections are not associated with school children, the flu is. There has hardly been a flu season in the US and the fact that kids stayed home may have played a part in this. If we send kids back to school are we going to create the 'twindemic' we were afraid of?

"Between Oct. 1 and Jan. 30, only 155 people in the United States have been hospitalized with the flu.

That's a 98 percent decrease from the same window of time in the 2019-2020 flu season in which 8,633 people were hospitalized with the flu."

"Schools are also high-contact environments, making kids particularly susceptible to catching and transmitting the flu.

"Past evidence suggests kids are the number one source responsible for bringing the flu into households. "

(Source: https://www.healthline.com/health-news/why-the-flu-season-basically-disappeared-this-year)

---

Yes, kids definitely do transmit the flu.

I'm confused, is the argument that we shouldn't reopen schools because of the flu? The flu has been around for a long time and we never closed schools on its account before.

---

The argument is that with the medical system dealing with COVID-19, do we want to potentially add a bunch of new flu cases at the same time?

---

If the kids come back to school, there will be less flu transmission than there usually is, because of the masks and the social distance. Plus, COVID hospitalizations are going down and should continue to go down.

If everything goes to s*** and the hospitals start to get overwhelmed again (unlikely), we can cross that bridge when we see it coming up.

Big C said:

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The continued stalling is getting ridiculous, as the semester ticks away.

SF is supposedly hashing out the difference between the teachers union's "hybrid" plan vs. that of the district. Hey district: Just take the teachers plan for now, get the schools partially open ASAP, then try for more later, if things are going well.



"We need more time to plan this out and get ready!"

Total bs. WTH was going on the past nine months? What was going on last September when COVID numbers were down and a return looked imminent? SOME DISTRICTS IN THE BAY AREA HAVE REOPENED, K-6, HYBRID. You can, too.



Dear teachers unions: Hasn't one of your arguments been that remote learning hasn't been effective and there is tremendous value in having students in classrooms with teachers? I agree! Go get yourselves vaccinated (like my OUSD wife did... it wasn't hard) and get the younger kids back in there!

---

SF just crossed from purple to red tier in the state's COVID tier system. Now people there will see indoor movie theaters, gyms, and restaurants reopening (with safety precautions).

They've got to be wondering why those can be open but not schools.

I think the problem is that we're all trying to apply logic to the school situation in California. That's why we're all getting tripped up.

75bear said:

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I think the problem is that we're all trying to apply logic to the school situation in California. That's why we're all getting tripped up.

---

Ding ding ding

75bear said:

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I think the problem is that we're all trying to apply logic to the school situation in California. That's why we're all getting tripped up.

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Yes, the whole thing seems to be driven by politics and fear.