White House has settled in

bearister
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mikecohen said:

bearister said:

MC, list your Top 5 favorite Jazz albums and your Top 5 favorite Jazz musicians. What instrument do you play? My favorite Jazz album is Kind of Blue and my favorite musicians are Coltrane, Miles Davis, Stan Getz, Chet Baker and Bill Evans.
For me, the answers to the above are too complicated; and so I tried to send you a PM to approach the subject; but apparently I'm not allowed to do that in this system.

Just checked now. I got them all. Thanks
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Anarchistbear
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mikecohen said:

Anarchistbear said:

Trump is comic relief compared to Bush.

The worse thing about Bush is that we are still living with his policies and there has been no move to change them- endless wars, refugees, destabilization of Middle East and Europe, the Patriot Act, the Security State, loss of civil liberties. The political upheavals - rise of far right parties-in the US and Europe are traceable to US policies- the migration crisis in Europe and the economic crisis in the US.
Not all of that started with Bush - as opposed to being standard Republican Orthodoxy starting with the "Southern Strategy". Also, both "the rise of far right parties" and the migration crisis in Europe (which is an adjunct and help to the former) I think owe more to Putin - because, as a result of Russia's social and economic political failure since at least the rise of Stalin, the general population of Russia is socially and economically way behind the other developed countries, one result of which has been the rise to power of the Russian Mafia, who, like all crime families, seek business opportunities in the interstices of the dominant culture, the major interstice of which in Europe is the power vacuum created by a combination of (a) the open borders of the European Union, (b) the degradation of the populations East of the European Union and in Sub-Saharan Africa many of whose economies and social systems are in the toilet, largely for inability to deal with the modern world, and (c) the failure of the European Union to develop meaningful ways of dealing with the flood of suffering people cosmically needing to go from those countries into the European Union where (whatever one might say about the difficulties) life, even as a refugee and despised minority, is still preferable to life where those folks come from (unless, of course, one is a slave to said Mafia).


I think you miss that the genesis of the refugee problem was the Iraq War and the subsequent Libya fiasco which led to sectarian wars, civil war, destabilization and millions of refugees from Syria, followed by a a chaotic and stateless Libya becoming a portal for refugees not only from Syria but the continent. They all streamed by the millions into Southern Europe. The EU with incredible stupidity allowed Greece and Italy to absorb and deal with all these refugees under the theory that where they enter is whose problem it is. They then attempted to deal with it by bribing Turkey and setting quotas for Northern EU states. This of course opened up the usual fissures of racism and xenophobia that has ruled Europe for millennia but also gave rise to right wing nationalist parties that now rule Hungary, Italy and Poland. I'm not sure why you see Putin as being responsible as most of these countries hate Russia.

Although Bush doesn't deserve full credit for this- the EU was an apathetic and callous partner, Bush's decision to invade Iraq no doubt precipitated much of this crisis. We are still dealing with the wreckage of Iraq and are now bombing seven countries. Can anyone name them? Does anyone care about stopping it? No, this has been now going on for three administrations and is accepted as a fact of life, same with the Patriot Act, spying on Americans and lying about it.
mikecohen
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sycasey said:

okaydo said:

(*Again, I think Trump is a moron, but he has a skill that makes him partially smart in my book. And that skill is to get away with all kinds of heinous sh*t. Evade. Evade. Evade.)
He's dumb, but he has certain skills:

1. He can get enough people (not everyone or even most people, just enough) to buy whatever crap he's selling.

2. He can make people pay attention to him.

Those two things can make for a successful political candidacy under the right circumstances. They also won't help him govern for s**t. Whenever he's screwed something up in business before, he's been able to just cut and run and move on to the next venture. When you're the President it's different. Not so easy to run and hide.
I want to repeat the variation on Lincoln's homily that became uncovered when the body politic lifted that flat rock and found Trump: You can fool enough of the people enough of the time!
dajo9
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Anarchistbear said:

mikecohen said:

Anarchistbear said:

Trump is comic relief compared to Bush.

The worse thing about Bush is that we are still living with his policies and there has been no move to change them- endless wars, refugees, destabilization of Middle East and Europe, the Patriot Act, the Security State, loss of civil liberties. The political upheavals - rise of far right parties-in the US and Europe are traceable to US policies- the migration crisis in Europe and the economic crisis in the US.
Not all of that started with Bush - as opposed to being standard Republican Orthodoxy starting with the "Southern Strategy". Also, both "the rise of far right parties" and the migration crisis in Europe (which is an adjunct and help to the former) I think owe more to Putin - because, as a result of Russia's social and economic political failure since at least the rise of Stalin, the general population of Russia is socially and economically way behind the other developed countries, one result of which has been the rise to power of the Russian Mafia, who, like all crime families, seek business opportunities in the interstices of the dominant culture, the major interstice of which in Europe is the power vacuum created by a combination of (a) the open borders of the European Union, (b) the degradation of the populations East of the European Union and in Sub-Saharan Africa many of whose economies and social systems are in the toilet, largely for inability to deal with the modern world, and (c) the failure of the European Union to develop meaningful ways of dealing with the flood of suffering people cosmically needing to go from those countries into the European Union where (whatever one might say about the difficulties) life, even as a refugee and despised minority, is still preferable to life where those folks come from (unless, of course, one is a slave to said Mafia).


I think you miss that the genesis of the refugee problem was the Iraq War and the subsequent Libya fiasco which led to sectarian wars, civil war, destabilization and millions of refugees from Syria, followed by a a chaotic and stateless Libya becoming a portal for refugees not only from Syria but the continent. They all streamed by the millions into Southern Europe. The EU with incredible stupidity allowed Greece and Italy to absorb and deal with all these refugees under the theory that where they enter is whose problem it is. They then attempted to deal with it by bribing Turkey and setting quotas for Northern EU states. This of course opened up the usual fissures of racism and xenophobia that has ruled Europe for millennia but also gave rise to right wing nationalist parties that now rule Hungary, Italy and Poland. I'm not sure why you see Putin as being responsible as most of these countries hate Russia.

Although Bush doesn't deserve full credit for this- the EU was an apathetic and callous partner, Bush's decision to invade Iraq no doubt precipitated much of this crisis. We are still dealing with the wreckage of Iraq and are now bombing seven countries. Can anyone name them? Does anyone care about stopping it? No, this has been now going on for three administrations and is accepted as a fact of life, same with the Patriot Act, spying on Americans and lying about it.
Do anarchists generally support strong borders or open borders?

You underestimate the willful impact of Putin. By bombing Syrian population centers he drove out refugess into Europe and then used the conflict with the surge of refugees to prop up right wing politicians in Europe. I'll grant Putin this - he is playing chess.
Anarchistbear
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Putin didn't start bombing Syria until the fall of 2015. By that time there were already millions of refugees.
dajo9
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You support anarchy with strong borders?
bearister
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dajo9 said:

You support anarchy with strong borders?


As an Irishman I support Anarchy in the UK!

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mikecohen
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Anarchistbear said:

mikecohen said:

Anarchistbear said:

Trump is comic relief compared to Bush.

The worse thing about Bush is that we are still living with his policies and there has been no move to change them- endless wars, refugees, destabilization of Middle East and Europe, the Patriot Act, the Security State, loss of civil liberties. The political upheavals - rise of far right parties-in the US and Europe are traceable to US policies- the migration crisis in Europe and the economic crisis in the US.
Not all of that started with Bush - as opposed to being standard Republican Orthodoxy starting with the "Southern Strategy". Also, both "the rise of far right parties" and the migration crisis in Europe (which is an adjunct and help to the former) I think owe more to Putin - because, as a result of Russia's social and economic political failure since at least the rise of Stalin, the general population of Russia is socially and economically way behind the other developed countries, one result of which has been the rise to power of the Russian Mafia, who, like all crime families, seek business opportunities in the interstices of the dominant culture, the major interstice of which in Europe is the power vacuum created by a combination of (a) the open borders of the European Union, (b) the degradation of the populations East of the European Union and in Sub-Saharan Africa many of whose economies and social systems are in the toilet, largely for inability to deal with the modern world, and (c) the failure of the European Union to develop meaningful ways of dealing with the flood of suffering people cosmically needing to go from those countries into the European Union where (whatever one might say about the difficulties) life, even as a refugee and despised minority, is still preferable to life where those folks come from (unless, of course, one is a slave to said Mafia).


I think you miss that the genesis of the refugee problem was the Iraq War and the subsequent Libya fiasco which led to sectarian wars, civil war, destabilization and millions of refugees from Syria, followed by a a chaotic and stateless Libya becoming a portal for refugees not only from Syria but the continent. They all streamed by the millions into Southern Europe. The EU with incredible stupidity allowed Greece and Italy to absorb and deal with all these refugees under the theory that where they enter is whose problem it is. They then attempted to deal with it by bribing Turkey and setting quotas for Northern EU states. This of course opened up the usual fissures of racism and xenophobia that has ruled Europe for millennia but also gave rise to right wing nationalist parties that now rule Hungary, Italy and Poland. I'm not sure why you see Putin as being responsible as most of these countries hate Russia.

Although Bush doesn't deserve full credit for this- the EU was an apathetic and callous partner, Bush's decision to invade Iraq no doubt precipitated much of this crisis. We are still dealing with the wreckage of Iraq and are now bombing seven countries. Can anyone name them? Does anyone care about stopping it? No, this has been now going on for three administrations and is accepted as a fact of life, same with the Patriot Act, spying on Americans and lying about it.
As much as I agree about the extraordinary evil karma of the Iraq War, and as much as I admire Obama and Mark Zuckerberg, I do think that Libya and Syria (and the eventual change of dictators in Egypt and everything that happened there between those two dictators) was, in the main, the result of the Arab Spring, triggered by Obama's speech of hope in the region followed by the rise of Facebook there which made people there believe they would be able to achieve more (and more easily) than it turned out, with results that I think might have given both Obama and Zuckerberg considerable pause had they been able to foresee those results.

And, also despite my political leanings, I also believe that our reactions to those events (the critical periods of which were during the Obama Administration) did not do much or anything to ameliorate those disasters, whereas Putin stepped right in and made them worse - because

1) since his internal Muslim enemies have been AlQaeda-influenced Sunni Muslims, it is in his interest to support the Shia Assad and Iran; and

2) the refugee problem in Western Europe is the strongest opportunity that Russia, as he sees it, ever had to destabilize the Western Alliance.

I have to add: I certainly did not foresee the horrible results of the Arab Spring; and, as far as what we could have done, my thoughts were the same as virtually everyone else I saw here, that there were no good solutions.

In hindsight, it almost suggests the possible virtue of more forceful military action in support of the Sunni majority in Syria, whose economy was developed enough to possibly provide a meaningful bulwark against Wahabism, including Daesh.

But I do not miss the force of the argument against the ubiquitous use of the American military around the world; and I am not sanguine that American military and strategic and foreign policy thinkers could have found a way to use that military in Syria that might have been salutary instead of disastrous just in a different way - on top of which the political backlash here to that involvement BY OBAMA (which wouldn't have been there under a Republican Administration) may well have made anything along those lines impossible.

So, I don't know whether any American at that time would have had the guts (or bad judgment) to face, at the same time, both the racist American political backlash (against anything Obama did), plus risk starting a hot war with Russia in Syria.
Anarchistbear
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Mike Cohen. I think you give Obama and Zuckerberg way too much credit. While the origins of the conflict can be traced to the Arab Spring, the war quickly erupted into more than a civil war-a proxy war involving Iran, Syria, Isis, Turkey, Russia and many fringe militias. A lot of that can be traced to Iraq and the emboldening of the Shi'a, Iraq becoming an Iran client state and the eruption of Sunni opposition and the birth of ISIL who carried the fight to Syria. That was the aftermath of two US administrations as was the Libya invasion and resultant chaos which provided the portal for refugee entry into Europe.

Could anything have been done by the West? Maybe earlier but I don't know. I don't disagree with you about reluctance to get involved. I also didn't disagree with Obama's hands off approach.
Another Bear
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Republicans Projected to Pick up Seventy Seats in Prison

Lost in the news: Chris Collins indicted and Commerce Sec Wilbur Ross (accused of insider trading and stealing $120m from investors).
bearister
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B.A. Bearacus
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bearister said:


I hear him pronouncing it like this:
bearister
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B.A. Bearacus said:

bearister said:


I hear him pronouncing it like this:





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Another Bear
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B.A. Bearacus said:

bearister said:


I hear him pronouncing it like this:

Did the Israelis poison him? Or was it just a Pee Party hang over thing?
bearister
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The late Prime Minister of India, Morarji Desai, slurred his speech after partaking in his pee beverage.
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mikecohen
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Anarchistbear said:

Mike Cohen. I think you give Obama and Zuckerberg way too much credit. While the origins of the conflict can be traced to the Arab Spring, the war quickly erupted into more than a civil war-a proxy war involving Iran, Syria, Isis, Turkey, Russia and many fringe militias. A lot of that can be traced to Iraq and the emboldening of the Shi'a, Iraq becoming an Iran client state and the eruption of Sunni opposition and the birth of ISIL who carried the fight to Syria. That was the aftermath of two US administrations as was the Libya invasion and resultant chaos which provided the portal for refugee entry into Europe.

Could anything have been done by the West? Maybe earlier but I don't know. I don't disagree with you about reluctance to get involved. I also didn't disagree with Obama's hands off approach.
Agree with the above, except to make clear that I didn't really agree with Obama's hands off approach; I just couldn't think of anything better, while Russia gleefully picked up the pieces, slaughtered a lot of Sunnis, i.e., the majority population, which is what I think is the genesis of the real mass refugee problem - i.e., the mass flight of, if not the majority of the population of Syria, a big percentage of that majority -- millions of people, which, at the same time opened vast amounts of territory to be freely grabbed by Daesh.
sycasey
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Friendly reminder that Puerto Rico still exists.

https://psmag.com/social-justice/officials-finally-acknowledged-hurricane-marias-higher-death-toll

Now the deadliest storm in U.S. history. FEMA's response characterized as lackluster, far worse than for similar storms on the mainland.

Next time Democrats get into power they should immediately call for Puerto Rico to be given full statehood.
Another Bear
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The complete and utter incompetence of the GOP is now set in two massive, tremendous, bigly disasters: Katrina and Puerto Rico.

The GOP is the party of NO and the party of failure. Soon to be the Party of the Russkies!
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B.A. Bearacus
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I never have the energy to watch or comment on Kellyanne, but when she is caught in an unusual moment where she is unable to slither away, I will take note. (Start at 3-min mark)

B.A. Bearacus
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B.A. Bearacus
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My apologies. I had shared a tweet that suggested that Trump was placing his hand over a Confederate flag in this photo. Additional photos of this spectacle prove that to be wrong.

okaydo
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bearister
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okaydo said:







The Clownocracy has turned a formerly hallowed institution into a cheesy reality show and an international laughing stock. Up is down. Down is up. Don't believe what you read or see. Alternate facts. Porn stars. Genitalia grabbing. Everyone is secretly recording confidential conversations. A science fiction writer could not make this stuff up.
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Another Bear
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M A G A - Making America Go Away

Founder of 'Bikers for Trump' Sells Haiti-Made Shirts to Avoid Higher Labor Costs

bearister
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Stephen Miller, immigration hypocrite:

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/08/13/stephen-miller-is-an-immigration-hypocrite-i-know-because-im-his-uncle-219351
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B.A. Bearacus
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Let's read the Cliff's Notes of Omarosa's book right now and take it for what it's worth.

okaydo
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BearDevil
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At this point, nobody should be surprised if an N bomb tape and/or conclusive evidence of Trump paying for abortion(s) surfaces. However would be surprised if a previously undisclosed Trump kid shows up.

Omarosa and Trump deserve each other. They've known each other for fifteen years and worked together four different times. Neither should be surprised this ended badly again.

Unless Omarosa can release the N bomb tape herself, it's silly to be talking about it since her credibility is every bit as shaky as Trump's. The Michelle Obama Whitey tape was riveting. High hopes that former Trump spokesmen John Miller and John Barron will resurface to show the local NYC TV footage of Muslims celebrating 9/11 in Jersey City.
Unit2Sucks
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First - I love that Trump needs to rely on a fake anecdote of Mark Burnett calling him to say that there are no tapes of Trump using the N word. Note that he didn't feel like he could just "there are no tapes, because I never used it" but instead decided the best lie would be an easily disproven story. I have a feeling within 24 hours Burnett will confirm he hasn't called Trump to say there are no tapes of him saying the N word.

I have met former Apprentice contestants and have no doubt in my mind there are some eye-opening tapes out there. But I'm not sure that any would make a difference. Anyone still voting for Trump is beyond caring about his behavior. Might actually gain him some votes if we are being honest.
okaydo
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Mr. Kellyanne.


BearChemist
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Sarah Huckabee Sanders's stunning non-denial that Trump used the n-word

Sarah, Sarah, you have one damn job.
Another Bear
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Trump is who he is, son of a KKK member or sympathizer, and a guy who speaks before he thinks. In other words, do bears shtt in the woods. Jillette also said Burnett the TV producer has tape on Trump.

Penn Jillette: Trump said 'racially insensitive things' during 'Apprentice' tapings
B.A. Bearacus
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Flake often comes across, in words, as the most or only dignified Republican serving our country.

bearister
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BearChemist said:

Sarah Huckabee Sanders's stunning non-denial that Trump used the n-word

Sarah, Sarah, you have one damn job.

She is the embodiment of the adage, beauty is only skin deep but ugly is to the bone. She is an accessory to the criminal fraud being perpetrated on the nation, as was the giggly little ginger before her. I think the Catholic Church in Pennsylvania should hire her as spokesperson to spin the Grand Jury finding of 300 Catholic priests abuse of thousands of victims for 70 years.

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