Will the NRA's grip on the GOP diminish in your lifetime? (Y/N)

B.A. Bearacus
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.
B.A. Bearacus
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A) Yes
B.A. Bearacus
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B) No
okaydo
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One of my classmates was shot and killed during another class during my first year of high school by a 15-year-old boy with a .357 magnum.

When I look back at that incident, I think: "How quaint."
sp4149
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Increase, this is the month that the NRA goal of allowing miscreants to carry concealed weapons anywhere in the country in defiance of local and state laws becomes the law of the land thanks to the members of Congress and the President the NRA elected.
bearister
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The only way you are taking away my twin M 249 light machine guns is from my cold dead hands.
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B.A. Bearacus
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I feel that change will only come when some sick person kills a minimum of 500 people (not including himself) in one session, but that new record would have to be a big jump from the previous USA record at the time so that it's not just an incremental increase. It would have to be a minimum of 500 killed and break a previous record that was still under 100. I think in that scenario there's a chance Republicans in Congress would be ready to contribute to a solution.
Anarchistbear
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Why do you think it is only the right that wants second amendment rights? There are many newly formed militias on the left opposed to gun control. Let freedom ring.

https://www.redneckrevolt.org

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/5gk85a/huey-does-dallas-0000552-v22n1
bearister
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B.A. Bearacus said:

I feel that change will only come when some sick person kills a minimum of 500 people (not including himself) in one session, but that new record would have to be a big jump from the previous USA record at the time so that it's not just an incremental increase. It would have to be a minimum of 500 killed and break a previous record that was still under 100. I think in that scenario there's a chance Republicans in Congress would be ready to contribute to a solution.


$13.5 billion

Annual revenue of gun and ammunition manufacturing industry, with a $1.5 billion profit. (IBIS World)


$3.1 billion

Annual revenue of gun and ammunition stores, with a $478.4 million profit. (IBIS World)

Follow the money. It wouldn't matter if someone took out an entire football stadium.

https://www.cnn.com/2013/09/16/us/20-deadliest-mass-shootings-in-u-s-history-fast-facts/index.html
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Unit2Sucks
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bearister said:




$13.5 billion

Annual revenue of gun and ammunition manufacturing industry, with a $1.5 billion profit. (IBIS World)


$3.1 billion

Annual revenue of gun and ammunition stores, with a $478.4 million profit. (IBIS World)

Follow the money. It wouldn't matter if someone took out an entire football stadium.

https://www.cnn.com/2013/09/16/us/20-deadliest-mass-shootings-in-u-s-history-fast-facts/index.html
It's actually really small dollars. $16B represents less than 0.01% of GDP but somehow has a stranglehold on the GOP. I don't think it's just about the campaign contributions either because the numbers aren't that big. The alignment is ideological and relationship based and is quite ingrained at this point.
okaydo
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1
wraptor347
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I think it's pretty obvious this will be forgotten. If Sandy Hook and the Vegas shooting couldn't convince Congress to tighten restrictions on guns, I don't think anything will.

There have already been 18 times in 2018 where a gun was fired on school property, 8 of which resulted in injury or death.
Anarchistbear
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Gun control was not an issue in 2016, why would it be in 2020?
Another Bear
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B.A. Bearacus said:

I feel that change will only come when some sick person kills a minimum of 500 people (not including himself) in one session, but that new record would have to be a big jump from the previous USA record at the time so that it's not just an incremental increase. It would have to be a minimum of 500 killed and break a previous record that was still under 100. I think in that scenario there's a chance Republicans in Congress would be ready to contribute to a solution.

500 might not be enough. The American public has been desensitized to mass shootings.

The ways I see the collaboration ending are:

a) The GOP die as a party.
b) Mass shooting at a NRA convention. Everyone carrying couldn't stop it. 500 die.
c) Current leadership dies off and there's a vacuum, during another crisis, like the GOP dying.
d) Newer, better, cheaper killing technology emerges.



BearNIt
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If Congress had to spend one weekend a month at a level I trauma center dealing with the carnage of gun violence weekend after weekend, their attitudes would change.

Since Congress refuses to act on sensible gun legislation despite one of their own getting shot, the Las Vegas shooting, and Freshmen high school students dying,I don't see an instance that would force Congress to act. The NRA has Republican members of Congress locked down and scared to get out of line.

The only question now is when and where the next mass shooting will take place?
bearister
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All these mass shootings are part of a Deep State conspiracy to strip us of our assault rifles which we will need in the Resistance against the Leftist State.
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golden sloth
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Another Bear said:

B.A. Bearacus said:

I feel that change will only come when some sick person kills a minimum of 500 people (not including himself) in one session, but that new record would have to be a big jump from the previous USA record at the time so that it's not just an incremental increase. It would have to be a minimum of 500 killed and break a previous record that was still under 100. I think in that scenario there's a chance Republicans in Congress would be ready to contribute to a solution.

500 might not be enough. The American public has been desensitized to mass shootings.

The ways I see the collaboration ending are:

a) The GOP die as a party.
b) Mass shooting at a NRA convention. Everyone carrying couldn't stop it. 500 die.
c) Current leadership dies off and there's a vacuum, during another crisis, like the GOP dying.
d) Newer, better, cheaper killing technology emerges.




You forgot (E) Start arming black lives matter and other minority rights groups.
B.A. Bearacus
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Father of a current Cal student and speaker of truth.
bearister
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Steve is a good man.
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sonofabear51
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Agreed.
okaydo
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BearNIt said:

If Congress had to spend one weekend a month at a level I trauma center dealing with the carnage of gun violence weekend after weekend, their attitudes would change.


https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/after-nearly-dying-from-a-bullet-steve-scalise-r-la_us_59d4f236e4b0da85e7f5ed51
B.A. Bearacus
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Anarchistbear said:

Why do you think it is only the right that wants second amendment rights? There are many newly formed militias on the left opposed to gun control. Let freedom ring.

Not a good topic to try to draw any sort of equivalence or claim "both sides."

Yes, the 41st highest ranked House recipient of lifetime donations from the NRA is a Democrat -- but the 40 people ahead of him are Republicans. Of the top 100 in the House, 95 are Republicans. No equivalence whatsoever in terms of the influence of the NRA on those who make our laws. In the Senate, the first 51 on the list are Republican. [Source: NYT]

Also, NRA-backed Republicans help to continually suppress funding for scientific research on gun violence.
Quote:

[In 1996, the Dickey Amendment] declared that "none of the funds made available for injury prevention and control at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) may be used to advocate or promote gun control."

While the rule itself does not directly block research on gun violence, it was signed into law along with an earmark that drained money from CDC programs to study gun violence. The $2.6 million in funding originally intended for the program was redirected elsewhere. Since then, the amendment has created a strong chilling effect in the way funding is distributed as well as a lost generation of researchers who study gun violence... In academia, where funding shapes careers, relatively few researchers are willing to stake theirs on studying the issue. [Source: Newsweek]
BearNIt
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okaydo said:

BearNIt said:

If Congress had to spend one weekend a month at a level I trauma center dealing with the carnage of gun violence weekend after weekend, their attitudes would change.


https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/after-nearly-dying-from-a-bullet-steve-scalise-r-la_us_59d4f236e4b0da85e7f5ed51

Like my grandfather said, "A hard head makes a soft behind." How scared of the NRA do you have to be to get shot by some nut with a high powered weapon and almost die to think and do nothing about access to guns? Wasn't the NRA involved with somebody from Russia. I guess even Russians can be ardent supporters of the NRA.
Anarchistbear
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Not talking about Democrats, talking about Left. And militias on the Left are not bad.
drizzlybears brother
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Anarchistbear said:

Why do you think it is only the right that wants second amendment rights? There are many newly formed militias on the left opposed to gun control. Let freedom ring.

https://www.redneckrevolt.org

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/5gk85a/huey-does-dallas-0000552-v22n1

Because the numbers supporting it from the left aren't the problem.
bearister
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Read the comment section of every article in the Daily Mail about the Florida mass shooting and you will learn a lot about America.
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Anarchistbear
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You make it sound like I'm criticizing this trend. I support it and the left is not the Democrats, that's the center.
dajo9
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Anarchistbear said:

You make it sound like I'm criticizing this trend. I support it and the left is not the Democrats, that's the center.
I'm pretty sure I'm with the left.
sycasey
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I think yes, but that's because I'm still in my 30s. It will take another generation to break this stranglehold from the gun lobby.
drizzlybears brother
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sycasey said:

I think yes, but that's because I'm still in my 30s. It will take another generation to break this stranglehold from the gun lobby.
I take it you weren't around when James Brady was shot. There's a generation that has already been at this, and we're farther from gun control than we were then.

More likely, we're a generation away from being handed a gun at birth.
sycasey
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drizzlybears brother said:

sycasey said:

I think yes, but that's because I'm still in my 30s. It will take another generation to break this stranglehold from the gun lobby.
I take it you weren't around when James Brady was shot. There's a generation that has already been at this, and we're farther from gun control than we were then.

More likely, we're a generation away from being handed a gun at birth.
I think the current younger generation values collective security more than personal freedom. They are not in charge yet, but they will be eventually.
sp4149
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Anarchistbear said:

Not talking about Democrats, talking about Left. And militias on the Left are not bad.
Maybe we need a Constitutional amendment that the right to bear arms is for well regulated state militias.
(Not private, unregulated militias, or private individuals who do not belong to a well, regulated state militia)
-or-
"The Second Amendment expressly endorsed the substantive common-law rule that protected the citizen's right (and duty) to keep and bear arms when serving in a state militia."

-just a slight change to the second amendment to restore the original intent-

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms when serving in the Militia shall not be infringed." *

Barring that maybe require a disclaimer engraved on all AR-15s -

"Field tested to produce dozens of casualties in school shootings"

* https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-five-extra-words-that-can-fix-the-second-amendment/2014/04/11/f8a19578-b8fa-11e3-96ae-f2c36d2b1245_story.html?utm_term=.9932eeb83bd0

dajo9
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When the Baby Boomers (on average) came out against Vietnam and for civil rights many thought they were about progress, but time has shown their motivating force has always been individual selfishness
Calcupcakes
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sp4149 said:


Maybe we need a Constitutional amendment that the right to bear arms ...

I'm not hopeful the trend will change, and I don't blame it on the NRA. If you believe we are a country of law founded on the Constitution -- and I am 100% -- then nothing will change unless we all collectively amend or get rid of the 2nd Amendment. Until then, it will circumscribe any attempts at gun restrictions.

Frankly, while I'm anything but a "progressive," I would love to see all guns banned in our country outside of military use.

It appears that Japan has a decent grip on the issue:

http://www.businessinsider.com/gun-control-how-japan-has-almost-completely-eliminated-gun-deaths-2017-10
dajo9
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Our government is structured so that 11% of the population can block any legislation via the filibuster rules in the Senate.

A constitutional amendment can be blocked by 7% of the population.

22 states have a combined population about equal to California. They have 44 Senators. California has 2.
 
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