oski003 said:

---

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta

Stay safe.

What is clear is that "breakthrough" cases are not the rare events the term implies. As of 15 August, 514 Israelis were hospitalized with severe or critical COVID-19, a 31% increase from just 4 days earlier. Of the 514, 59% were fully vaccinated. Of the vaccinated, 87% were 60 or older. "There are so many breakthrough infections that they dominate and most of the hospitalized patients are actually vaccinated," says Uri Shalit, a bioinformatician at the Israel Institute of Technology (Technion) who has consulted on COVID-19 for the government. "One of the big stories from Israel [is]: 'Vaccines work, but not well enough.'"

---

People should still be careful but those numbers show how effective the vaccines are.

78% of those 12+ are fully vaccinated in Israel and it's 90%+ for groups over 65. The fact that only 59% of serious cases are fully vaccinated shows the vaccines still work quite well. Unfortunately the vaccines don't work even better but they are still responsible for a 4 to 1 or 5 to 1 reduction in hospitalizations.

For context, Florida is about 2x as populous as Israel but has 10k hospitalized patients right now. San Francisco is about 1/10th as populous and has more than 1/5 as many hospitalized patients. Israel is doing quite well and I'm sure their level of vaccination is in no small part responsible.

Oski knows this but the last thing he would ever do would be to provide enough context to evaluate the numbers he is providing. Right out of his anti vaxxer playbook.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

oski003 said:

---

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/08/grim-warning-israel-vaccination-blunts-does-not-defeat-delta

Stay safe.

What is clear is that "breakthrough" cases are not the rare events the term implies. As of 15 August, 514 Israelis were hospitalized with severe or critical COVID-19, a 31% increase from just 4 days earlier. Of the 514, 59% were fully vaccinated. Of the vaccinated, 87% were 60 or older. "There are so many breakthrough infections that they dominate and most of the hospitalized patients are actually vaccinated," says Uri Shalit, a bioinformatician at the Israel Institute of Technology (Technion) who has consulted on COVID-19 for the government. "One of the big stories from Israel [is]: 'Vaccines work, but not well enough.'"

---

People should still be careful but those numbers show how effective the vaccines are.

78% of those 12+ are fully vaccinated in Israel and it's 90%+ for groups over 65. The fact that only 59% of serious cases are fully vaccinated shows the vaccines still work quite well. Unfortunately the vaccines don't work even better but they are still responsible for a 4 to 1 or 5 to 1 reduction in hospitalizations.

For context, Florida is about 2x as populous as Israel but has 10k hospitalized patients right now. San Francisco is about 1/10th as populous and has more than 1/5 as many hospitalized patients. Israel is doing quite well and I'm sure their level of vaccination is in no small part responsible.

Oski knows this but the last thing he would ever do would be to provide enough context to evaluate the numbers he is providing. Right out of his anti vaxxer playbook.

---

There is nothing wrong with what I posted. You just feel the need to interject to promote your agenda.

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

But in dumb ass places like Las Vegas **** is going from bad to worse.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

Breaking News: Americans who got the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines can get booster shots eight months after their second doses, starting in late September, the Biden administration said on Wednesday. Officials cited evidence of waning immunity. https://t.co/dGcnp4ZCkt

— The New York Times (@nytimes) August 18, 2021

Boosters for all after 8 months. Very predictable to anyone paying attention. Oh well. I got my second shot in December. Wife, as a first responder, is due for her 8 month boost already.

82gradDLSdad said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

calpoly said:

---

82gradDLSdad said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

---

Every time someone doesn't wear a seatbelt but survives a crash with horrific injuries that could have otherwise been prevented it costs society. Even if you die you are costing society. People don't enjoy scraping your carcass off the road.

dimitrig said:

---

calpoly said:

---

82gradDLSdad said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

---

Every time someone doesn't wear a seatbelt but survives a crash with horrific injuries that could have otherwise been prevented it costs society. Even if you die you are costing society. People don't enjoy scraping your carcass off the road.

---

Yeah, but "FREEDOM!"

AunBear89 said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

calpoly said:

---

82gradDLSdad said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

dimitrig said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

bearister said:

---

Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

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Every time someone doesn't wear a seatbelt but survives a crash with horrific injuries that could have otherwise been prevented it costs society. Even if you die you are costing society. People don't enjoy scraping your carcass off the road.

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Yeah, but "FREEDOM!"

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This is Clem from Bugtussle, Oklahoma, after being disconnected from a respirator (and his dad next to him):

calpoly said:

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82gradDLSdad said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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dimitrig said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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dimitrig said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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bearister said:

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Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

---

What else, then, should be illegal: smoking, eating poorly, not exercising, skydiving, surfing, divorce, etc. I've had this argument many times and it is amazing to me how far folks (democrats?) are willing to go to make life 'better'.

82gradDLSdad said:

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calpoly said:

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82gradDLSdad said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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dimitrig said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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dimitrig said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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bearister said:

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Axios-Ipsos poll: Most Americans support mask and vaccination mandates - Axios


https://www.axios.com/axios-ipsos-poll-mandates-masks-vaccinations-f0f105a7-3c2e-4953-aac9-f25516128b11.html

"Just one in three Americans supports state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks (Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott issued executive orders banning mask requirements in schools).
But that number masks a big partisan gap: 57% of Republicans support those laws, compared to just 16% of Democrats.

What we're watching: Respondents were asked a series of true-or-false questions, including whether masks have been shown to limit person-to-person spread of COVID-19, and whether the vaccine is more deadly that the virus itself.

While most people across party lines knew the facts, Republicans were disproportionately likely to answer incorrectly or to say they didn't know."

---

Just one in three? That's a lot of people working against our public health. I can't think of a better statistic to show our cultural rot. I don't know why we even bother having a military. If someone wanted to destroy our country all they would have to do would be to send us MAGA flags infected with a communicable disease and we would do it ourselves. Between that and the economic ramifications of our inability to produce commodity semiconductor chips, we really are doomed if we ever actually need our military.

---

I think you read it wrong.

Two in three Americans oppose state laws prohibiting local governments from requiring masks.

Just one in three Americans support such laws.

---

No I read that right. 1 in 3 is a lot of idiots. Imagine if 1 in 3 Americans believed that seatbelts made it harder to breathe and supported laws making seatbelt mandates illegal. 1 in 3 is about 10x too many to believe in this sort of garbage.

---

Sorry, when you said "Just one in three?" that means to me you expected the number to be higher. I guess you were being facetious.

By the way, there are a lot of people opposed to seatbelts:

Of the 22,215 passenger vehicle occupants killed in 2019, 47% were not wearing seat belts.

In 15 of the 50 states, the seat belt law is considered a secondary offense, which means that a police officer cannot stop and ticket a driver for the sole offense of not wearing a seat belt.

In one state (New Hampshire) there are no seatbelt laws for adults.

---

According to the NHTSA the national use rate for seatbelts is about 90%. I haven't heard any idiotic arguments against seatbelts (for example, people setting a higher power is all the protection they need from car accidents) but I suppose it could be out there.

Unfortunately our country is full of unhinged people who are fighting a war for which there are no victors, including themselves. If Greg Abbott had been masking indoors among strangers, he likely wouldn't have tested positive for COVID. He also wouldn't have had the chance to spread it to hundreds of unmasked idiots at a political event last night. He has made mask mandates illegal in his state.

---

Here's my seatbelt rant, and I'm sort of an expert having gotten 2 (should have been 3) seatbelt tickets years ago. While driving alone in my car it should not be illegal for me to not wear a seatbelt. I'm not endangering anyone but myself. Not wearing a mask does endanger others and that is why the mandate makes sense.

I now wear my seatbelt all the time. The law is still bad, for solo drivers, but the practice is great.

---

You are endangering you loved ones future by not wearing a seatbelt.

---

What else, then, should be illegal: smoking, eating poorly, not exercising, skydiving, surfing, divorce, etc. I've had this argument many times and it is amazing to me how far folks (democrats?) are willing to go to make life 'better'.

---

Eh, I don't think it's necessary at this point. It's a bit like bike helmets. They used to be uncool but now everyone wears one and it's no big deal. Same with skiing/snowboarding helmets.

My dad never used to wear a seatbelt and only started to when it became required by law. He still often forgets to put on his seatbelt until after he's been driving for a few blocks and I'm amazed he hasn't gotten into an accident while buckling his seatbelt in motion. The thing is, young people don't think twice about it. We put our seatbelts on right when we sit down and it's no big deal.

Doctors advise against intensive sport after Covid vaccination.

https://www.brusselstimes.com/belgium/181660/doctors-advise-against-intensive-sport-after-covid-vaccination/

Please note the following:

health experts are stressing that the benefits of getting vaccinated continue to outweigh the risks.

New cases are down almost 40% week over week in San Francisco. Are we allowed to say that masks work again or do we still have to pretend like they don't?

oski003 said:

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Doctors advise against intensive sport after Covid vaccination.

https://www.brusselstimes.com/belgium/181660/doctors-advise-against-intensive-sport-after-covid-vaccination/

Please note the following:

health experts are stressing that the benefits of getting vaccinated continue to outweigh the risks.

---

I would note that this advice appears to be for young men in intensive cardio sports (like cycling) but it seems like prudent advice. I didn't do any cardio for a few days after my vaccine but probably could have held off longer. I didn't have any side effects and my performance didn't suffer for it, but then again I'm no longer the young man I once was. Reducing the risk profile, even for rare events, seems prudent when there is very little tradeoff.

Unit2Sucks said:

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New cases are down almost 40% week over week in San Francisco. Are we allowed to say that masks work again or do we still have to pretend like they don't?

oski003 said:

---

Doctors advise against intensive sport after Covid vaccination.

https://www.brusselstimes.com/belgium/181660/doctors-advise-against-intensive-sport-after-covid-vaccination/

Please note the following:

health experts are stressing that the benefits of getting vaccinated continue to outweigh the risks.

---

I would note that this advice appears to be for young men in intensive cardio sports (like cycling) but it seems like prudent advice. I didn't do any cardio for a few days after my vaccine but probably could have held off longer. I didn't have any side effects and my performance didn't suffer for it, but then again I'm no longer the young man I once was. Reducing the risk profile, even for rare events, seems prudent when there is very little tradeoff.

---

I play competitive tennis. I struggled for about two months post second shot Moderna. I feel fine now. My recent EKGs were normal.

Unit2Sucks said:

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New cases are down almost 40% week over week in San Francisco. Are we allowed to say that masks work again or do we still have to pretend like they don't?

oski003 said:

---

Doctors advise against intensive sport after Covid vaccination.

https://www.brusselstimes.com/belgium/181660/doctors-advise-against-intensive-sport-after-covid-vaccination/

Please note the following:

health experts are stressing that the benefits of getting vaccinated continue to outweigh the risks.

---

I would note that this advice appears to be for young men in intensive cardio sports (like cycling) but it seems like prudent advice. I didn't do any cardio for a few days after my vaccine but probably could have held off longer. I didn't have any side effects and my performance didn't suffer for it, but then again I'm no longer the young man I once was. Reducing the risk profile, even for rare events, seems prudent when there is very little tradeoff.

---

Shush! Tell the Red states they don't work and that it is a violation of rights to make someone wear a mask.

Interesting read on vaccine efficacy in Israel. Long story short, the data looks much different if you cut it by age with the vaccines still showing around 90% or better efficacy against severe disease for all age cohorts except people in their 80's.

Doesn't mean that boosters aren't warranted or that mask mandates are unnecessary, but it does show that the vaccines (more specifically Pfizer) is still doing better than a lot of people would have you believe.

Of course, assumption here is that this guy isn't fudging the numbers.

https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated

Unit2Sucks said:

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Interesting read on vaccine efficacy in Israel. Long story short, the data looks much different if you cut it by age with the vaccines still showing around 90% or better efficacy against severe disease for all age cohorts except people in their 80's.

Doesn't mean that boosters aren't warranted or that mask mandates are unnecessary, but it does show that the vaccines (more specifically Pfizer) is still doing better than a lot of people would have you believe.

Of course, assumption here is that this guy isn't fudging the numbers.

https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated

---

In the US there have been 606,389 deaths as of August 4th.

480,143 (79%) of those have been people age 65 or older.

344,835 of the deaths (57%) have been people over age 75.

96,997 (16%) are people 50-64.

The number under 50 is 29,249, or less than 5%.

Vaccine or not, the reality is that COVID-19 is not really that deadly for healthy young people.

Now, COVID can cause a lot of other health issues other than death but the need for vaccinations among healthy young people is mostly for two reasons:

1. To protect the elderly

2. To free up medical resources for other emergencies

To put it another way... people over a certain age are at risk whether they get the vaccine or not just like people under a certain age are not really at risk whether they get the vaccine or not.


I shake my head when I see grey-hairs running around without masks because they have been vaccinated. A lot of the older folks are also - not surprisingly - Republican.

In my area they were part of the FIRST group to engage in risky behavior along with the 20somethings.

However, they no longer have the immune systems of a 20something.

A vaccine can only do so much.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.barrons.com/amp/articles/pfizer-covid-vaccine-efficacy-delta-variant-51629378855

First time I have seen a study specifically identify that the mRNA vaccine tech has durability issues versus another vaccine. In this case, the mRNA vaccine intiially is better against Delta but then get equalled or passed by Astra Zeneca after only 4 months due to waning Pfizer antibodies.

the reason you only see the small local guys dying from covid is bc the big national conservatives understand its all just a grift, you dont have to believe the words you say you just have to say the words https://t.co/ddnEowreLA

— Andrew Lawrence (@ndrew_lawrence) August 18, 2021

Just another reminder that getting COVID isn't without risks even if you have a mild case.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/how-does-covid-19-affect-the-brain-a-troubling-picture-emerges

These stories about COVID still leaving young orphans this late into the pandemic are so sad.

“She believed that she could handle everything on her own, that you didn’t really need medicine.”

There are parts of this technologically advanced superpower where people still choose -intentionally - to live like it's the goddamn Middle Ages. https://t.co/gu1mPiriqQ

— Tom Nichols (@RadioFreeTom) August 19, 2021

Data: CSSE Johns Hopkins University (Kansas data via CDC, Aug. 3-16). Map: Axios Visuals


As Delta COVID cases surge, hospitals fill up across the U.S. - Axios


https://www.axios.com/america-delta-coronavirus-cases-43db0419-db2a-4257-9830-c0e3d6f370c9.html

bearister said:

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Data: CSSE Johns Hopkins University (Kansas data via CDC, Aug. 3-16). Map: Axios Visuals


As Delta COVID cases surge, hospitals fill up across the U.S. - Axios


https://www.axios.com/america-delta-coronavirus-cases-43db0419-db2a-4257-9830-c0e3d6f370c9.html

---

Now why in the world would South Dakota be experiencing a spike in COVID infections right now? Hmmm...

The Night Delta Drove Old Dixie Down

Gulf Coast's beloved 'Redneck Riviera' now a virus hotspot


https://apnews.com/article/lifestyle-health-coronavirus-pandemic-c341a0e0ab5e9ecc3b3eedc855f33513

bearister said:

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California is 54% vaccinated.
South Dakota is 48% vaccinated.

oski003 said:

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bearister said:

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California is 54% vaccinated.
South Dakota is 48% vaccinated.

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Well, one possibility is that the unvaxxed in SD act more irresponsibly since they are the only state in dark brown. It will get worse as effects of Sturgis MR incubate. Your theory?