OdontoBear66 said:

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It is shown easily with graphs that gas prices went up tremendously (if I recall accurately from about $2.50 to $4.00+ per gallon) before Putin stepped into Ukraine, and continued thereafter. Most of you people look at it from a "my side", "your side" lens as to who did what to whom.

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You dont seem to be aware of the FACT that 1.2 million barrels per day of gasoline REFINING CAPACITY got taken off the market place in early February when Marathon Petroleum's massive 593.000 unexpectedly shut down in Galveston Bay and two Valero Refineries and one Chevron plant were shut on the Gulf Coast.

Refining capacity was only at 86% the week ending January 28th.

This reflected the heavy MAINTENANCE SEASON in PROGRESS as plants performed work that was pushed back in 2020 and 2021 to conserve cash during the height of the pandemic. Moreover, Refineries go "off-line" all the time for scheduled maintenance or unexpected issues such as flaring or a fire.

I'm afraid that blaming this on Biden is falling prey to being terribly uninformed.

Huge U.S. Gulf Refinery Shutdowns Are Spooking the Gasoline Market - Energy News for the United States Oil & Gas Industry | EnergyNow.com

Diablo, you are a piece of work with your attack the poster style.

In direct response to my post in the first three paragraphs you use personal insults like "economically illiterate", "aren't able to critically think for themselves", and "ridiculously naivete". Direct and implied insults. For that one gets a good laugh.

Oh wait, the in paragraph 4 "I'm not suggesting you (or others) are guilty of this".....After insults and tone setting in your opening I cry BS on your backtracking (I guess).

Very simply Joe Biden is the President. He got in office and dog whistled from day one that his goal is shutting the nozzle on fossil fuels. He has reiterated same continuously in his year and a half in office, and his current transportation secretary suggests we just all buy electric vehicles to avoid increased gas prices.

And BTW my suggestion for Climate change is dial back on fossil fuels and increase alternative energies as quickly as possible, but do so only as quickly as the alt energy can supply and with reason.

And then when you disagree to attempt to tie every dissenting viewpoint to Trump and Fox News it is equally absurd. Self elevation to the higher tower plays poorly. Sheesh, what if your every response denigrated MSNBC, CNN generated and that you didn't have an original worthy thought . Attack the source has been a liberal strategy for years and plays poorly.

You have some worthy posts but strategically weak when your attack dog comes out.

Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

I repeat: 1.2 million barrels of gasoline processing was taken off the market. And you want to blame that on Biden?

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore those facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

DiabloWags said:

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Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

June 27, 2022. $4.872/gallon 135% increase. Even if you wish, not all Putin

Joe in office........Jan 21, 2021 till current...His watch...His responsibility as with things on a Repubs watch, his responsibility.

Wait. Sorry, you own the facts.....Hahaha. And shove the Caps where the sun don't shine.

Welcome to OT...

Where people blame a 1.2 million barrel per day cut in REFINING CAPACITY due to MAINTENANCE on Biden.

Just the FACTS:

https://energynow.com/2022/02/huge-u-s-gulf-refinery-shutdowns-are-spooking-the-gasoline-market/?amp

Covid knocked down refineries too.

https://www.kqed.org/news/11831607/shutdown-of-marathons-martinez-refinery-prompts-calls-for-just-transition-for-oil-workers

and the covid shutdowns were a reason to transition away from refining in anticipation of a move to greener energy.

"We will see more future refinery closures as a result of continued
decreasing consumption of fossil fuels under California's policies
transitioning our transportation system to zero emission," said Gioia,
who sits on the the Bay Area Air Quality Management District board and
the California Air Resources Board.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.contracosta.ca.gov/Archive.aspx%3FADID%3D4556&ved=2ahUKEwiZg7aD7435AhU9mGoFHXs1A-8QFnoECAQQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1lGP2wN4Wy_tdAc8la9muI

In my County of Contra Costa:

Marathon Oil Refinery shuts down in Martinez. Will transition to renewable biofuels.

730 million gallons per year.

https://www.marathonpetroleum.com/Newsroom/Company-News/Marathon-Petroleum-to-Proceed-with-Conversion-of-Martinez-Refinery-to-Renewable-Fuels-Facility/

https://www.contracosta.ca.gov/7961/Martinez-Refinery-Renewable-Fuels-Projec

OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

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Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

But more importantly, this cartoon isn't accurate, no matter how much you would like to pretend otherwise.




Unless you are calling for Biden to nationalize the oil and gas industry (do you like Venezuela?), the idea that there is a direct correlation between US oil production and prices we pay at the pump is fantasy. The price we pay at the pump does correlate closely to global spot oil prices (except it rises like a rocket and falls like a feather). That is, assuming you believe in the constitution which prevents export taxes.

Unit2Sucks said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

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Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

---

Kind of looks like someone cut and pasted a price increase (+152%) from a right-wing Biden bashing blog, and didnt even comprehend how absurdly inaccurate the math was.

lol

DiabloWags said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

---

Kind of looks like someone cut and pasted a price increase (+152%) from a right-wing Biden bashing blog, and didnt even comprehend how absurdly inaccurate the math was.

lol

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This is some stupid criticism by folks being complete jerks. It looks like a 52% and then a 35% increase. Common mistake.

oski003 said:

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DiabloWags said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

---

Kind of looks like someone cut and pasted a price increase (+152%) from a right-wing Biden bashing blog, and didnt even comprehend how absurdly inaccurate the math was.

lol

---

This is some stupid criticism by folks being complete jerks. It looks like a 52% and then a 35% increase. Common mistake.

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It wasn't an accident, it was a massive overstatement.

WTI oil was $85 per barrel on Jan 18. It was $95 per barrel on Feb 28. It's $95 per barrel today. So the price of oil (just one component in US gas prices) increased by just under 12% yet gas prices went up 52% in that first month and are higher still now.

You shouldn't be pointing the finger at Biden, you should be pointing the finger at big oil which is massively profiteering right now. Oil is falling and could hit $85 in the next few weeks but does anyone doubt that the price we pay at the pump will still be massively higher than it was in January?

Gas prices always rise like a rocket and fall like a feather. That's not on the president.

If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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And yet conservatives voters expect to have it both ways. If you clowns want to blame him for high prices, at least be consistent in your stupidity and give him credit when it goes down.

tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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The WH sees what worked for the previous administration. Declare victory and ignore dissenting opinions. Can't blame them for trying.

AunBear89 said:

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tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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And yet conservatives voters expect to have it both ways. If you clowns want to blame him for high prices, at least be consistent in your stupidity and give him credit when it goes down.

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own the suckage.

Eastern Oregon Bear said:

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tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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The WH sees what worked for the previous administration. Declare victory and ignore dissenting opinions. Can't blame them for trying.

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Yeah, disappointing. The whole point was this administration being the grown up version. Compared to the cabinet Obama had, this cabinet is just bunch of amateurs.

DiabloWags said:

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Unit2Sucks said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

---

Kind of looks like someone cut and pasted a price increase (+152%) from a right-wing Biden bashing blog, and didnt even comprehend how absurdly inaccurate the math was.

lol

---

Well actually I have to own up to the math all by myself. Terrible mistake but +52% and +35% make the point very well. Were it cut and pasted the numbers would have been much better.

The point remains, no matter how bad the posters math (aka me), the rise is Biden's to own. Get over it. His watch. Well, I think it is, but probably more Klain and Rice.

tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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Because presidents like to disclaim responsibility. This isn't surprising. After wrongly being blamed for raising gas prices, Biden might as well claim that his recent actions (including his release of strategic oil reserves which he has been disingenuously criticized for) helped ease the pain. The GOP has already announced that it intends to hold kangaroo court investigations into his release, so why shouldn't he tie it to the decrease in gas prices.

If you cared about presidents taking responsibility, you wouldn't still support a party which is 95% in favor of Trump who took no responsibility for anything negative ever (although he gladly took credit when the stock market went up).

OdontoBear66 said:

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DiabloWags said:

---

Unit2Sucks said:

---

OdontoBear66 said:

---

DiabloWags said:

---

Sadly, you choose to DEFLECT as you ignore the FACTS.

You clearly dont understand the dynamics of Refining Capacity, which you completely ignored in your reply.

It never occurred to you that Refining Capacity was cut during early February due to massive refinery shut downs in Texas for MAINTENANCE.

And you continue to IGNORE the FACT that the U.S. is still pumping 12.0 million barrels a day like under Trump.

Why do you ignore that facts?
Why do you ignore the data?

---

Fact: Oh, and govt stats not as implied Fox News

Jan 18, 2021 $2.379/gallon

Feb 28, 2022. $3.608/gallon. 152% increase Putin attacks

---

Sorry, that's not how math works. 152% increase from $2.379 would be $6.

---

Kind of looks like someone cut and pasted a price increase (+152%) from a right-wing Biden bashing blog, and didnt even comprehend how absurdly inaccurate the math was.

lol

---

Well actually I have to own up to the math all by myself. Terrible mistake but +52% and +35% make the point very well. Were it cut and pasted the numbers would have been much better.

The point remains, no matter how bad the posters math (aka me), the rise is Biden's to own. Get over it. His watch. Well, I think it is, but probably more Klain and Rice.

---

Oil prices rose ~12% and that's just one constituent in t he price we pay at the pump. Please explain why Biden is responsible for oil company price gouging. Since the GOP loves oil companies, you should be happy that they are making record profits in overcharging americans at the pump.

Quote:

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The top five oil companies aloneShell, ExxonMobil, BP, Chevron, and ConocoPhillipsbrought in more than 200 percent more in profits than in the first quarter of 2021. That is a total of more than $35 billion in profits in just three months. In fact, these five companies' first-quarter profits alone are equivalent to almost 28 percent of what Americans spent to fill up their gas tanks in the same time period.

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Maybe you should give Biden credit for allowing oil companies to make themselves great again. That's certainly a boon to GOP politicians who rake in cash from them.

tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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Because ALL administrations "spin".

Or did you not notice all of the BS that came out of Trump's economic advisors like Peter Navarro and Larry Kudlow?

Biden's Brian Deese is just as bad.

OdontoBear66 said:

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Well actually I have to own up to the math all by myself. Terrible mistake but +52% and +35% make the point very well. Were it cut and pasted the numbers would have been much better.

The point remains, no matter how bad the posters math (aka me), the rise is Biden's to own. Get over it. His watch. Well, I think it is, but probably more Klain and Rice.

---

Right.

Because in your mind the oil industry is nationalized and Biden has total control over when Refineries shut down for maintenance, flaring, or a fire.

I cant tell you how absolutely ridiculous that sounds. Your oversimplification of a multi-faceted GLOBAL industry speaks volumes.

Tell me, did you also blame Donald Trump for the GDP collapsing -33.3% in Q2 of 2020 because that happened on his watch?

DiabloWags said:

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tequila4kapp said:

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If the President has no affect on gas prices why is this WH so quick to claim credit when it goes down? Can't have it both ways.

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Because ALL administrations "spin".

Or did you not notice all of the BS that came out of Trump's economic advisors like Peter Navarro and Larry Kudlow?

Biden's Brian Deese is just as bad.

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This is the 100th times the But Trump defense of Biden has been used this week. Congratulations, you make Off-Topic a better place. SARCASM.

Ooooh. What a substantive and well reasoned post. Nice typing, too.

/s

AunBear89 said:

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Ooooh. What a substantive and well reasoned post. Nice typing, too.

/s

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Thank you. SARCASM.

Unit2sucks said:

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Maybe you should give Biden credit for allowing oil companies to make themselves great again. That's certainly a boon to GOP politicians who rake in cash from them.

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Valero, Marathon, and Phillips 66, the three largest independent refiners, are set to bring in about $14 BILLION IN CASH from operations this quarter. Thats the highest combined level on record, according to S&P Capital IQ data.

Margins are twice as high as the "Golden Age" back in 2004 - 2007.

But he clearly doesnt care about FACTS.

Biden Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm: The green energy "transition" just "can't progress fast enough" pic.twitter.com/dcWBwISE1Q

— RNC Research (@RNCResearch) July 22, 2022

Change is always uncomfortable. You need to get an electric vehicle and stop worrying about gas prices.

Something I learned this week while driving a UHaul in California - the gas pump can automatically stop your credit card transaction at $100 before your tank is full.

In any case, retail gas prices are down 14% from their June peak. Core inflation reached its highest yoy level in March (to this point, anyway). Walmart reported it would have to lower their prices. Inflation will maintain a boost from shelter as landlords continue to catch up with increases in spot rent prices.

The Fed appears on track to drive this economy into the ground and drive up unemployment and crater growth due to their slowness to respond to events and their inflexibilty. The Fed should have been gradually raising rates since at least last fall instead of waiting so long and jamming rates up so hard.

dajo9 said:

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Something I learned this week while driving a UHaul in California - the gas pump can automatically stop your credit card transaction at $100 before your tank is full.

In any case, retail gas prices are down 14% from their June peak. Core inflation reached its highest yoy level in March (to this point, anyway). Walmart reported it would have to lower their prices. Inflation will maintain a boost from shelter as landlords continue to catch up with increases in spot rent prices.

The Fed appears on track to drive this economy into the ground and drive up unemployment and crater growth due to their slowness to respond to events and their inflexibilty. The Fed should have been gradually raising rates since at least last fall instead of waiting so long and jamming rates up so hard.

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Many gas stations still default at $100 max to avoid theft by credit card fraud.

Only Democrats would, as inflation hits 40-year-highs, propose a massive tax increase on businesses (that will proceed to raise their prices) so they can fund $800 billion of new spending on green energy grift and call it the "Inflation Reduction Act."

— Greg Price (@greg_price11) July 27, 2022

BearForce2 said:

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Only Democrats would, as inflation hits 40-year-highs, propose a massive tax increase on businesses (that will proceed to raise their prices) so they can fund $800 billion of new spending on green energy grift and call it the "Inflation Reduction Act."

— Greg Price (@greg_price11) July 27, 2022

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The tax on big business won't raise prices. Supply and Demand for their products determine prices. Only people who don't understand economics would make that claim. It is a common claim on the right. It is only true in perfectly competitive markets which does not apply to America's big businesses.

DiabloWags said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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Well actually I have to own up to the math all by myself. Terrible mistake but +52% and +35% make the point very well. Were it cut and pasted the numbers would have been much better.

The point remains, no matter how bad the posters math (aka me), the rise is Biden's to own. Get over it. His watch. Well, I think it is, but probably more Klain and Rice.

---

Right.

Because in your mind the oil industry is nationalized and Biden has total control over when Refineries shut down for maintenance, flaring, or a fire.

I cant tell you how absolutely ridiculous that sounds. Your oversimplification of a multi-faceted GLOBAL industry speaks volumes.

Tell me, did you also blame Donald Trump for the GDP collapsing -33.3% in Q2 of 2020 because that happened on his watch?

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Blame? No. But it happened on his watch so it was his to own.

BearForce2 said:

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Biden Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm: The green energy "transition" just "can't progress fast enough" pic.twitter.com/dcWBwISE1Q

— RNC Research (@RNCResearch) July 22, 2022

Change is always uncomfortable. You need to get an electric vehicle and stop worrying about gas prices.

---

A move to all electric will simply mean electric companies behave in the way some accuse the oil companies of behaving. We need both electric and gas.

Core PCE inflation down to 4.4% in the latest GDP report. This is a really good report as it has growth and core inflation weakening without crashing. The Fed is appropriately moving to a more data dependent approach without forward guidance of big rate increases. Seems silly to me that they don't meet monthly during times like these, but whatever. They next meet in September.

tequila4kapp said:

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DiabloWags said:

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OdontoBear66 said:

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Well actually I have to own up to the math all by myself. Terrible mistake but +52% and +35% make the point very well. Were it cut and pasted the numbers would have been much better.

The point remains, no matter how bad the posters math (aka me), the rise is Biden's to own. Get over it. His watch. Well, I think it is, but probably more Klain and Rice.

---

Right.

Because in your mind the oil industry is nationalized and Biden has total control over when Refineries shut down for maintenance, flaring, or a fire.

I cant tell you how absolutely ridiculous that sounds. Your oversimplification of a multi-faceted GLOBAL industry speaks volumes.

Tell me, did you also blame Donald Trump for the GDP collapsing -33.3% in Q2 of 2020 because that happened on his watch?

---

Blame? No. But it happened on his watch so it was his to own.

---

Are you OdontoBear too?
How many screen-names do you have here?

dajo9 said:

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Something I learned this week while driving a UHaul in California - the gas pump can automatically stop your credit card transaction at $100 before your tank is full.

In any case, retail gas prices are down 14% from their June peak. Core inflation reached its highest yoy level in March (to this point, anyway). Walmart reported it would have to lower their prices. Inflation will maintain a boost from shelter as landlords continue to catch up with increases in spot rent prices.

The Fed appears on track to drive this economy into the ground and drive up unemployment and crater growth due to their slowness to respond to events and their inflexibilty. The Fed should have been gradually raising rates since at least last fall instead of waiting so long and jamming rates up so hard.

---

Did you watch Powell's Q&A session yesterday?

He maintained that even if the Fed had started raising rates 3 months earlier, it would not have mattered.
At least Powell has finally given up on giving forward guidance and the dot plots. That has proven to be a total policy failure.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/goodbye-fed-guidance-let-us-hope-jerome-powell-federal-reserve-inflation-monetary-policy-11658955848?reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink