bearister said:dajo9 said:
How do you define a woman?
In the 1960's and 1970's my final answer: Barbara Bouchet
If lovin' her is wrong, Big C don't wannabe right.
*80 years old now(My Cougar zone ….…..and they think I'm hot)
I can't get too upset about it because Carini didn't even try. Khelif doesn't look especially powerful and due to the headgear, Olympic boxing is more about landing a greater number of punches with skill than knocking your opponent out. Carini certainly had a chance to do that.dimitrig said:Cal88 said:movielover said:This may be the most powerful meme to come out of the Paris Olympics - even more powerful than the Santic open ceremonies. This is the future for America if we don't stop Kamala Harris and her dangerous Marxist agenda. h/t @grandoldmemes pic.twitter.com/CmVzSMitG3
— @amuse (@amuse) August 1, 2024
I guess this is what you are referring to here:An absolute travesty at the Olympics.
— End Wokeness (@EndWokeness) August 1, 2024
Angela Carini is forced to box against a biological male. She quits after just 45 seconds, and cries hysterically as her opponent is declared the winner.
Don't look away. This is wokeness. pic.twitter.com/wOkVRs88t5
She was forced to box or she chose to box?
Let's be real about it. No one forced her.
You are making progress. You now admit that God (in your view) in His perfect glory has put people on Earth that don't match your circa 2000's definitions of gender. Either your definitions are wrong or there is a 3rd gender. Grey zone gender, as you call it. That 1% of what you call the grey zone gender is exactly the type that is going to be in court. That's exactly why it is not appropriate for a judge to lay out clear definitions of gender when no judge can know beforehand all the varieties of gender God will find the wisdom to bring into their court room. Humility is a good thing.Cal88 said:dajo9 said:Cal88 said:dajo9 said:Cal88 said:dajo9 said:dajo9 said:
It's really a shame the Olympics allowed Khelif to box in the woman's group. The issue of trans rights is so much bigger than athletic competitions but nothing does more to hurt the cause of trans rights than allowing these kinds of things to happen. The right pounces on these issues of athletics and gains support for all kinds of anti-trans rhetoric and beliefs. My friends on the left need to get realistic about the limits of transgender people being involved in athletic competitions. Then we can move onto the more important matters in the transgender community.
I have to edit this comment as I have read more about this situation. I should have known better than to take a Cal88 post at face value.
Imane Khelif was born and assigned female at birth. She is not transgender, which is illegal in Algeria. This situation has nothing to do with the issue of being transgender. It seems like a very complicated situation and I feel badly that Khelif is going through all this. How do you define a woman?
Imane Khelif was disqualified by the International Boxing Association from an international boxing tournament last year for having XY chromozones and elevated levels of testosterone.
She's most likely not trans, there are pictures of her as a little girl where she does look like, well, a little girl, but she presents a rare case of intersex where she has male genetic characteristics and unusually high levels of testosterone.
You have to feel bad for Khelif as her condition is probably natural and not boosted/juiced, but this being said, is it fair to her opponents? The IBA said no, while the IOC said yes. I tend to agree with the former, but this being said, the memes and outrages are a bit uncalled for given Khelif's seems like a case of an honest woman who did not cheat to get there.
Grey zone.
How do you define a woman?
Answer from Wikipedia circa 2000s -
"women are of the female sex and inherit a pair of X chromosomes, one from each parent, and fertile women are capable of pregnancy and giving birth from puberty until menopause. More generally, sex differentiation of the female fetus is governed by the lack of a present, or functioning, SRY gene on either one of the respective sex chromosomes.
Female anatomy is distinguished from male anatomy by the female reproductive system, which includes the ovaries, fallopian tubes, uterus, vagina, and vulva. An adult woman generally has a wider pelvis, broader hips, and larger breasts than an adult man. These characteristics facilitate childbirth and breastfeeding. Women typically have less facial and other body hair, have a higher body fat composition, and are on average shorter and less muscular than men."
You are arguing there are more than 2 genders. What is the definition of the 3rd gender?
Also, you are saying we cant know gender until we subject everybody to a lab test. Or do we only subject the people you think look different?
The 2 genders cover over 99% of natural cases.
The current discourse of gender dysphoria is about using these highly unusual outlier cases to overturn long-standing rational norms and push a year zero agenda that is negatively affecting and destabilizing young people.
dajo9 said:You are making progress. You now admit that God (in your view) in His perfect glory has put people on Earth that don't match your circa 2000's definitions of gender. Either your definitions are wrong or there is a 3rd gender. Grey zone gender, as you call it. That 1% of what you call the grey zone gender is exactly the type that is going to be in court. That's exactly why it is not appropriate for a judge to lay out clear definitions of gender when no judge can no beforehand all the varieties of gender God will find the wisdom to bring into their court room. Humility is a good thing.Cal88 said:dajo9 said:Cal88 said:dajo9 said:Cal88 said:dajo9 said:dajo9 said:
It's really a shame the Olympics allowed Khelif to box in the woman's group. The issue of trans rights is so much bigger than athletic competitions but nothing does more to hurt the cause of trans rights than allowing these kinds of things to happen. The right pounces on these issues of athletics and gains support for all kinds of anti-trans rhetoric and beliefs. My friends on the left need to get realistic about the limits of transgender people being involved in athletic competitions. Then we can move onto the more important matters in the transgender community.
I have to edit this comment as I have read more about this situation. I should have known better than to take a Cal88 post at face value.
Imane Khelif was born and assigned female at birth. She is not transgender, which is illegal in Algeria. This situation has nothing to do with the issue of being transgender. It seems like a very complicated situation and I feel badly that Khelif is going through all this. How do you define a woman?
Imane Khelif was disqualified by the International Boxing Association from an international boxing tournament last year for having XY chromozones and elevated levels of testosterone.
She's most likely not trans, there are pictures of her as a little girl where she does look like, well, a little girl, but she presents a rare case of intersex where she has male genetic characteristics and unusually high levels of testosterone.
You have to feel bad for Khelif as her condition is probably natural and not boosted/juiced, but this being said, is it fair to her opponents? The IBA said no, while the IOC said yes. I tend to agree with the former, but this being said, the memes and outrages are a bit uncalled for given Khelif's seems like a case of an honest woman who did not cheat to get there.
Grey zone.
How do you define a woman?
Answer from Wikipedia circa 2000s -
"women are of the female sex and inherit a pair of X chromosomes, one from each parent, and fertile women are capable of pregnancy and giving birth from puberty until menopause. More generally, sex differentiation of the female fetus is governed by the lack of a present, or functioning, SRY gene on either one of the respective sex chromosomes.
Female anatomy is distinguished from male anatomy by the female reproductive system, which includes the ovaries, fallopian tubes, uterus, vagina, and vulva. An adult woman generally has a wider pelvis, broader hips, and larger breasts than an adult man. These characteristics facilitate childbirth and breastfeeding. Women typically have less facial and other body hair, have a higher body fat composition, and are on average shorter and less muscular than men."
You are arguing there are more than 2 genders. What is the definition of the 3rd gender?
Also, you are saying we cant know gender until we subject everybody to a lab test. Or do we only subject the people you think look different?
The 2 genders cover over 99% of natural cases.
The current discourse of gender dysphoria is about using these highly unusual outlier cases to overturn long-standing rational norms and push a year zero agenda that is negatively affecting and destabilizing young people.
The current discourse is about empathy and compassion for these people. Your friends hunt them down online, where they try to find community of other similar people and express themselves and share themselves. Then your friends try to humiliate them in front of a larger more mainstream audience for political gain. Sometimes leading to direct harm to these people. Is that your God's way?
Let's make an imaginary friend we can call Pat. Pat was born with a vagina and XY chromosome. That 3rd gender you have named grey zone. When Pat was little Pat looked like a little girl. In elementary school Pat went to the girls bathroom and played tennis with girls. In high school Pat took on more masculine features. Pat is starting to look like a young man. Do we take Pat to a lab for testing so scientists can tell Pat what bathroom Pat belongs in and who Pat can play tennis with? Or do we just say to Pat, hey, go to the bathroom where you fill most comfortable. Play tennis with the people you feel most comfortable. That's my way.
The "XY chromosome" claim also comes from ONE guy from the IBA who stated it. The actual organization doesn't make any claims about chromosomes, only says she failed a test for elevated testosterone (the results of which haven't been shown to anybody). There's also the complication that a lot of other organizations (including the IOC) think the IBA is untrustworthy and corrupt, so it's hard to say what is true here. Khelif had competed in women's tournaments before, including the previous Olympics when testing for testosterone levels would have been in place. She has a good record (good enough to make the Olympics), but not a dominant one. She didn't medal in the previous Games.Cal88 said:dajo9 said:dajo9 said:It's really a shame the Olympics allowed Khelif to box in the woman's group. The issue of trans rights is so much bigger than athletic competitions but nothing does more to hurt the cause of trans rights than allowing these kinds of things to happen. The right pounces on these issues of athletics and gains support for all kinds of anti-trans rhetoric and beliefs. My friends on the left need to get realistic about the limits of transgender people being involved in athletic competitions. Then we can move onto the more important matters in the transgender community.Cal88 said:movielover said:This may be the most powerful meme to come out of the Paris Olympics - even more powerful than the Santic open ceremonies. This is the future for America if we don't stop Kamala Harris and her dangerous Marxist agenda. h/t @grandoldmemes pic.twitter.com/CmVzSMitG3
— @amuse (@amuse) August 1, 2024
I guess this is what you are referring to here:An absolute travesty at the Olympics.
— End Wokeness (@EndWokeness) August 1, 2024
Angela Carini is forced to box against a biological male. She quits after just 45 seconds, and cries hysterically as her opponent is declared the winner.
Don't look away. This is wokeness. pic.twitter.com/wOkVRs88t5
I have to edit this comment as I have read more about this situation. I should have known better than to take a Cal88 post at face value.
Imane Khelif was born and assigned female at birth. She is not transgender, which is illegal in Algeria. This situation has nothing to do with the issue of being transgender. It seems like a very complicated situation and I feel badly that Khelif is going through all this. How do you define a woman?
Imane Khelif was disqualified by the International Boxing Association from an international boxing tournament last year for having XY chromozones and elevated levels of testosterone.
She's most likely not trans, there are pictures of her as a little girl where she does look like, well, a little girl, but she presents a rare case of intersex where she has male genetic characteristics and unusually high levels of testosterone.
You have to feel bad for Khelif as her condition is probably natural and not boosted/juiced, but this being said, is it fair to her opponents? The IBA said no, while the IOC said yes. I tend to agree with the former, but this being said, the memes and outrages are a bit uncalled for given Khelif's seems like a case of an honest woman who did not cheat to get there.
Grey zone.
Already done:dajo9 said:
Angela Carisi owes Khelif an apology for her poor sportsmanship after the fight
NEW—Unbelievable! Another day at the Paris Olympics and another MAN just pummeled and abused a WOMAN in a boxing match.
— Charlie Kirk (@charliekirk11) August 2, 2024
Taiwans Lin Yu-Ting, a man who failed a gender test and was barred from competing in the 2023 World Championships, left Uzbekistan’s Sitora Turdibekova on the… pic.twitter.com/7CH8semKmO
sycasey said:Already done:dajo9 said:
Angela Carisi owes Khelif an apology for her poor sportsmanship after the fight
https://www.bbc.com/sport/olympics/articles/c2j3jg51rg4o
movielover said:
Ridiculous. Wokeism.
dajo9 said:movielover said:
Ridiculous. Wokeism.
Why do you hate God?
sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
Read my post above:oski003 said:sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
An international sports governing body says Khelif is XY. You say it is unclear. It is relevant here. My understanding is based on them being XY.
dimitrig said:sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
Neither of these women have dominated the competition like the fear mongering right would have you believe.
Lin Yu-ting is 19-5 and has never won by KO
Imane Khelif is 42-9 with 6 wins by KO
They obviously can and have been beaten by women. Should we be suspicious of all the women that beat them, too?
Great comment from Reddit about the truth behind the Imane Khelif situation pic.twitter.com/jodnx0FImS
— Babble (@Babble____) August 2, 2024
oski003 said:dimitrig said:sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
Neither of these women have dominated the competition like the fear mongering right would have you believe.
Lin Yu-ting is 19-5 and has never won by KO
Imane Khelif is 42-9 with 6 wins by KO
They obviously can and have been beaten by women. Should we be suspicious of all the women that beat them, too?
Does this mean we shouldn't test a professional athlete for steroids unless they are the best player in their sport?
sycasey said:
Further detail on why I think the IBA testing is murky. The Russian leadership of the organization seemed to have self-serving reasons for disqualifying Khelif.Great comment from Reddit about the truth behind the Imane Khelif situation pic.twitter.com/jodnx0FImS
— Babble (@Babble____) August 2, 2024
Doesn't automatically make them wrong, but I'm not just going to take their word for it at this point.
Quote:
The "XY chromosome" claim also comes from ONE guy from the IBA who stated it. The actual organization doesn't make any claims about chromosomes, only says she failed a test for elevated testosterone (the results of which haven't been shown to anybody).
Cal88 said:
You're also wrong about this, the IBA test that failed Khelif was not based on elevated testosterone levels, which implies that she did fail the XY chromozone test.
bearister said:
Not one guy from Cal on the Gold Medal winning rowing team based in Oakland. Sad.
Olympic - USRowing
https://usrowing.org/teams/olympic?gender=men&page=1#paginated-list
dimitrig said:oski003 said:dimitrig said:sycasey said:
Lin Yu-Ting seems to be in the same situation as Khelif: born as a girl, always lived as a woman, might have XY chromosomes or some other intersex condition but it's unclear.
Neither of these women have dominated the competition like the fear mongering right would have you believe.
Lin Yu-ting is 19-5 and has never won by KO
Imane Khelif is 42-9 with 6 wins by KO
They obviously can and have been beaten by women. Should we be suspicious of all the women that beat them, too?
Does this mean we shouldn't test a professional athlete for steroids unless they are the best player in their sport?
It means that these statements that "someone's going to get hurt" and "XYZ was pummeled by a man" are just fear mongering. Women can and have beaten them and they have boxed for years without anyone being seriously hurt by them.
We can argue about whether they have an advantage over other women, but it's not an overwhelming advantage like if we were putting Floyd Mayweather in the ring with women.
Spend a decade training. Counting every calorie. Measuring every vital. Getting 8.15 hours of sleep every night.
— Trung Phan (@TrungTPhan) August 3, 2024
Only to lose out on an Olympic medal because your dong wasn’t tucked. Devastating.
pic.twitter.com/zuRFVC50h5
THREE gold medals for Summer McIntosh 🥇🥇🥇
— Rob Williams (@RobTheHockeyGuy) August 3, 2024
Great come-from-behind win by Canada’s Olympic star pic.twitter.com/wQBwxBiMIn
Summer McIntosh becomes the first Canadian to ever win 3 gold medals at a single summer olympics. 🥇🥇🥇 pic.twitter.com/2BM1SIppOT
— theScore (@theScore) August 3, 2024
LIKE. A. BOSS! pic.twitter.com/amcguHQhNi
— Joe G (@EastEndJoe) August 3, 2024
