Eh? One was explicitly a pro-Trump group. Trump is the president and thus the establishment.Anarchistbear said:
People try to weaponize insurrections by party but the only thing they had in common is they were both aimed at the political establishment.
Impeachment #2 Thread
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Last: 3 yr ago by BearForce2
Not so much brave as practical. Who was going to protect me? If the police spoke to either guy it would have made them even more schizoid. I am hyper vigilant by nature, but that would not have done much good if the Sgt. Barry Sadler dude had decided to foreclose on his threat.
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dajo9 said:LunchTime said:
Sorry this is so long, but in a forum that isnt a bunch of randoms, I want to be more clear than short posts will allow.
Let me start by saying this is obviously the worst that has happened in the last decade at least. But in ten years will it be the first shot, or last shot? In my mind that answer starts to come around with a trial on this impeachment.
But; The idea that this is a single thing caused by Trump is absurdism. This type of political violence has been on steadily on the rise for a long time. Hell, when Trump was inaugurated, they had running riots through DC. If you dont POWERFULLY denounce the political violence of ALL sides as it happens, it emboldens political violence as a legitimate tool to achieve political goals.
Continuously, for the second half of 2020 we had literal insurrection in the form of lawless "Autonomous zones" around the country with no denunciation from the "left." We had police stations burning down. We had attacks on federal Court Houses all summer with the "left" blaming the people tasked with protecting our court houses. The Vice President of the United States (in 7 days) was tweeting support for those arrested enacting that violence, raising money to get them back on the streets.
And the left was supportive. Refusing to denounce the violence because it was just a "small group" in a mostly peaceful protest. OF COURSE it will escalate. There was no way that wide spread political violence being labeled "mostly peaceful protests" would not escalate.
The sickening thing is that even in this thread, with smart people, you see it as a one way street. As though your side had "the most perfect protests. Big beautiful protests. The most peaceful protests!" and it isnt true, and until we start calling out this political violence out when we see it, we may be able to push the other side underground for a while, but we cant slow it down or stop it. BLM riots all summer were ****ed up. Period. Maybe you agree with the cause, but that agreement blinded 100% of the non right leaning media to handwave the near constant rioting and looting as irrelevant, and push to bail those people out of jail...
And dont bull**** yourself. The people getting bailed out are criminals. VERY few people are held long enough to need bail, and those that are, are charged because there is evidence. They are who needed bail because they had serious charges against them...
I think its obvious Trumps speech incited this most recent violence. That they went chanting "Hang Mike Pence" shows that... But was it worse than this type of speech advocating direct assault on government officials? Is it "OK" because "your side" said it? Where is the outrage when the nazi tactics of forcing people to do your parties salute at a restaurant? You cant even find moderate news outlets reporting on it, and there is video. If you can excuse this ****, you dont want to solve the problem of political violence, you just want to monopolize it. It is a two way street. If you are too blind to see that this is just a next step in the evolution of political violence, you are saying its not the last step, its just another step.
Trump should be convicted and banned from office. NO agenda that Biden or the democrats have should supersede the need (at least to attempt) to definitively say "This is too far, you dont get to hold office again." If you think bail out checks or ACA or whatever small potato things they have scheduled for the first hundred days is more important than protecting our democracy and constitution, I think you are nuts.
Nobody is surprised that 10,000 Trumpers were willing to commit violence against Congress. I'm sure you can find 10,000 leftists willing to commit violence against Trump. Both need to be appropriately policed.
What is the historical outrage here is that there was obviously enough government / police support for the Capitol attack that they actually succeeded in taking over the building and nearly had the opportunity to assassinate their political enemies.
If you can't see that difference then you are blind, probably willfully.
I have to disagree with this to some extent. It is becoming more and more likely that this was not 10k violent Trumpers becoming a mob. It is sounding more like this was a planned terrorist attack using the cover of a mob. That is how federal law enforcement is treating it at this point.
It is also looking like there were a few Republican Congresspersons who were either dangerously duped into providing support or were out and out complicit. 3 named by one of the terrorist leaders, one live tweeting, unknown number giving tours in the days leading up, including the private tunnels, when all tours had been banned due to Covid.
"Honest, occifer, I knew nothing about it."
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tRump did the same thing to the hacker Michael Cohen hired at tRump's request to fix an online poll regarding impactful businessmen. Cohen's book is a delightful read. Of the ten or so books I read relating to tRump after he became POTUS, it is the one I looked the most forward to cracking open each day. To call tRump a piece of the foulest human garbage would be a significant upgrade. He is a f@ucking demon.
*Anyone that provides services to tRump on account is a moron. The upfront money is the last dime you will ever see from him.
*Anyone that provides services to tRump on account is a moron. The upfront money is the last dime you will ever see from him.
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OaktownBear said:dajo9 said:LunchTime said:
Sorry this is so long, but in a forum that isnt a bunch of randoms, I want to be more clear than short posts will allow.
Let me start by saying this is obviously the worst that has happened in the last decade at least. But in ten years will it be the first shot, or last shot? In my mind that answer starts to come around with a trial on this impeachment.
But; The idea that this is a single thing caused by Trump is absurdism. This type of political violence has been on steadily on the rise for a long time. Hell, when Trump was inaugurated, they had running riots through DC. If you dont POWERFULLY denounce the political violence of ALL sides as it happens, it emboldens political violence as a legitimate tool to achieve political goals.
Continuously, for the second half of 2020 we had literal insurrection in the form of lawless "Autonomous zones" around the country with no denunciation from the "left." We had police stations burning down. We had attacks on federal Court Houses all summer with the "left" blaming the people tasked with protecting our court houses. The Vice President of the United States (in 7 days) was tweeting support for those arrested enacting that violence, raising money to get them back on the streets.
And the left was supportive. Refusing to denounce the violence because it was just a "small group" in a mostly peaceful protest. OF COURSE it will escalate. There was no way that wide spread political violence being labeled "mostly peaceful protests" would not escalate.
The sickening thing is that even in this thread, with smart people, you see it as a one way street. As though your side had "the most perfect protests. Big beautiful protests. The most peaceful protests!" and it isnt true, and until we start calling out this political violence out when we see it, we may be able to push the other side underground for a while, but we cant slow it down or stop it. BLM riots all summer were ****ed up. Period. Maybe you agree with the cause, but that agreement blinded 100% of the non right leaning media to handwave the near constant rioting and looting as irrelevant, and push to bail those people out of jail...
And dont bull**** yourself. The people getting bailed out are criminals. VERY few people are held long enough to need bail, and those that are, are charged because there is evidence. They are who needed bail because they had serious charges against them...
I think its obvious Trumps speech incited this most recent violence. That they went chanting "Hang Mike Pence" shows that... But was it worse than this type of speech advocating direct assault on government officials? Is it "OK" because "your side" said it? Where is the outrage when the nazi tactics of forcing people to do your parties salute at a restaurant? You cant even find moderate news outlets reporting on it, and there is video. If you can excuse this ****, you dont want to solve the problem of political violence, you just want to monopolize it. It is a two way street. If you are too blind to see that this is just a next step in the evolution of political violence, you are saying its not the last step, its just another step.
Trump should be convicted and banned from office. NO agenda that Biden or the democrats have should supersede the need (at least to attempt) to definitively say "This is too far, you dont get to hold office again." If you think bail out checks or ACA or whatever small potato things they have scheduled for the first hundred days is more important than protecting our democracy and constitution, I think you are nuts.
Nobody is surprised that 10,000 Trumpers were willing to commit violence against Congress. I'm sure you can find 10,000 leftists willing to commit violence against Trump. Both need to be appropriately policed.
What is the historical outrage here is that there was obviously enough government / police support for the Capitol attack that they actually succeeded in taking over the building and nearly had the opportunity to assassinate their political enemies.
If you can't see that difference then you are blind, probably willfully.
I have to disagree with this to some extent. It is becoming more and more likely that this was not 10k violent Trumpers becoming a mob. It is sounding more like this was a planned terrorist attack using the cover of a mob. That is how federal law enforcement is treating it at this point.
It is also looking like there were a few Republican Congresspersons who were either dangerously duped into providing support or were out and out complicit. 3 named by one of the terrorist leaders, one live tweeting, unknown number giving tours in the days leading up, including the private tunnels, when all tours had been banned due to Covid.
I don't know what you are disagreeing with. We are saying the same thing.
"They're eating the pets"
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3 time Republican nominee for President
going4roses said:
That's a great read. I was thinking earlier today the current national mood is very much "Trump in the bunker". He's been cut off from his preferred social media, the world is moving on regardless of him. Hell, even the military that reports to him has stated Biden will be inaugurated.
Trump is in the bunker. Going mad. Ordering around lawyers that have long ago ceased to be operational. Plotting an impossible comeback before his real demise.
Couldn't happen to a better guy.
"They're eating the pets"
3 time Republican nominee for President
3 time Republican nominee for President
In hindsight, tRump Lite's ex wife made a solid move bailing on him and the Crime Family early in the game. She gladly surrendered her spot to Guilfoyle.
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Can't recall if this has been posted here, but this is what I hear when people conflate the riots/looting that were coincident with fully justified BLM protests and the coordinated, POTUS incited attack on the seat of power at the federal government. I don't believe any of these people would treat a coordinated attack by domestic terrorists to assassinate a Republican POTUS the way they are treating this event. I'm not that surprised any more.
dajo9 said:
If you come for the Queen, you best not miss
One day, Pelosi will have the most prominent memorial on the Washington National Mall, and
I LOOK FORWARD TO THAT!
Only one statue on the National Mall depicts a female historic figure Eleanor Roosevelt, tucked away in an alcove near the Tidal Basin.
The Vietnam Women's Memorial opened in 1993 as the first monument on the National Mall dedicated to women's military service, honoring thousands of female veterans.
Out of 160 monuments and memorials gracing the nation's capital, just over 50 sculptures include female figures.
One of those statues is in the Capitol Rotunda: "Portrait Monument" of (left to right, below) Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Susan B. Anthony, and Lucretia Mott. I know this one because in my genealogy research (personal hobby) I discovered that Lucretia ("1st feminist") Coffin (Mott) is my 3rd cousin, 7 generations removed. We are both descended from Tristram Coffin, who settled on Nantucket in 1659 as one of the original purchasers. Another famous American who is descended from Tristram: Benjamin Franklin was his gg grandson, and is my 1st cousin, 10x removed.
No doubt. I thought about that some time ago, too.bearister said:
In hindsight, tRump Lite's ex wife made a solid move bailing on him and the Crime Family early in the game. She gladly surrendered her spot to Guilfoyle.
Good call!
golden sloth said:
There needs to be some sort of punishment for Trump, but I dont want impeachment to impair congress' ability to pass legislation during the new session....
I accept your proposed solution that Trump be required to walk the plank.
Oh, damn you. I've been thinking this about Pelosi for a long time now (since first impeachment and due to her being first female Speaker), but I see you beat me to it in posting the idea. Well, that merely means that there are surely A LOT of people who are already plotting about an appropriate memorial for her. I like your proposed pose!dajo9 said:
If it were up to me, I would replace the Andrew Jackson statue in Lafayette Square with a statue of Nancy Pelosi crafted after this picture, finger pointing directly at the White House
He's #1 on my Ignore List.blungld said:
Every post by BF2 needs to be flagged.
He is everything that is wrong with the internet and is part of the dangerous disinformation dissemination. He makes no attempt to engage in dialogue or conversation or learn or change and instead is just another node, albeit ineffectual, on the domestic terrorist network.
I would like to see him permanently removed from BI. We don't need to be tolerant of his types any longer. They all went too far and now need to be held to account everywhere. To hopefully go sober up somewhere if that is possible. This goes for others here too, but he is the worst offender.
It works.
Considering what the facial recognition software has identified, I don't think he's licking.AunBear89 said:
Actual photo of BearFarce:
I think he's been shoved to the floor and simultaneously getting his face kicked in.
As it's broadcast live, nationwide, and preserved forever in the Congressional Record.okaydo said:
Idiots.
She is featured in this article as a follower of Josh Hawley's criminal crusade.
Greene alleged there was fraud or mismanagement in her home state's presidential election but that her own vote tally remains accurate. "I think our secretary of state has failed Georgia," Greene said Monday. "I believe our elections should be decertified." She does not, however, think her race should be decertified.
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/pro-trump-republican-freshmen-who-joined-josh-hawley-s-election-ncna1253634
golden sloth said:okaydo said:You think this is just going to go away after Jan.20?golden sloth said:
There needs to be some sort of punishment for Trump, but I dont want impeachment to impair congress' ability to pass legislation during the new session. Passing legislation should the first priority, not exercising past demons.
No, but I do think it would be better to focus on the job at hand, and ways to improve the lives of Americans rather than start something that is certainly going to turn into a media circus.
I want my senators from california to spend their time passing legislation establishing voting rights, taking effective action on climate change, slashing the military budget, reinvesting in national infrastructure, establishing transparency measures and codifying the norms of the president and helping the roll out of the vaccine. They finally have power, I'd rather they use that power to pass legislation rather than squander it with a media circus that would be impeachment, when the person you want to impeach is no longer in office. Power is fleeting, when you have it, you should use it.
I believe the goal should be meaningful legislation.
Anarchistbear said:
Trump is now the Goat. Impeached twice, removed zero but he still has time for the 3peat.
The opposite of a G.O.A.T. (greatest of all time) is a T.O.A.D (terrible on any day).
You'd better just hope that BI mgmt isn't MAGA because they have your IP address and email address, and maybe even your phone #. Any of those 3 should be enough.NYCGOBEARS said:
This forum is so under moderated, I wouldn't be surprised if MAGAt are using DM's on here to coordinate attacks.
I'm kidding. Kind of.
concordtom said:dajo9 said:
If you come for the Queen, you best not miss
One day, Pelosi will have the most prominent memorial on the Washington National Mall, and
I LOOK FORWARD TO THAT!
Only one statue on the National Mall depicts a female historic figure Eleanor Roosevelt, tucked away in an alcove near the Tidal Basin.
The Vietnam Women's Memorial opened in 1993 as the first monument on the National Mall dedicated to women's military service, honoring thousands of female veterans.
Out of 160 monuments and memorials gracing the nation's capital, just over 50 sculptures include female figures.
One of those statues is in the Capitol Rotunda: "Portrait Monument" of (left to right, below) Elizabeth Cady Stanton, Susan B. Anthony, and Lucretia Mott. I know this one because in my genealogy research (personal hobby) I discovered that Lucretia ("1st feminist") Coffin (Mott) is my 3rd cousin, 7 generations removed. We are both descended from Tristram Coffin, who settled on Nantucket in 1659 as one of the original purchasers. Another famous American who is descended from Tristram: Benjamin Franklin was his gg grandson, and is my 1st cousin, 10x removed.
Lucretia Coffin sounds like a name many a goth girl in my time would have liked to have been born with.
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I bet she was a hot hussy about 60 years before this photo was taken.
64% of Republicans said they support Trump's recent behavior.
57% of Republicans said Trump should be the 2024 GOP candidate.
Only 17% think he should be removed from office. Axios
*And we are supposed to be wringing our hands worrying about doing things that p@iss these people off and perpetuate divisiveness? They are brazen and incorrigible.
57% of Republicans said Trump should be the 2024 GOP candidate.
Only 17% think he should be removed from office. Axios
*And we are supposed to be wringing our hands worrying about doing things that p@iss these people off and perpetuate divisiveness? They are brazen and incorrigible.
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bearister said:
64% of Republicans said they support Trump's recent behavior.
57% of Republicans said Trump should be the 2024 GOP candidate.
Only 17% think he should be removed from office. Axios
*And we are supposed to be wringing our hands worrying about doing things that p@iss these people off and perpetuate divisiveness? They are brazen and incorrigible.
Yep that's one of the 64 million dollar questions... and then what
bearister said:
64% of Republicans said they support Trump's recent behavior.
57% of Republicans said Trump should be the 2024 GOP candidate.
Only 17% think he should be removed from office. Axios
*And we are supposed to be wringing our hands worrying about doing things that p@iss these people off and perpetuate divisiveness? They are brazen and incorrigible.
This argument by Republicans that they should not impeach/convict for the sake of unity and not to inflame people is total bullshyte. Bottom line, our side is going to be massively ticked off if he is not convicted. We will be every bit as inflamed. There is no unity. The question is do you tick off the criminals or the law abiding.
They are trying to find one last off ramp to thread the needle between keeping White supremacists in their voting base by finding one last excuse not to do the right thing that they think reasonable people will swallow
Republicans love to call for unity while doing absolutely nothing to appease Democrats on anything Democrats want. If they want to keep losing Millennials and suburban voters for years to come they should definitely let Trump skate. McConnell seems to realize this eventuality. It remains to be seen how many of his Republican compatriots do.
I have been a long time lurker and like all of us been an ardent fan of Cal football which is what unites us here, but lately as an Independent I am fed up with all the divisiveness that's tearing this country apart. So I am compelled to speak out. And I am not so naive to think that what's going on around us is all an accident. If you guys have half a brain (wisdom isn't the same thing as knowledge), you'd realize that this is a takeover of America by forces we can't see, and both the Republicans and Democrats are all in this together.
The Antifa protester John Sullivan was caught bragging about posing as a Trump supporter and breaking the windows at the Capitol and was just arrested by the FBI. There's more to this story than we think.
I moved to CA for college 30 years ago and ended up staying but it's not the same state that I remember anymore. I'm moving out as soon as I can. And I'm disappointed in the elite attitude of so many of my fellow alumni from Cal that it makes me sick to my stomach. Half the country can't be all racists, right??? All I ask is be open minded and try to see things from the other side's perspective. I was always a moderate but seeing the left be so close-minded and intolerant is driving me toward the right. So long California! I will miss you (actually no, the one I miss has disappeared long ago already).
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2021/01/robert-ringer/totalitarianism-is-upon-us/
The Antifa protester John Sullivan was caught bragging about posing as a Trump supporter and breaking the windows at the Capitol and was just arrested by the FBI. There's more to this story than we think.
I moved to CA for college 30 years ago and ended up staying but it's not the same state that I remember anymore. I'm moving out as soon as I can. And I'm disappointed in the elite attitude of so many of my fellow alumni from Cal that it makes me sick to my stomach. Half the country can't be all racists, right??? All I ask is be open minded and try to see things from the other side's perspective. I was always a moderate but seeing the left be so close-minded and intolerant is driving me toward the right. So long California! I will miss you (actually no, the one I miss has disappeared long ago already).
https://www.lewrockwell.com/2021/01/robert-ringer/totalitarianism-is-upon-us/
There is indeed, but not in the way that you think. Sullivan was already getting kicked out of left-wing protest groups because they found his methods dangerous and his motives suspicious.calSB said:
The Antifa protester John Sullivan was caught bragging about posing as a Trump supporter and breaking the windows at the Capitol and was just arrested by the FBI. There's more to this story than we think.
I think that article you posted claiming that Jon Ossoff and Raphael Warnock are "Marxists" and that Democrats cheated to win the election (presented without evidence) is not worthy of comment.
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