ducky23 said:dimitrig said:ducky23 said:
In my mind, the move to the ACC is always going to be a temp thing (until the ACC implodes or whatever other realignment thing happens).
But I assume the plan is that the ACC at least gives us a P4 home for the time being. And in the short term, we all need to up our game (we can't just rely on sebastabear and a few others to carry the load) and Cal needs to start winning. To the point where when the next realignment comes up, we have a little more leverage
Until then, the ACC is a fine home. It's a better academic conference than the BIG, it gives us a better chance to succeed and the road trips are way better.
Sure but out of the frying pan and into the fire? We need to lean on getting into the B1G and use the ACC as leverage.
This is a tangent but why do you think the ACC is a better academic conference? I have not given it much thought but they seem the same if not the B1G slightly better - and that was before adding UCLA, Washington, and USC.
I'm not including ucla et al cause if you do that, then you can presumably add furd/cal to the ACC and it would cancel them out.
But let's just compare the top half
Duke
Notre Dame (If they get to vote, they count)
Virginia
UNC
GT
BC
Northwestern
Michigan
Wisconsin
Rutgers
Illinois
Um Maryland I guess?
Not even close
How do you measure academic quality? Most rankings certainly don't. US News, for example, includes metrics such as graduate indebtedness, class size, faculty compensation, and alumni giving rate, none of which has an obvious connection to "academic quality", even if you could precisely define such an amorphous thing. It also includes academic reputation (20% of the ranking), which is a circular measure that preserves the status quo regardless of actual quality.
Since we're talking about research universities, probably the best measure of performance is money spent on research and development, which is a proxy for research output. This is the metric that research university presidents care most about. Here are the Big Ten and ACC schools in the top 50:
Big Ten
3. Michigan
8. Wisconsin
12. Ohio State
17. Maryland
22. Minnesota
30. Northwestern
37. Illinois
39. Michigan State
40. Indiana
41. Purdue
45. Rutgers
50. Iowa
ACC
11. Duke
13. UNC
20. Georgia Tech
48. Virginia
Cal and Stanford fit better in the Big Ten IMO. Not that it really matters since the Big Ten doesn't seem willing to take either.
FWIW, Washington is 5, UCLA is 6, Stanford is 9, USC is 28, Cal is 32 (no medical school), and Oregon is 149 (which is pretty abysmal even for a university without a med school, and is lower than all Big Ten and ACC schools except for Boston College).
Source: https://ncsesdata.nsf.gov/profiles/site?method=rankingBySource&ds=herd