OT: Trump/Russians/Robert Mueller

Unit2Sucks
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Sure, let's move on. As good a time as any to focus on the fact that the rats have begun to turn on each other in the white house.
Cal88
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Yeah, it's not exactly a comfortable topic, you were just digging deeper and deeper into that hole there U2S.

But it's worth bringing up the Clintons here to demonstrate the kind of double standard that exists among Trump haters, who have great difficulty acknowledging what the Clintons have been getting away with, just to bring up their own Russian dossier, which is quite real.


sp4149;842862249 said:

I suggest you need to investigate why Trump and his lawyers do not want Mueller investigating his financing of real estate in NY. Deutsche Bank was the only bank lending him money and it was hundreds of millions and it was money not being invested in Eastern Europe, but in NYC which is why Trump is likely to be vulnerable in New York state criminal proceedings. Trump and family were in need of 'alternative' financing after he stiffed much of Wall Street. He got 'special financing' from 'special sources'. He helped, directly or indirectly, laundering of money from sources subject to US sanctions. His sons admitted to getting money directly from Russians. Not the same thing as my Wells Fargo mortgage; I haven't seen any reports of Wells Fargo laundering Russian money.


Wells Fargo has been engaged in fraudulent activities, it doesn't mean that their clients should be tainted. You've linked Trump to EE money laundring just because the local bank he's dealing with, with which he's had a 20yr relationship through its Bankers Trust affiliate, has engaged in improprieties in EE. How exactly does his Deutsche loan constitutes "special financing from special sources"?

IIRC, his son stated that they had a lot Russians clients among their condo buyers, which is not surprising given that they have been a prominent segment in high-end real estate markets like NYC, London or the south of France, especially for the type of gaudy pads that Trump loves to peddle. You're implying by innuendo some kind of impropriety in the purchase of Trump high-end condos by Russians.
dajo9
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Cal88;842862285 said:

Yeah, it's not exactly a comfortable topic, you were just digging deeper and deeper into that hole there U2S.

But it's worth bringing up the Clintons here to demonstrate the kind of double standard that exists among Trump haters, who have great difficulty acknowledging what the Clintons have been getting away with, just to bring up their own Russian dossier, which is quite real.




Wells Fargo has been engaged in fraudulent activities, it doesn't mean that their clients should be tainted. You've linked Trump to EE money laundring just because the local bank he's dealing with, with which he's had a 20yr relationship through its Bankers Trust affiliate, has engaged in improprieties in EE. How exactly does his Deutsche loan constitutes "special financing from special sources"?

IIRC, his son stated that they had a lot Russians clients among their condo buyers, which is not surprising given that they have been a prominent segment in high-end real estate markets like NYC, London or the south of France, especially for the type of gaudy pads that Trump loves to peddle. You're implying by innuendo some kind of impropriety in the purchase of Trump high-end condos by Russians.


The Trumps then lied about it. It will all come out in the investigations. No point in debating with you details that neither of us know.
Unit2Sucks
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Cal88;842862285 said:

Yeah, it's not exactly a comfortable topic, you were just digging deeper and deeper into that hole there U2S.

But it's worth bringing up the Clintons here to demonstrate the kind of double standard that exists among Trump haters, who have great difficulty acknowledging what the Clintons have been getting away with, just to bring up their own Russian dossier, which is quite real.


There is nothing uncomfortable to me about discussing right wing fraudulent claims about Uranium and the Clintons.

I normally don't post stupid memes, but this one sure seems to apply to Cal88.

Cal88
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Unit2Sucks;842862319 said:

There is nothing uncomfortable to me about discussing right wing fraudulent claims about Uranium and the Clintons.

I normally don't post stupid memes, but this one sure seems to apply to Cal88.



Aren't you just a little bit uncomfortable characterizing the facts documented on the Clintons' uranium deal with the Russians by the NY Times as "fraudulent right wing claims"?

My other sources above, the Nation and Salon, must also be in on it, I guess Hillary's Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy really gets around.

PS - what's your chess rating?
jyamada
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Cal88;842862358 said:

Aren't you just a little bit uncomfortable characterizing the facts documented on the Clintons' uranium deal with the Russians by the NY Times as "fraudulent right wing claims"?

My other sources above, the Nation and Salon, must also be in on it, I guess Hillary's Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy really gets around.

PS - what's your chess rating?


The NY Times article used Clinton Cash as a source for its "facts" which was later found to be "strong on allegations but weak on facts" by much of the MSM.
sycasey
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Cal88;842862358 said:

My other sources above, the Nation and Salon, must also be in on it, I guess Hillary's Vast Right-Wing Conspiracy really gets around.


The Nation story is about the DNC leak, not Clinton corruption.
sp4149
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Many of us suspect that The Grump has been loose with the facts about his connections with Russia;
Especially denying any Russian involvements. His fear of Mueller investigating his Russian financial dealings
is ongoing. Since February, Bill Moyers has been documenting the Trump/Russia connections. It's a work in progress
and has been growing every week. What started with 24 entries is now a timeline of over 400 events from 1979 to the
present; however only eight are before 2000, so Trump's Russian connections have accelerated in the last few years.

I won't bother summarizing, you can investigate yourself at:

http://billmoyers.com/story/trump-russia-timeline/

I hadn't seen this Bill Moyers timeline before in this thread, however this thread has grown to over
50 pages so it is possible I missed a post sometime earlier. Accept my booth if you
didn't miss an earlier link to the timeline.

FWIW the timeline was last updated three days ago.
dajo9
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With Bannon out, now it gets interesting. Bannon was the voice of the Deplorables and his group probably represents about half of Trump's support within the Republican Party. Bannon could tear this Presidency to shreds from the outside if he wants to. Full on Republican Civil War and party split (with Trump and the establishment Republicans representing the Republican Party and loathing each other - that would be electoral catastrophe for Republicans in 2018). Or Bannon could quietly go into the night. But that doesn't seem to be his style.
OBear073akaSMFan
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dajo9;842862581 said:

With Bannon out, now it gets interesting. Bannon was the voice of the Deplorables and his group probably represents about half of Trump's support within the Republican Party. Bannon could tear this Presidency to shreds from the outside if he wants to. Full on Republican Civil War and party split (with Trump and the establishment Republicans representing the Republican Party and loathing each other - that would be electoral catastrophe for Republicans in 2018). Or Bannon could quietly go into the night. But that doesn't seem to be his style.


one down and who is next? Steven Miller?
BearDevil
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Both Gorka and Miller still need to go.
Unit2Sucks
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BearDevil;842862597 said:

Both Gorka and Miller still need to go.


Yes but Gorka is pretty far down the list after Miller. Gorka doesn't really serve any function in the white house other than apparently being first in line at the White House cafeteria every day. He's a bad guy, don't get me wrong, but I'm not sure if he's as dangerous as someone like Miller.
calbear93
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Unit2Sucks;842862615 said:

Yes but Gorka is pretty far down the list after Miller. Gorka doesn't really serve any function in the white house other than apparently being first in line at the White House cafeteria every day. He's a bad guy, don't get me wrong, but I'm not sure if he's as dangerous as someone like Miller.


I don't think they are going. Miller is more aligned with Sessions than Bannon. I had read that Miller and Gorka had turned on Bannon as well for seeking too much publicity. Who knows what is real and what is not, but it isn't as if they were necessarily hitching their wagon to Bannon.
Unit2Sucks
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calbear93;842862619 said:

I don't think they are going. Miller is more aligned with Sessions than Bannon. I had read that Miller and Gorka had turned on Bannon as well for seeking too much publicity. Who knows what is real and what is not, but it isn't as if they were necessarily hitching their wagon to Bannon.


Yeah, to be clear I think there is no reason to believe either will leave. Gorka has no alternatives - he's purely a blowhard with a fictitious, self-proclaimed expertise. Trump may be the only person who thinks Gorka is credible because he's seen him on Fox News.

The country would be better off without Miller, so I would like to see him out of the white house. Gorka is just a side show.

I will point out the irony of Gorka accusing anyone of seeking publicity. There was a great Samantha Bee episode on Gorka for anyone who isn't familiar with his BS.
NYCGOBEARS
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BearDevil;842862597 said:

Both Gorka and Miller still need to go.

Miller is the Gimp. Trump brings him out of the box when he wants to scare people.
GB54
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There's only one guy who needs to go. There is no reason to believe Kelly will succeed in installing order.
Strykur
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GB54;842862629 said:

There's only one guy who needs to go. There is no reason to believe Kelly will succeed in installing order.


Well he is clearly establishing some control with Mooch and Bannon being tossed.
GB54
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Strykur;842862635 said:

Well he is clearly establishing some control with Mooch and Bannon being tossed.


Until he is tossed
NYCGOBEARS
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Strykur;842862635 said:

Well he is clearly establishing some control with Mooch and Bannon being tossed.

Yeah, only one person in that administration is allowed to talk batshit crazy to major news outlets.
bearister
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Had Gorka been born in the 1930's he would have been on non stop call in central casting at a studio. He would have unlimited work portraying Cold War Era villains on shows like Get Smart and The Man from U.N.C.L.E.
bearister
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Rome Total War now. The only guy with a brain (as evil as it is), will be gunning for the morons.

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/347182-bannon-the-trump-presidency-is-over?amp
blungld
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All the outspoken Trump supporters have been very aggressive and sure of themselves in their attacks on Clinton (why in the world is this their priority?) or their defense of Trump, but when I ask a direct question on these boards I get no answer. Let me try again:

1) Do you still hold that there is "nothing" to the investigation of Trump, that it is an unjustified witch hunt? This in no way justifies an investigation? http://billmoyers.com/story/trump-russia-timeline/

2) Do you still believe that he is doing a good job and that he is good man making the country great again?

3) That he has drained the swamp rather than swamped it with ugly incompetence and moneyed interests?

4) If he is found guilty of collusion, money laundering, espionage, tax evasion, perjury, and/or other crimes associated with a cover up or election fraud, will you call it a Liberal plot or will go on record now saying that if he is found guilty of these things then you were wrong and he is the dishonest, amoral un-American narcissist that we have been warning you about since the campaign? Will you ever look at how you make decisions, the bias you hold, and question your sources of information? Put it down here, is there anything wrong or illegal he can do...or is he always right and are your beliefs implacable?


Months ago I said I thought he would resign or be impeached within the year, and you called me crazy and the result of the Liberal bubble, who lives in the bubble now? Who wants to bet money now?
NYCGOBEARS
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blungld;842862768 said:

All the outspoken Trump supporters have been very aggressive and sure of themselves in their attacks on Clinton (why in the world is this their priority?) or their defense of Trump, but when I ask a direct question on these boards I get no answer. Let me try again:

1) Do you still hold that there is "nothing" to the investigation of Trump, that it is an unjustified witch hunt? This in no way justifies an investigation? http://billmoyers.com/story/trump-russia-timeline/

2) Do you still believe that he is doing a good job and that he is good man making the country great again?

3) That he has drained the swamp rather than swamped it with ugly incompetence and moneyed interests?

4) If he is found guilty of collusion, money laundering, espionage, tax evasion, perjury, and/or other crimes associated with a cover up or election fraud, will you call it a Liberal plot or will go on record now saying that if he is found guilty of these things then you were wrong and he is the dishonest, amoral un-American narcissist that we have been warning you about since the campaign? Will you ever look at how you make decisions, the bias you hold, and question your sources of information? Put it down here, is there anything wrong or illegal he can do...or is he always right and are your beliefs implacable?


Months ago I said I thought he would resign or be impeached within the year, and you called me crazy and the result of the Liberal bubble, who lives in the bubble now? Who wants to bet money now?

Brace yourself for more false equivalency and misdirection. It's the only tool in their toolbox.
blungld
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NYCGOBEARS;842862772 said:

Brace yourself for more false equivalency and misdirection. It's the only tool in their toolbox.


Wanted to give them a chance to go on record with a direct answer. Let's see.
Strykur
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Donald Trump has been an awesome, incredible, resounding, ROARING success as our President, for 2 reasons:

1. Gorsuch is on the Supreme Court.
2. Hillary Clinton is gone, [U]forever[/U].

Bonuses: Democratic Party implosion, booming economy, DPRK backing off, bathing everyday in leftists tears coming from snowflakes on this forum like blungld, NYCGOBEARS, et al.

Donald can go play golf until 2020, I don't care, he's done his part (although he could take a break from tweeting) and thank God his election happened so that all the idiot politicos in this country got a wake up call that the people have had enough of the nonsense coming from DC and that the populist awakening is coming for them. If Trump has to go, Pence can step in and keep it all going. It's a fantastic time in America, and looking forward to our country's future.
NYCGOBEARS
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Strykur;842862781 said:

Donald Trump has been an awesome, incredible, resounding, ROARING success as our President, for 2 reasons:

1. Gorsuch is on the Supreme Court.
2. Hillary Clinton is gone, [U]forever[/U].

Bonuses: Democratic Party implosion, booming economy, DPRK backing off, bathing everyday in leftists tears coming from snowflakes on this forum like blungld, NYCGOBEARS, et al.

Donald can go play golf until 2020, I don't care, he's done his part (although he could take a break from tweeting) and thank God his election happened so that all the idiot politicos in this country got a wake up call that the people have had enough of the nonsense coming from DC and that the populist awakening is coming for them. If Trump has to go, Pence can step in and keep it all going. It's a fantastic time in America, and looking forward to our country's future.

Let's see who wins the long game. No tears here. If you're going to label me a snowflake, would you prefer I refer to you as comrade or volksgenosse?
blungld
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Strykur;842862781 said:

Donald Trump has been an awesome, incredible, resounding, ROARING success as our President, for 2 reasons:

1. Gorsuch is on the Supreme Court.
2. Hillary Clinton is gone, [U]forever[/U].

Bonuses: Democratic Party implosion, booming economy, DPRK backing off, bathing everyday in leftists tears coming from snowflakes on this forum like blungld, NYCGOBEARS, et al.

Donald can go play golf until 2020, I don't care, he's done his part (although he could take a break from tweeting) and thank God his election happened so that all the idiot politicos in this country got a wake up call that the people have had enough of the nonsense coming from DC and that the populist awakening is coming for them. If Trump has to go, Pence can step in and keep it all going. It's a fantastic time in America, and looking forward to our country's future.


So basically you answered only one of the questions.

As a side note, it's pretty gross that you think you win or that it's somehow great when you imagine people who are far smarter and articulate than you like NYC are crying (he's not by the way). Why would you want him to cry? What small little weird ego you have that you would want that for anyone, even metaphorically. Do you see your own ugly?
NYCGOBEARS
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blungld;842862791 said:

So basically you answered only one of the questions.

As a side note, it's pretty gross that you think you win or that it's somehow great when you imagine people who are far smarter and articulate than you like NYC are crying (he's not by the way). Why would you want him to cry? What small little weird ego you have that you would want that for anyone, even metaphorically. Do you see your own ugly?

I did cry after Charlottesville. We all should have.
sycasey
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Strykur;842862781 said:

booming economy


Thanks Obama.
bearister
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Gorsuch will be "performing" at a Trump Hotel for the same reason members of The Rat Pack used to perform at mob owned casino hotels: both owned lock, stock, and barrel by their patrons.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.nydailynews.com/amp/news/politics/justice-gorsuch-speak-trump-hotel-travel-ban-hearing-article-1.3423038

dajo9
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sycasey;842862802 said:

Thanks Obama.


The economy isn't booming, in any case. The trends from Obama's Presidency are continuing - maybe starting to peter out.
Strykur
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blungld;842862791 said:

As a side note, it's pretty gross that you think you win or that it's somehow great when you imagine people who are far smarter and articulate than you like NYC are crying (he's not by the way). Why would you want him to cry? What small little weird ego you have that you would want that for anyone, even metaphorically. Do you see your own ugly?


DBAP - look it up.
sycasey
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Strykur;842862939 said:

DBAP - look it up.


DBAP = Don't Be A P**sy

I think Strykur for adequately representing the maturity level of the base Trump voter.
NYCGOBEARS
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sycasey;842863039 said:

DBAP = Don't Be A P**sy

I think Strykur for adequately representing the maturity level of the base Trump voter.

You can grab one. Just don't be one.
bearister
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/08/19/steve-bannon-go-nuclear-west-wing-democrats-may-start-tv-network/


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